Causes for different warm up rates between engines

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I drove my GF's new Mazda3 around for a few minutes this morning to get it warmed up for its first oil change, and made an interesting observation (well, interesting to me at least
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). Going by the temperature gauge, it seems to warm up a fair bit faster than my Civic.

I drove it out to the freeway, on the same route I take every morning on the way to work. The temp gauge indicated operating temperature nearly a mile sooner than I see in my car. I wasn't noting the actual temperature (although my Scangauge is hooked up to it) and haven't watched that in my car for a while either but I've also observed that the 3 runs hotter than my car by 7 or 8 degF on the highway, and the temperature (on the SG) varies more actively in different driving conditions than in the Civic (which stays pretty stable except in stop and go in hot weather).

This is interesting to me due to some of the differences between the cars. The Civic:

1) Has a physically smaller engine (less metal).
2) Has less cooling system capacity.
3) Has its catalytic converter mounted vertically in front of the engine, directly connected to the head (i.e. lots of heat right next to the engine).

The only explanations I can think of are:

1) Maybe the temp sensor is just in a different spot between the cars? This is easy to look up but I don't have the service manual for the 3 just yet.
2) Maybe the 3's splash guard keeps the engine more insulated from air currents entering from below? (Civic is open on the bottom).
3) The 3 has an extra .5 liters on the Civic and is burning more fuel, which would create more heat. (Seems like the extra coolant capacity would cancel this out though).

Both have all aluminum engines so that's not an issue. Both seem to have their thermostats in the same place in the cooling circuit as well.

To be clear, I'm not proposing there's a problem here. I just would have expected the difference to swing the other way and thought it was interesting.
 
Engine design makes a heat of difference, as does circulation rate, circulation design, and the location of thermostats and measuring devices.

Also, and this may be a factor is some gauges that aren't really gauges..they read low until a temperature is reached, normal for a fair way, and then high thereafter. The normal is actually a band, represented as a line.
 
Being privy to driving a number of different cars, I can say that warm up rates vary a decent amount. However, newer cars (2000 and newer) warm up quite a bit faster than the older cars. I think by design, they try to get it to operating temp as fast as possible, so it can go into closed loop operation.

Other factors included in faster warm up are higher compression engines, thinner block/head castings, thinner oils, leaner fuel mixtures, catalytic converters bolted directly to exhaust manifolds, and precise spark timings.
 
My car has a small heat exchanger sandwiched between the oil filter and the block. This heat exchanger functions as an oil warmer below normal oil operating temperature and as an oil cooler at above normal oil temperatures.
 
The gauges on both of these cars are damped, judging by what I've seen on the SG vs the guage. I've had the Civic almost 30 degrees hotter than normal cruising after a spirited hill climb gave way to stop and go traffic on one occasion, and the gauge was still in its normal position.


Originally Posted By: AcuraTech

Other factors included in faster warm up are higher compression engines, thinner block/head castings, thinner oils, leaner fuel mixtures, catalytic converters bolted directly to exhaust manifolds, and precise spark timings.


That's why what I'm seeing is surprising to me. I'm not sure about the differences in casting thickness, fuel mixture, or spark timing precision between the cars. But in this case the cars have the same viscosity oil, and the one with higher compression (10.5:1 vs 9.7:1) and with the cat bolted to the head is warming up slower.

Actually because of the fact that the Civic seems to run at a more stable temperature and the 3 seems to vary easily with throttle and road conditions I'm wondering if the ECT sensors are located at different spots in the circuit. I'll have to look around under the hood, or wait until I get the service manual for the 3 next week.
 
My TL warms up exceptionally fast....with the heater off. With the heater on, heater fan off, but with the extra volume of water in the system, it takes about twice as long to warm up. I think water volume in the block has a lot to do with it. Aluminum block/head should warm up faster. If I get in and drive right away which rarely happens, on a 40 degree morning, it's up to full operating temp in less than 1.5 miles.

The GN takes about 15 minutes, about the time I get to work. I'm paying special attention with the new aluminum heads when I get it running.
 
Water has a high specific heat, that's why its used a little does a lot, so I think that's the biggest variable coolant volume. Next aluminium transfer heat well and should warm faster than iron/steel which should take the longest. Things like headers can pull a lot of heat out of head and put it in engine compartment, but wraps on those headers can over heat heads and warp them. Probably a small but noticable effect is engine driven fan/always on always blowing cooling air vs. electric fan on/off as needed, and really on only when coolant is really hot and thus so is the engine.
 
jldcol, not only do headers increase warm up time, so does anything else that reduces exhaust backpressure. I know that because after I put a complete catback on my Saturn, the temperature needle is slower to rise. I still have my factory iron manifold and closely attached catalytic converter.
 
Gas mileage will also affect warm ups. The lower the mileage, the more gas burned, the more heat produced.
 
Compression, gear ratio, condition of the thermostat, engine's power/heatsink ratio, etc.

1.6L in a Corolla can warm up within 2 blocks from my home, a 1.8L Integra in about 5 blocks, and a Ford Taurus in about 20 blocks.
 
I have headers that are Jet Hot Coated and a free flowing dual exhaust, and a carburetor, guess that is why it takes a little while longer to warm up in the winter time.

I think I will be driving this El Camino in the warmer weather.
 
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