Can you fry a battery with CTEK Stage 6? Or does that help it

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Sep 6, 2020
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Presently have an Autopart International battery. Was $110 through a shop during service (remove and replace battery, old one was just shot and no good. Low water, low voltage, old, everything. Had to go.) So the new battery is Autopart International. Manufactured by some company I've never heard of, starts with C.. Okay cool.

So, apparently this battery sat for 4 months or so. Decided to top off the charge, since it started and drove, but had sat.. previous to that. On the CTEK MXS 5.0 it goes.

So I put it on overnight, thinking it will reach the first green light - Stage 7 - relatively quickly. After all, it just came out of my running car!!!!

Well....

First, it was on Stage 3 (the actual charging stage) for about three hours.

Then it stayed on Stage 4 for sometime after that.

Okay, 9 o'clock is here. Cool. I'll take it off in the morning before I go do the things I have to do.

Well, I wake up at 7AM and this thing is still on Stage 6. The last orange light!!

I hear boiling in the battery. I did top up its water in each cell. There is still a decent amount of room between the top of the water and the bottom of the vent holes. Plates are clearly covered in acid.

I connect the Multimeter and Stage 6 is delivering 15.56V......

I know Stage 7 it drops down to 13.6V.

Could the extended sitting of the battery (presumably without being charged) explain this? It is a brand new battery.. from four months ago. And, is that bad or good? Some videos suggest "boiling the cells" keeps them as good as new.

I know keeping them absolutely fully charged does too. But when do you get into overcharge condition, and what happens and how does that happen.. ?
 
That sounds extreme to me. 15.56V is in overcharge territory. Charge voltage should be 2.30-2.45V per cell; above that can cause grid corrosion on the positive plate, gas venting and water loss.

I'm not terribly familiar with that charger, is it set on some kind of restore or recondition setting? Those often use pulses of high voltage.
 
That sounds extreme to me. 15.56V is in overcharge territory. Charge voltage should be 2.30-2.45V per cell; above that can cause grid corrosion on the positive plate, gas venting and water loss.

I'm not terribly familiar with that charger, is it set on some kind of restore or recondition setting? Those often use pulses of high voltage.

Hmmmmm. I actually did have it on Recondition setting...

EDIT: okay I just cycled it off RECOND mode to Normal. Is now at Stage 4, Voltmeter says 14.32V and it was fluctuating between 15.49 and 15.5V on Stage 6 before I switched it.
 
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Is damage to the battery occuring, or can it take it?..

I may just go out there and put it on NORMAL setting. I can hear the cells "boiling" but I always thought that was normal. It gets hotter when in the actual car engine bay running I'm sure...

The manufacturer of the Autopart International battery is listed on it as Clarios. Never heard of them.
 
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There's really no point in reconditioning a new battery. I don't know the exact algorithm that charger uses for that mode, but most chargers will use high voltage pulses (very low duty cycle) which is said to reduce sulfation for some portion of the reconditioning. That's probably what you were measuring. It shouldn't hurt the battery unless done regularly, but you might find the water level drops some afterward.

Autopart International batteries come from Advance Auto Parts. They've always been made by Johnson Controls (at least every one I've ever come across.) Johnson Controls recently sold their automotive battery business in 2019 which was rebranded as Clarios.
 
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If the specs are actually adhered to during the charging process I see no real damage if the recondition function is used when needed and not every time................ on a fresh battery I would tend to not use it but that's personal.
 
These elevated voltages are sometimes called equalization charges. Lower cells are brought up, and higher cells start electrolyzing at higher rates.

Hard to tell if it was needed. Doubt it hurt much if it was short and you kept tabs on water level.
 
EQ alization charges are abusive to a battery.

They should only be performed when it is obvious the battery is under performing, or when it is known it sat undercharged for a long period of time.
They should only be initiated after a regular 'full' charge has been completed.
Ideally, They should only be performed when the end user has a hydrometer, and the ability and desire to use it/ monitor the process and terminate it when the objective has been reached..

If the cells cannot be accessed then one needs to more closely watch its temperature, and hopefully has a way to monitor not only voltage, but the amperage the battery is accepting at that voltage, and terminate charging once the amperage to maintain voltage bottoms out, and then starts rising again.

AGM or Gel batteries should not be equalized, with the exception of Lifeline AGM batteries, though they call it a 'conditioning'.

Battery makers and charger/ voltage regulator solar charge controller marketers like to use some conflicting terminology regarding stages of charging.

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The EQ charge should be ended immediately when specific gravity stop rising, or battery temperature starts rising rapidly. If temperature rises rapidly and specific gravity is still well below expected, allow battery to cool to below 80F, then try again.

Lead acid batteries are generally quite tolerant of the occassional minor overcharge, but starting batteries are pretty fragile, compared to marine or actual deep cycle batteries when exposed to these voltages.
EQ voltages Spec'd by the big names in deep cycle lead acid batteries, Rolls Surrette, and Trojan, are 16.2v. These numbers assume a battery temperature of 25c or 77f.

Scroll to page 18:

Scroll to page 12:

When I was daily deep cycling a flooded marine/dual purpose 12v battery, the hydrometer revealed how poorly my regular recharging regimen was doing.

I had to up the absorption voltage and its duration, and still, specific gravity walked down each 'full' charge as did voltage retention during each subsequent discharge.

Every ~14 deep cycles an EQ charge was performed to get specific gravity up to 1.275+ in all cells
In the beginning this was taking close to 4 hours at 15.5v.
I tried 16.2v and it took under 40 minutes.
A stayed with 16.2v after that.

Its good to know the maximum specific gravity when one acquires a new battery and has fully charged it, for later comparison. but one actual cycle is usually required as off the shelf uncycled batteries behave weirdly whether they sat on the shelf for 1 hour or 1 month.

OTC 4619 is a good hydrometer with a thermometer that says how much to add or subtract from the reading on the float to account for electolyte temperature. The curved plastic ones and similar have poor accuracy, precision and repeatability, in my experience, and the floating ball ones are not worth the 99 cents they charge for them.

Its good to have a charger which can bring the battery to 15.5v, intentionally.

Some chargers will do so when it is not required. Bringing a less than fully charged battery to 15.5v with high amperage is much more abusive, than bringing it there with lesser amperage after it has gone through a normal 'full' charge cycle. Schumacher 'intelli' chargers should be monitored closely for this potentially abusive and unpredictable behavior. My sc2500a would bring an 85% charged battery close to 17 volts on the 12 or 25 amp setting, but was less likely to do this on the AGM setting at 12 or 25 amps.

Flooded lead acid batteries self discharge anywhere from 5 to 15% per month. More self discharge at higher average temperatures, lesser at lower. The self discharge is affected by battery health. They self discharge faster with more age/less health and when non distilled water is used to refill them, or contaminants are allowed into the cells when filling them, which can be hard to avoid without busting out the Q tips after removing the cell covers carefully.

It takes no less than 3.5 hours to charge an 80% charged battery to 100%, no matter how powerful the charging source might be, or how impressive its marketing might be.
The less healthy the battery, the longer 80 to 100% takes, and a true 100% might not be possible without EQ voltages and this is more and more true as the battery ages or is subjected to abuse, such as overdischarging or living its life chronically undercharged..

Those without a hydrometer cannot know when a true 100% state of charge has been achieved.

The green light on a smart charger only indicates the charger has decided to switch to float/maintenance mode.
It has no special powers to enter the battery and read the specific gravity of the 6 cells, and detect when a true full charge has been achieved.

The true full charge achieved regularly can greatly extend the life of the battery, but good enough is subjective, opinion, and the effort of attaining true full charge can be considerable, and perhaps not that important in a engine starting battery when a new one is easily enough obtained.

A hard working deeply cycling battery requires that regular true full charges are promptly achieved, or it loses capacity and become harder and harder to recharge to its maximum remaining capacity, which then accelerates the capacity loss. The regular 'smart' chargers sold for occasional garage use, fall well short on the hard working deep cycling lead acid battery, whether Flooded AGM or GEL. Such chargers should be well ventilated, and when they flash the green light, skoff, drag battery voltage to below 12.8v with a large load, like the headlamps and blower motor, and restart the charger then remove loads.

This might or might not work to further raise specific gravity towards its maximum. Tricking the smart charger over and over gets old quickly.
Best to remain ignorant that it is not performing the true full charge, especially when obtaining and replacing the battery is no big deal to the owner.

If one reads and grasps the info in the Rolls Surrette/ Trojan and Lifeline owners manuals, they will realize much of what they though they knew, was wrong.
 
EQ alization charges are abusive to a battery.

They should only be performed when it is obvious the battery is under performing, or when it is known it sat undercharged for a long period of time.
They should only be initiated after a regular 'full' charge has been completed.
Ideally, They should only be performed when the end user has a hydrometer, and the ability and desire to use it/ monitor the process and terminate it when the objective has been reached..

If the cells cannot be accessed then one needs to more closely watch its temperature, and hopefully has a way to monitor not only voltage, but the amperage the battery is accepting at that voltage, and terminate charging once the amperage to maintain voltage bottoms out, and then starts rising again.

AGM or Gel batteries should not be equalized, with the exception of Lifeline AGM batteries, though they call it a 'conditioning'.

Battery makers and charger/ voltage regulator solar charge controller marketers like to use some conflicting terminology regarding stages of charging.

Page 21:

The EQ charge should be ended immediately when specific gravity stop rising, or battery temperature starts rising rapidly. If temperature rises rapidly and specific gravity is still well below expected, allow battery to cool to below 80F, then try again.

Lead acid batteries are generally quite tolerant of the occassional minor overcharge, but starting batteries are pretty fragile, compared to marine or actual deep cycle batteries when exposed to these voltages.
EQ voltages Spec'd by the big names in deep cycle lead acid batteries, Rolls Surrette, and Trojan, are 16.2v. These numbers assume a battery temperature of 25c or 77f.

Scroll to page 18:

Scroll to page 12:

When I was daily deep cycling a flooded marine/dual purpose 12v battery, the hydrometer revealed how poorly my regular recharging regimen was doing.

I had to up the absorption voltage and its duration, and still, specific gravity walked down each 'full' charge as did voltage retention during each subsequent discharge.

Every ~14 deep cycles an EQ charge was performed to get specific gravity up to 1.275+ in all cells
In the beginning this was taking close to 4 hours at 15.5v.
I tried 16.2v and it took under 40 minutes.
A stayed with 16.2v after that.

Its good to know the maximum specific gravity when one acquires a new battery and has fully charged it, for later comparison. but one actual cycle is usually required as off the shelf uncycled batteries behave weirdly whether they sat on the shelf for 1 hour or 1 month.

OTC 4619 is a good hydrometer with a thermometer that says how much to add or subtract from the reading on the float to account for electolyte temperature. The curved plastic ones and similar have poor accuracy, precision and repeatability, in my experience, and the floating ball ones are not worth the 99 cents they charge for them.

Its good to have a charger which can bring the battery to 15.5v, intentionally.

Some chargers will do so when it is not required. Bringing a less than fully charged battery to 15.5v with high amperage is much more abusive, than bringing it there with lesser amperage after it has gone through a normal 'full' charge cycle. Schumacher 'intelli' chargers should be monitored closely for this potentially abusive and unpredictable behavior. My sc2500a would bring an 85% charged battery close to 17 volts on the 12 or 25 amp setting, but was less likely to do this on the AGM setting at 12 or 25 amps.

Flooded lead acid batteries self discharge anywhere from 5 to 15% per month. More self discharge at higher average temperatures, lesser at lower. The self discharge is affected by battery health. They self discharge faster with more age/less health and when non distilled water is used to refill them, or contaminants are allowed into the cells when filling them, which can be hard to avoid without busting out the Q tips after removing the cell covers carefully.

It takes no less than 3.5 hours to charge an 80% charged battery to 100%, no matter how powerful the charging source might be, or how impressive its marketing might be.
The less healthy the battery, the longer 80 to 100% takes, and a true 100% might not be possible without EQ voltages and this is more and more true as the battery ages or is subjected to abuse, such as overdischarging or living its life chronically undercharged..

Those without a hydrometer cannot know when a true 100% state of charge has been achieved.

The green light on a smart charger only indicates the charger has decided to switch to float/maintenance mode.
It has no special powers to enter the battery and read the specific gravity of the 6 cells, and detect when a true full charge has been achieved.

The true full charge achieved regularly can greatly extend the life of the battery, but good enough is subjective, opinion, and the effort of attaining true full charge can be considerable, and perhaps not that important in a engine starting battery when a new one is easily enough obtained.

A hard working deeply cycling battery requires that regular true full charges are promptly achieved, or it loses capacity and become harder and harder to recharge to its maximum remaining capacity, which then accelerates the capacity loss. The regular 'smart' chargers sold for occasional garage use, fall well short on the hard working deep cycling lead acid battery, whether Flooded AGM or GEL. Such chargers should be well ventilated, and when they flash the green light, skoff, drag battery voltage to below 12.8v with a large load, like the headlamps and blower motor, and restart the charger then remove loads.

This might or might not work to further raise specific gravity towards its maximum. Tricking the smart charger over and over gets old quickly.
Best to remain ignorant that it is not performing the true full charge, especially when obtaining and replacing the battery is no big deal to the owner.

If one reads and grasps the info in the Rolls Surrette/ Trojan and Lifeline owners manuals, they will realize much of what they though they knew, was wrong.
All true in an engineering environment but what do you do with the infernal sealed batteries that seems to be the silly preferred method of design nowadays? ................. no way to properly monitor/investigate/control the charging process via SG ......................

IMO caution and experience alone will dictate the longevity/durability of modern installations.............
 
The Sealed maintenance free batteries do present issues regarding insuring full charge.

They seem to behave more like healthy AGMS, in that when they are held in the mid to high 14's, amperage tapers to near Zero at full charge, when held long enough in the mid to high 14 volt range.

Non maintenance free flooded starting batteries usually stop tapering at abourt 0.2 to 0.3 amps @ 14.5v at full charge, when newer and healthy, but the amperage, as the battery ages, stops tapering at higher and higher levels.

I have noticed this taper to near Zero behavior on a few Maintenance free flooded/sealed starter batteries that I was asked to access and recharge, but I have never cycled them deeply intentionally from new, and observed their behavior. I would avoid maintenance free sealed batteries for starter batteries when possible, and the Marine/dual purpose flooded maintenance free batteries too.

I think Maintence free flooded batteries are aimed at those, who when asked when they last changed their oil, respond::
"changed it to what?"

If one is willing to peel off the sticker, and pry up a plastic plate, they can access the cells, at least with those I've seen, this is possible, though I've not done it and their specific gravity might be more or less than the fully charged 1.275 region of Non maintenance free flooded batteries.
 
All good and solid info but again we bump into the sealed thing with the stickers ................. you dare to remove a sticker to actually do a proper caring job on a battery and then try to get them to honour the guarantee when something inevitably does go wrong.

From what I see available in the market normal start and also SS batteries are sealed - cannot remember when I last saw/bought a non-sealed item
 
From what I see available in the market normal start and also SS batteries are sealed - cannot remember when I last saw/bought a non-sealed item

I've had the opposite experience. Every off the shelf car battery I've bought in the last 20 years has been the normal kind with the caps you pop off to check water level. I just replaced two of my cars' batteries this month and both were the regular style.
 
I think I have successfully overcome the 4 months of this battery being on the shelf without being charged. Then into my car, 3 short trips. The 15.5V... I think has un-done any previous "sitting."

This is a brand new battery but it sat and was not charged up (further that whatever it left he factory with) before it went in my car.

Think I dodged a bullet?
 
Presently have an Autopart International battery. Was $110 through a shop during service (remove and replace battery, old one was just shot and no good. Low water, low voltage, old, everything. Had to go.) So the new battery is Autopart International. Manufactured by some company I've never heard of, starts with C.. Okay cool.

So, apparently this battery sat for 4 months or so. Decided to top off the charge, since it started and drove, but had sat.. previous to that. On the CTEK MXS 5.0 it goes.

So I put it on overnight, thinking it will reach the first green light - Stage 7 - relatively quickly. After all, it just came out of my running car!!!!

Well....

First, it was on Stage 3 (the actual charging stage) for about three hours.

Then it stayed on Stage 4 for sometime after that.

Okay, 9 o'clock is here. Cool. I'll take it off in the morning before I go do the things I have to do.

Well, I wake up at 7AM and this thing is still on Stage 6. The last orange light!!

I hear boiling in the battery. I did top up its water in each cell. There is still a decent amount of room between the top of the water and the bottom of the vent holes. Plates are clearly covered in acid.

I connect the Multimeter and Stage 6 is delivering 15.56V......

I know Stage 7 it drops down to 13.6V.

Could the extended sitting of the battery (presumably without being charged) explain this? It is a brand new battery.. from four months ago. And, is that bad or good? Some videos suggest "boiling the cells" keeps them as good as new.

I know keeping them absolutely fully charged does too. But when do you get into overcharge condition, and what happens and how does that happen.. ?
I have a CTEK 3000 and have just recently charged my battery, it took about 16 hrs, in the manual it says that it may take 14hrs or longer depending on the battery condition. I too thought that maybe something was wrong, I was wrong! :oops:
 
activated batteries setting without a full charge are dying a slow death!! years go i went thru 3 DieHards off the shelf, an odd bigger size for my 62 chevy + ALL three were toast shortly!! Sears gave me a full refund after the 3rd one!!
 
Even with two different smart chargers I use on both batteries every week or so, I still hookup a bench PS to each of my batteries ~ monthly. What’s weird is that most batteries will taper down to less than .1A @ 14.2-14.4 VDC; however the latest replacement, a G24 maintenance-free battery in the Foz will not go below 0.4 for a long time if at all. I can’t use my CTEK on this battery because it will remain at an elevated 14.3VDC for way too long, meaning longer than 24 hrs. I thought I could hear gassing, but it was hard to tell. This was never a problem on any previous or current (ie, the Legacy’s) battery I’ve used the CTEK on.

The previous OEM Panasonic in the Forester, even while connected to the vehicle (which is how I normally charge all of my batteries), would taper to around 0.2 or lower amps @ 14.2-14.4 VDC, which is similar to the battery I monitor in my Legacy, as well as the previous batteries in my Civic. All behave(d) the same except this new battery, a NAPA The Legend.

As an aside, I’m very disappointed in my NOCO Genius 5 charger. regardless of battery, it only puts out a max of 13.6VDC. I don’t care how smart it thinks it is, there’s no way to tell of a battery is completely charged at that low of a voltage. With that said I have yet to try the NOCO on a well depleted battery.
 
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Oh, and I forgot to address EQ charges, usually at 15.0 VDC for a 6-cell battery. They scare me on well-maintained batteries, even though it’s more common for deep-cycle batteries. The benefits of maintaining all cells approximately equal far outweighs any detriment due to additional anode plate corrosion but only if you know what you’re doing.

They scare me because they’re likely not necessarily required for a starter battery that spends its life mostly fully charged, which I keep my batteries at, and likely cause too much corrosion for how little benefit I might realize. For the rest of you, whose batteries spend their lives at
A quick, 2-4 hour EQ charge without monitoring SGs won’t hurt anything, but it may not be long enough to do any good either.

I used to do EQ charges on my batteries for several hours a couple of times per month but have learned since then that prolonged time at elevated voltages, with the battery gassing, likely does more harm than good if I can’t monitor SGs.
 
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I've been driving this car all day long on a very long road trip I'm headed to Colorado. So the battery has been accepting charge from the alternator all day long. The sun is setting now.

One of the reasons I put it on the SeaTac at all is so that it had a good "base charge* and I wasn't killing my alternator trying to charge a battery.

Does that even matter? When the car was running for basically all 12 to 24 hours in one shot at a time, turned off only for 15 minutes or so at a time to get gas?
 
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