British Tourists Detained, Deported For Tweet

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Newspapers & networks, when you see this you know it's a Slow day! But pretty funny that the kids in the UK will need a new slang word. Don't say destroy to mean PARTY!
 
Likely the supercomputer that reads all US network & phone traffic picked this up and flagged it and sent to the appropriate authorities.

At least our system works!

The problem is the bad folks would not do such a thing.
 
I don't know I think the US gov is starting to violate 1st ammendment rights. I dont necessarily think 1st amendment rights apply to non citizens but I bet this happens to citizens. I think authorities knew these tweets werent serious and are making it personal and making examples out of people. I think they want to crack down on dissent, because they know things are getting out of hand and intolerable.
 
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
I don't know I think the US gov is starting to violate 1st ammendment rights. I dont necessarily think 1st amendment rights apply to non citizens but I bet this happens to citizens. I think authorities knew these tweets werent serious and are making it personal and making examples out of people. I think they want to crack down on dissent, because they know things are getting out of hand and intolerable.


How is this destroying 1st amemdment rights? You're absolutely free to express yourself...these kids remain free to do so...even though the 1st amendment doesn't technically apply to a tweet from the UK...

But your first amendment right doesn't mean that there are no consequences to what you say...e.g. say, "I've got a bomb" at airport security, and there will be some consequences...
 
See that's just it, what speech should or shouldn't have consequnces? Consequence for speech is not freedom of speech especially not if law enforcement detains, interogates and deports you. People have started to give up the concept of the right of freedom of speech. It's not free if there are consequence especially by the gov.

Anything else is just a slippery slope of rationalizing away 1st ammendment rights. Unless of course a very high bar and direct inducement to panic or violence like the example you gave is shown which wasn't the case here or in others. But even that falls more under actions and disorderly conduct than speech.
 
I understand your point, but you're inherently self-contradictory...you say that truly free speech shouldn't have consequences...and cite an example, like inducing panic in which it should have consequences...so...so, which is it?

Personally, saying things like "Fire" in a crowded theater, or "I've got a gun" at airport security, are not protected speech...they're examples of speech that should have consequences...

We just disagree on whether the words "We're going to destroy America" fall into protected speech. I don't think it's protected, it could be seen as a threat, though looking at the two kids in question, I think "spoiled losers" more than "credible terrorist"...
 
all this rubbish and stories of how ordinary people are treated at US customs means that I probably won't be spending my holiday money in the US... sorry guys...
 
Crinkles - hundreds of millions of people go through US Customs every year...and a few kooks get stopped, a few make the news..."All these stories" are not statistically significant.

There are countries that are far more strict/difficult than the US...but since we get so much traffic, we make the press...

The German airport security guard in Munich who tried to confiscate my F-14 keychain fob (it's carved pewter, about 25mm long...a gift from my wife that has been through thousands of security checkpoints) comes to mind in my personal experience. Or the Canadian Border guard who pulled me aside for 25 minutes of questioning about my job and then searched the contents of my Volvo station wagon when I was driving to Canada to visit a friend....

You haven't posted anything about destroying America on the web, have you?
 
Originally Posted By: Astro14
Crinkles - hundreds of millions of people go through US Customs every year...and a few kooks get stopped, a few make the news..."All these stories" are not statistically significant.

Or the Canadian Border guard who pulled me aside for 25 minutes of questioning about my job and then searched the contents of my Volvo station wagon when I was driving to Canada to visit a friend....


I rarely ever have a problem getting into Canada, it getting back to the states......

I will have to say our boarder guards are very good at questioning. Last time the questions were so vague, I felt I was talking to a buddy. Totally unrelated to my trip in Canada. Even asked if I change my own oil? Of course I do! What brand of oil? Told him + type of oil filter. Any oddball would have stammered to that line of questioning.

He must of liked my answers as I only was in his presents for about 3 min.
 
Originally Posted By: Astro14
I understand your point, but you're inherently self-contradictory...you say that truly free speech shouldn't have consequences...and cite an example, like inducing panic in which it should have consequences...so...so, which is it?

Personally, saying things like "Fire" in a crowded theater, or "I've got a gun" at airport security, are not protected speech...they're examples of speech that should have consequences...

We just disagree on whether the words "We're going to destroy America" fall into protected speech. I don't think it's protected, it could be seen as a threat, though looking at the two kids in question, I think "spoiled losers" more than "credible terrorist"...


I'm curious as to which "America" they are going to destroy?

We agree, these people are probably mouth breathers, but to lock them up and spend taxpayer dollars in interrogating them for 12 hours seems like a waste. Ten minutes would have sufficed enough evidence to determine a validated threat on the U.S.

Sounds like someone taking their job too seriously.
 
Maybe Mike, maybe...I've certainly encountered plenty of "Hitler Youth" folks who take themselves and their jobs far too seriously in the many times I've crossed a border (or boarded a plane to cross one). I've got lots of examples of them being unreasonable, in lots of countries.

Most recent was in Germany this October at the Frankfurt AM Main airport, when my wife and I went through the magnetometer wearing her belt (which is brass and non-magnetic, she's a frequent flyer too...). The magnetometer did not go off, but the German scurity person said something to her in German. My wife responded "I am sorry, I don't understand." in clear English. The German guard simply repeated herself, more loudly, in German. My wife asked "Sprechen Ze English?". The guard grabbed her belt and began to pull it off. NO attempt to communicate, no permission to touch her person, no supervisor called...

And in the wrestling of her belt off, the guard accidentally struck my wife's jaw as she looked down.

In this country, putting your hands on someone without permission is assault, even the TSA has to ask before they feel you up.

And hitting someone, even by accident, usually requires an apology.

But not that day...and we're not the kind of folks to draw attention to ourselves anyway...

My point: we're not the only ones with morons at the border...they abound...
 
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I don't think the problem is with Custom agents or even TSA agents. They are generally well trained, professional and polite for the most part. It's the people higher up the chain directing the security personnel that is often the real problem.

But Crinkles, don't let the rare occassional stories discourage you from visiting. If you are straight laced, US Costumes is generally pretty friendly, fast and professional. It's when they suspect you are a troublemaker and on their radar they can be tenacious. We Americans can just be pretty sensitive to even subtle infringements of rights which is a good thing. From what I've seen Brits, Australians and New Zealanders are well received here. We put up with a lot worse foreigners coming here lol.
 
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Prosecutors subpoening peoples' tweeter accounts http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/46212535


Of course their 'tweeter' accounts are going to be scrutinized. If they used it to organize or maintain a criminal violation, why would these dolts think otherwise?

Expect their e mail provider(s) and cell phone carrier(s) to get a subpoena, also.
 
Originally Posted By: Win
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Prosecutors subpoening peoples' tweeter accounts http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/46212535


Of course their 'tweeter' accounts are going to be scrutinized. If they used it to organize or maintain a criminal violation, why would these dolts think otherwise?

Expect their e mail provider(s) and cell phone carrier(s) to get a subpoena, also.


If that were the case. Supposedly he was charged only with disorderly conduct while protesting. And this subpoena is just a fishing exhibition and not relavent to his misdameanor charge. It seems to be excessive search and seizure. Just because you are charged with "disorderly conduct" that doesn't give prosecution the right to go on a fishing expedition to maybe find more things to charge you with. That's not reasonable cause.
 
Well, he asked for a trial. Sometimes you have to be careful what you ask for.

Most requests are fishing expeditions. I don't know what New Yorks rules are, but around here the standard is not relevance, but whether or not the information sought is reasonably calculated to lead to the discovery of admissible evidence. A pretty broad standard. It's certainly reasonable to think his tweets could contain statements admissible with respect to the crime of which he is charged. He may wind up with other charges.

Let the lawyers and judge worry about it.

You do know that even core first amendment rights like freedom of assembly are subject to reasonable time, place, and manner restrictions?
 
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