No, it still has a 0w rating, which means it must pump better in ultra cold conditions than any 5w-XX out there. Recall that viscosity curves aren't terribly accurate below freezing, so VI won't help much in that determination. If my 5w-40 works in our winters, GC can only be better.
BMW e36 cold weather severe service oil?
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On Autodata (what BMW spec) it says API SL, ACEA A2, A3
ambient temperature ranges below
up to 0'C 5w-20
up to 10'C 5w30
-20'C up to 10'C 10w30
-20'C up to 20'C 10w-40
-15'C onwards 15w40
0w-40 will be perfect for your climate (-30'C - 30'C) by the looks of it
personally I'd go for the Pennzoil Ultra/Platinum 0w40/5w40 as that is rebranded Shell and uses their GTL base oil and has a pour point of -51'C/-45'C respectively.
We use the Shell Helix Ultra 5w40 with a -45'C pour point and it's mustard.
ambient temperature ranges below
up to 0'C 5w-20
up to 10'C 5w30
-20'C up to 10'C 10w30
-20'C up to 20'C 10w-40
-15'C onwards 15w40
0w-40 will be perfect for your climate (-30'C - 30'C) by the looks of it
personally I'd go for the Pennzoil Ultra/Platinum 0w40/5w40 as that is rebranded Shell and uses their GTL base oil and has a pour point of -51'C/-45'C respectively.
We use the Shell Helix Ultra 5w40 with a -45'C pour point and it's mustard.
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But but but... My ECHO starts noticeably easier in the winter with 0W-20 than it does with 0W-30. How is that?
Originally Posted By: Garak
No, it still has a 0w rating, which means it must pump better in ultra cold conditions than any 5w-XX out there. Recall that viscosity curves aren't terribly accurate below freezing, so VI won't help much in that determination. If my 5w-40 works in our winters, GC can only be better.
Originally Posted By: Garak
No, it still has a 0w rating, which means it must pump better in ultra cold conditions than any 5w-XX out there. Recall that viscosity curves aren't terribly accurate below freezing, so VI won't help much in that determination. If my 5w-40 works in our winters, GC can only be better.
edyvw
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Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Dosen't GC, both the original green stuff, latter golden one and the current Belgian made one have a p**s poor VI rating (and MRV)?
Even with "only" a ~3.6 HTHSV, but said poor VI, wouldn't it still be too thick for serious winter use?
I used Mobil 1 0W40 and GC in CC. GC has definitely better cold start, regardless what it says on a paper. It starts smoother, but it seems that I should believe more what is on paper then my ears when I start car.
Dosen't GC, both the original green stuff, latter golden one and the current Belgian made one have a p**s poor VI rating (and MRV)?
Even with "only" a ~3.6 HTHSV, but said poor VI, wouldn't it still be too thick for serious winter use?
I used Mobil 1 0W40 and GC in CC. GC has definitely better cold start, regardless what it says on a paper. It starts smoother, but it seems that I should believe more what is on paper then my ears when I start car.
Originally Posted By: kschachn
But but but... My ECHO starts noticeably easier in the winter with 0W-20 than it does with 0W-30. How is that?
That's not really surprising. Most 0w-20 examples do have better MRV and CCS numbers than a corresponding 0w30 or 0w-40. That can be seen readily by comparing data sheets, and if part of the same product line, really helps illustrate the point.
But, any 0w-XX will beat any 5w-XX at those ultra cold temperatures. We also have to watch at what point we're comparing viscosities. The curves of a 0w-40, for example, and a 5w-20 will intersect somewhere. The 0w-40 will be thinner than a 5w-20 at the coldest temperatures, but at some point as temperatures increase, the 5w-20 will be lighter than the 0w-40. There's just no hard and fast rule about where that intersection will be.
But but but... My ECHO starts noticeably easier in the winter with 0W-20 than it does with 0W-30. How is that?
That's not really surprising. Most 0w-20 examples do have better MRV and CCS numbers than a corresponding 0w30 or 0w-40. That can be seen readily by comparing data sheets, and if part of the same product line, really helps illustrate the point.
But, any 0w-XX will beat any 5w-XX at those ultra cold temperatures. We also have to watch at what point we're comparing viscosities. The curves of a 0w-40, for example, and a 5w-20 will intersect somewhere. The 0w-40 will be thinner than a 5w-20 at the coldest temperatures, but at some point as temperatures increase, the 5w-20 will be lighter than the 0w-40. There's just no hard and fast rule about where that intersection will be.
OK good explanation, thanks. I guess I was mixing up 5W-XX with 0W-XX too.
Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: kschachn
But but but... My ECHO starts noticeably easier in the winter with 0W-20 than it does with 0W-30. How is that?
That's not really surprising. Most 0w-20 examples do have better MRV and CCS numbers than a corresponding 0w30 or 0w-40. That can be seen readily by comparing data sheets, and if part of the same product line, really helps illustrate the point.
But, any 0w-XX will beat any 5w-XX at those ultra cold temperatures. We also have to watch at what point we're comparing viscosities. The curves of a 0w-40, for example, and a 5w-20 will intersect somewhere. The 0w-40 will be thinner than a 5w-20 at the coldest temperatures, but at some point as temperatures increase, the 5w-20 will be lighter than the 0w-40. There's just no hard and fast rule about where that intersection will be.
Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: kschachn
But but but... My ECHO starts noticeably easier in the winter with 0W-20 than it does with 0W-30. How is that?
That's not really surprising. Most 0w-20 examples do have better MRV and CCS numbers than a corresponding 0w30 or 0w-40. That can be seen readily by comparing data sheets, and if part of the same product line, really helps illustrate the point.
But, any 0w-XX will beat any 5w-XX at those ultra cold temperatures. We also have to watch at what point we're comparing viscosities. The curves of a 0w-40, for example, and a 5w-20 will intersect somewhere. The 0w-40 will be thinner than a 5w-20 at the coldest temperatures, but at some point as temperatures increase, the 5w-20 will be lighter than the 0w-40. There's just no hard and fast rule about where that intersection will be.
Originally Posted By: kschachn
OK good explanation, thanks. I guess I was mixing up 5W-XX with 0W-XX too.
Yep, that's the big thing to watch. The 0w-20 is usually better in the absolute cold than the equivalent 0w-30, but of course the 5w-XX will not be as good as any 0w-XX in the cold. That being said, I've used a lot of 5w-XX grades in the winter, and we have bad ones. To me, the difference between GC 0w30 and Mobil 1 0w-40 in the winter would be splitting hairs. Either would be significantly better in the extreme cold than another notable example with an HTHS of 3.5 or higher, a 10w30 HDEO.
OK good explanation, thanks. I guess I was mixing up 5W-XX with 0W-XX too.
Yep, that's the big thing to watch. The 0w-20 is usually better in the absolute cold than the equivalent 0w-30, but of course the 5w-XX will not be as good as any 0w-XX in the cold. That being said, I've used a lot of 5w-XX grades in the winter, and we have bad ones. To me, the difference between GC 0w30 and Mobil 1 0w-40 in the winter would be splitting hairs. Either would be significantly better in the extreme cold than another notable example with an HTHS of 3.5 or higher, a 10w30 HDEO.
Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: kschachn
OK good explanation, thanks. I guess I was mixing up 5W-XX with 0W-XX too.
Yep, that's the big thing to watch. The 0w-20 is usually better in the absolute cold than the equivalent 0w-30, but of course the 5w-XX will not be as good as any 0w-XX in the cold. That being said, I've used a lot of 5w-XX grades in the winter, and we have bad ones. To me, the difference between GC 0w30 and Mobil 1 0w-40 in the winter would be splitting hairs. Either would be significantly better in the extreme cold than another notable example with an HTHS of 3.5 or higher, a 10w30 HDEO.
THAT'S what I was trying to question in the post above, as I was referencing Mobil 1 0W-40 in comparison to GC, NOT any 5w-xx oil.
Does the Mobil 1 product not have a much better VI than GC, as well as at least a comparable if not superior MRV??
Originally Posted By: kschachn
OK good explanation, thanks. I guess I was mixing up 5W-XX with 0W-XX too.
Yep, that's the big thing to watch. The 0w-20 is usually better in the absolute cold than the equivalent 0w-30, but of course the 5w-XX will not be as good as any 0w-XX in the cold. That being said, I've used a lot of 5w-XX grades in the winter, and we have bad ones. To me, the difference between GC 0w30 and Mobil 1 0w-40 in the winter would be splitting hairs. Either would be significantly better in the extreme cold than another notable example with an HTHS of 3.5 or higher, a 10w30 HDEO.
THAT'S what I was trying to question in the post above, as I was referencing Mobil 1 0W-40 in comparison to GC, NOT any 5w-xx oil.
Does the Mobil 1 product not have a much better VI than GC, as well as at least a comparable if not superior MRV??
Yep, Mobil 1 0w-40 has a higher VI than does GC. I believe that the Mobil 1's cold weather numbers might be a bit better, but without sheets in front of me, don't quote me on that. However, we can't assume that the great cold weather numbers are because of high VI. In fact, I can find some relatively atrocious VI numbers in some 0w-40 examples, where the cold weather numbers are obviously good enough to warrant a 0w rating.
I just wouldn't characterize Mobil 1 0w-40 as a great winter oil on one hand and then dismiss GC out of [the other] hand. They're both 0w-XX oils and far better in the extreme cold than what many, many people out there run.
I just wouldn't characterize Mobil 1 0w-40 as a great winter oil on one hand and then dismiss GC out of [the other] hand. They're both 0w-XX oils and far better in the extreme cold than what many, many people out there run.
edyvw
$50 site donor 2026
Originally Posted By: Garak
Yep, Mobil 1 0w-40 has a higher VI than does GC. I believe that the Mobil 1's cold weather numbers might be a bit better, but without sheets in front of me, don't quote me on that. However, we can't assume that the great cold weather numbers are because of high VI. In fact, I can find some relatively atrocious VI numbers in some 0w-40 examples, where the cold weather numbers are obviously good enough to warrant a 0w rating.
I just wouldn't characterize Mobil 1 0w-40 as a great winter oil on one hand and then dismiss GC out of [the other] hand. They're both 0w-XX oils and far better in the extreme cold than what many, many people out there run.
I mentioned already, I had better cold starts with GC then Mobil 1, regardless what paper says.
Yep, Mobil 1 0w-40 has a higher VI than does GC. I believe that the Mobil 1's cold weather numbers might be a bit better, but without sheets in front of me, don't quote me on that. However, we can't assume that the great cold weather numbers are because of high VI. In fact, I can find some relatively atrocious VI numbers in some 0w-40 examples, where the cold weather numbers are obviously good enough to warrant a 0w rating.
I just wouldn't characterize Mobil 1 0w-40 as a great winter oil on one hand and then dismiss GC out of [the other] hand. They're both 0w-XX oils and far better in the extreme cold than what many, many people out there run.
I mentioned already, I had better cold starts with GC then Mobil 1, regardless what paper says.
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Photo of the old girl for fun, I appreciate the civilized weight conversation guys.
It's on Bavauto lowering springs and fresh Bilstien sport struts. Looking at H&R for next year to get lower in the front.
I'm waiting on new polishing pads for the perfect finish this week.. then it will be truly photo pretty, she still has all the final check stickers from factory on too. Note the Q quality control sticker still on in the pic
try to appreciate that $29 plasti-dip red over black primer experiment on the e36 m3 rims... they were a florescent yellow/red color before... (anticipating people mad about the color)
If you look hard you can see my cheesy teal 90's monster civic behind it.
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Not sure what this changes but I used my lubricheck (from kickstarter) and my Mobil 1 0w40 registered at "2".... after 4k miles of 10 mile one way trips with a bad O2 (replacing monday-tuesday) and once-twice a week 60 mile one way trips. fresh Mobil 1 0w40 clocks at "1" of 10. feeling comfortable for another 3k honestly given the light oil color and zero consumption at 157k now. I'm likely going to change at 160k around late fall since it would be a pain at my college house and cold as [censored]. I will do a used oil analysis after this 7k run of Mobil 1 0w40 w/TBN.
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By the way, a Delvac or Rotella 0w30 would work fine, but I don't think you're going to gain a lot of anything in comparison to something like Mobil 1 0w-40 or GC. The HDEO examples have a similar HTHS to the Mobil 1 0w-40 or GC, although the Delvac Elite 222 0w30 does have a pretty decent VI. So, they're quite feasible choices, just watch pricing.
Delvac 1 is roughly half the price of Mobil 1 0w-40 here, and to make matters worse, the 0w-40 doesn't come in jugs, just individual quarts or litres or whatever.
Delvac 1 is roughly half the price of Mobil 1 0w-40 here, and to make matters worse, the 0w-40 doesn't come in jugs, just individual quarts or litres or whatever.
Canada also has Mobil Delvac 1 ESP 0w40, which is an impressive oil.
Brenden: that's a nice looking car that's ruined by red wheels! Please repaint them to factory silver. Aren't those M3 wheels?
Brenden: that's a nice looking car that's ruined by red wheels! Please repaint them to factory silver. Aren't those M3 wheels?
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Yes they are m3 rims, the PO sanded them before he rattle canned them
The reds certainly different, your actually the first person to tell me they hate it, but it is wayyyyy better than the pinkish red and yellow green they were.
I'm going to see how much it costs to have them coated to look factory, may be cheaper to buy another good condition set though.
The reds certainly different, your actually the first person to tell me they hate it, but it is wayyyyy better than the pinkish red and yellow green they were.
I'm going to see how much it costs to have them coated to look factory, may be cheaper to buy another good condition set though.
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Originally Posted By: Brenden
Yes they are m3 rims, the PO sanded them before he rattle canned them
The reds certainly different, your actually the first person to tell me they hate it, but it is wayyyyy better than the pinkish red and yellow green they were.
I'm going to see how much it costs to have them coated to look factory, may be cheaper to buy another good condition set though.
Those, and even the various BBS, multi-spoke 'Motorsport' (CK model??) wheels look great in 'hyper silver' and even BLACK chrome on that color Bimmer.
Yes they are m3 rims, the PO sanded them before he rattle canned them
The reds certainly different, your actually the first person to tell me they hate it, but it is wayyyyy better than the pinkish red and yellow green they were.
I'm going to see how much it costs to have them coated to look factory, may be cheaper to buy another good condition set though.
Those, and even the various BBS, multi-spoke 'Motorsport' (CK model??) wheels look great in 'hyper silver' and even BLACK chrome on that color Bimmer.
Originally Posted By: Garak
By the way, a Delvac or Rotella 0w30 would work fine, but I don't think you're going to gain a lot of anything in comparison to something like Mobil 1 0w-40 or GC. The HDEO examples have a similar HTHS to the Mobil 1 0w-40 or GC, although the Delvac Elite 222 0w30 does have a pretty decent VI. So, they're quite feasible choices, just watch pricing.
Delvac 1 is roughly half the price of Mobil 1 0w-40 here, and to make matters worse, the 0w-40 doesn't come in jugs, just individual quarts or litres or whatever.
Those are all great oils, but it really depends on just how close to the border Brenden is, as that's the only way he's going to get them.
By the way, a Delvac or Rotella 0w30 would work fine, but I don't think you're going to gain a lot of anything in comparison to something like Mobil 1 0w-40 or GC. The HDEO examples have a similar HTHS to the Mobil 1 0w-40 or GC, although the Delvac Elite 222 0w30 does have a pretty decent VI. So, they're quite feasible choices, just watch pricing.
Delvac 1 is roughly half the price of Mobil 1 0w-40 here, and to make matters worse, the 0w-40 doesn't come in jugs, just individual quarts or litres or whatever.
Those are all great oils, but it really depends on just how close to the border Brenden is, as that's the only way he's going to get them.
Originally Posted By: Brenden
The reds certainly different, your actually the first person to tell me they hate it, but it is wayyyyy better than the pinkish red and yellow green they were.
I don't hate it. I prefer factory, but as far as heavily modified rims, I could live with yours.
Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Those are all great oils, but it really depends on just how close to the border Brenden is, as that's the only way he's going to get them.
Absolutely, unless someone is importing them in his locale. I know I once got some Delvac 1300 from Imperial Oil here that had been destined for or sitting at a U.S. Walmart.
The reds certainly different, your actually the first person to tell me they hate it, but it is wayyyyy better than the pinkish red and yellow green they were.
I don't hate it. I prefer factory, but as far as heavily modified rims, I could live with yours.
Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Those are all great oils, but it really depends on just how close to the border Brenden is, as that's the only way he's going to get them.
Absolutely, unless someone is importing them in his locale. I know I once got some Delvac 1300 from Imperial Oil here that had been destined for or sitting at a U.S. Walmart.
I vote whatever 0W-30/0W-40 you can get cheapest, be it M1, or the new 'Belgian' Castrol 0W-40.
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