Bare Aluminum Heads - Small Block Ford

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This is sort of a follow up to a previous post I made: Rod/Main/Cam Bearings - Any Quality Differences?

I've been looking around at different aluminum heads and have decided that I want to upgrade. Basically my buildup is a mild daily driven 302/5.0L. It's not a flame thrower by any means and will be used in a good ol' pickup truck (see autosig) and will be used for real truck stuff and long distance road trips will occur with a great level of regularity. I will be using a mild performance camshaft that's on the RV level more so than anything else.

In looking at all of the different brands of cylinder heads, I'll lay out my simple requirements:

1. Must use pedestal mount rocker arms. Yes, I know studs are better, but this is not a race truck and it probably won't see more than 4500RPMs, if that.

2. Must be a good balance of cost and performance. Yes, I would like AFR 165, but I'm not looking to spend that much.

3. I "assume" any aluminum head will outflow a stock E7 head, so with than in mind, long term durability is pretty much my #1 concern.

4. I want to buy the heads bare so that I choose my own valve springs, valves, etc. and have a machine shop inspect the heads thoroughly.

5. Heads must be "worth something" as far as low end torque goes. Too much head is not good on a relatively mild build.

6. Heads must have smog ports in the rear.

7. Not necessarily a requirement, but I know cast iron GT40s are a good upgrade, but aluminum just looks cool. I have looked at the Ford Racing GT40X Aluminum Heads and they are near the top of my list.

I've done some looking and see low end bargain brands that have been the subject of horror stories such as Procomp and Flo-Tek and I've seen brands on the higher end such as Edelbrock, Trick Flow and RHS.

My question here is does anyone know of a brand that gives a good balance as far as cost and performance goes? I won't lie, I really did think long and hard about Procomp Part Number PC3035, but I'm not entirely comfortable with that. You sometimes get what you pay for and I don't want to pay to spend time on the side of the road a thousand miles away from home because of a janky set of heads.

Thoughts?
 
Remember our discussion about having to upgrade to MAF if you exceed the HP capacity of your current injectors?

This is in that vein.

I would be careful going hog wild with better flowing heads. And better flowing heads on a small cube engine are going to want RPM. So spinning it to 4,500 is probably not going to net you anything other than a lighter wallet.

Also, the aluminum heads aren't going to be an upgrade unless you upgrade the intake.

This is opening a big can of worms.

With that out of the way, my fav's for aftermarket affordable heads are the TFS TW's.

And unless you plan on running a cam of significant lift/duration, you really don't need to buy bare.
 
You will also need to re-tune the ecu to recognize the new maf. If you are adding any higher lift/longer duration cam you will need a dyno tune. The ecu will go kinda nuts because it doesn't recognize the new running pattern
 
Originally Posted By: Clevy
You will also need to re-tune the ecu to recognize the new maf. If you are adding any higher lift/longer duration cam you will need a dyno tune. The ecu will go kinda nuts because it doesn't recognize the new running pattern


He's not MAF right now, he's speed density.

But if he goes hog wild and above the limits of his 19lb/hr injectors, then in order to run larger injectors, he's going to need to upgrade to MAF, retrofit an A9L or A9P and then get a TWEECER, PMS or chip of some sort to manage the new setup.
 
does anyone make a package for this application that would come with heads, cam, intake, injectors and computer? That would be the way to go, rather than to try to piecemeal it yourself.
 
Originally Posted By: Brons2
does anyone make a package for this application that would come with heads, cam, intake, injectors and computer? That would be the way to go, rather than to try to piecemeal it yourself.


Heads/cam/intake yes, Trickflow makes an entire top-end kit. But the resulting power output is too much for what his current 19lb/hr injector setup will be able to handle, so he'd have to upgrade the truck to MAF. Which isn't a HUGE undertaking, but if you've never done it before I imagine it could be a touch daunting.
 
OK, I'll resurrect an older thread...since I too have a similar interest in a 302 head form my '96 Bronco 5.0 E4OD...

I looked at a lot of aluminum and iron heads over the last four years planning my 331 stroker build for the Bronco. From the Trick Flow #51400002 to the Patriot #1102 to the Ford Racing GT-40 #M-6049-X306 (won't port match to the OEM Ford Truck aluminum intake) to the ProComp #3035C to Thumper Performance and PowerHeads ported iron E7TEs...I've looks at a LOT of heads...and have settled on the PowerHeads CNC ported E7TE @ @900/pair. http://www.powerheads.com/e7heads.html

I picked the PowerHeads over the others for six primary reasons: They fit, they have the EGR ports in the ends of the heads, they look stock (for emissions inspection purposes), they have all the right mounting holes for front-mounted accessories, they will provide more than enough flow (http://powerheads.com/images/FLOW-TEST-289-302.gif) for my 5.0 MAF (OBD-II) motor, and they're about $200-$400 cheaper than the top tier aluminum heads (Trick Flow, World Products, Edelbrock, RHS, etc.)

Since I have the MAF motor, the 331 stroker will be built as a mild performer that is fully emission compliant but still gives me some extra torque for my desert pre-running and off-road excursions. The hydraulic roller cam is emissions compliant and recommended my CompCams for my application (Xtreme Energy #35-512-8, 206º/212º @ .050”, .480”/.480”, 114º LS).

So...what did you finally settle on?



Brad
Salt Lake City, UT
------------------------------------------------
 
I am still planning on getting the new AFR 185 pedestal mount heads for my 95 when I get around to working on that again. I already have the E303 cam (smog laws here), I just need to finish pulling the motor and get it off to the machine shop. Kinda sad knowing that my new Mustang will have more power with the stock engine than the 95 will with a modded engine.
 
Originally Posted By: Bradford
The hydraulic roller cam is emissions compliant and recommended my CompCams for my application (Xtreme Energy #35-512-8, 206º/212º @ .050”, .480”/.480”, 114º LS).




Is that cam lift or valve lift at the valve?
 
Originally Posted By: Scott_Tucker
Originally Posted By: Bradford
The hydraulic roller cam is emissions compliant and recommended my CompCams for my application (Xtreme Energy #35-512-8, 206º/212º @ .050”, .480”/.480”, 114º LS).




Is that cam lift or valve lift at the valve?


I'm guessing it's valve lift. Comp Cams usually gives their lift with the stock ratio rockers.
 
Originally Posted By: The_Eric
Originally Posted By: Scott_Tucker
Originally Posted By: Bradford
The hydraulic roller cam is emissions compliant and recommended my CompCams for my application (Xtreme Energy #35-512-8, 206º/212º @ .050”, .480”/.480”, 114º LS).




Is that cam lift or valve lift at the valve?


I'm guessing it's valve lift. Comp Cams usually gives their lift with the stock ratio rockers.


If that is the case, the cam needs more lift in my opinion. If you look at the flow chart you will see that the intake basically stops flowing additional air at .450" valve lift. The cam lifts the valve .480", which certainly will ensure that the valve is not lifted too much. However, the valve needs to be open to at least .450" by the time the crank is 90 degrees to the connecting rod (about 65 to 70 degrees ATDC). This is where the piston reaches maximum velocity and there is the greatest pressure differential between the atmosphere and the cylinder. Anything less will be choking flow. I just don't think the valve will be open enough by this point with that cam. Of course, I would need to see a valve lift plot of this cam to be sure, but comp cams will not supply this.

I'm never an advocate of lifting the valve more than necessary. Normally, I see people install a cams with huge amounts of lift. So basically they there is a bunch of wasted motion getting the valve open that far. Some heads will even flow worse if the valve is open too much. If your head will only flow up to .450", then why would someone open it to .700"?

I think cam with .500" or maybe a little more would be an improvement.
 
Originally Posted By: Scott_Tucker
Originally Posted By: The_Eric
Originally Posted By: Scott_Tucker
Originally Posted By: Bradford
The hydraulic roller cam is emissions compliant and recommended my CompCams for my application (Xtreme Energy #35-512-8, 206º/212º @ .050”, .480”/.480”, 114º LS).




Is that cam lift or valve lift at the valve?


I'm guessing it's valve lift. Comp Cams usually gives their lift with the stock ratio rockers.


If that is the case, the cam needs more lift in my opinion. If you look at the flow chart you will see that the intake basically stops flowing additional air at .450" valve lift. The cam lifts the valve .480", which certainly will ensure that the valve is not lifted too much. However, the valve needs to be open to at least .450" by the time the crank is 90 degrees to the connecting rod (about 65 to 70 degrees ATDC). This is where the piston reaches maximum velocity and there is the greatest pressure differential between the atmosphere and the cylinder. Anything less will be choking flow. I just don't think the valve will be open enough by this point with that cam. Of course, I would need to see a valve lift plot of this cam to be sure, but comp cams will not supply this.

I'm never an advocate of lifting the valve more than necessary. Normally, I see people install a cams with huge amounts of lift. So basically they there is a bunch of wasted motion getting the valve open that far. Some heads will even flow worse if the valve is open too much. If your head will only flow up to .450", then why would someone open it to .700"?

I think cam with .500" or maybe a little more would be an improvement.



He could run 1.7's on that cam and get just that, as that's an old 5.0L trick
wink.gif


I'm running 1.7's, and with them, I'm at .548/.552 IIRC.

If he's .480 with 1.6's, he'd be .510 with 1.7's.
 
Quote:


He could run 1.7's on that cam and get just that, as that's an old 5.0L trick
wink.gif


I'm running 1.7's, and with them, I'm at .548/.552 IIRC.

If he's .480 with 1.6's, he'd be .510 with 1.7's.


That certainly would work, but if he hasn't purchased the cam yet I would stick with the stock ratio so valvetrain geometry doesn't change.
 
Originally Posted By: Scott_Tucker
Quote:


He could run 1.7's on that cam and get just that, as that's an old 5.0L trick
wink.gif


I'm running 1.7's, and with them, I'm at .548/.552 IIRC.

If he's .480 with 1.6's, he'd be .510 with 1.7's.


That certainly would work, but if he hasn't purchased the cam yet I would stick with the stock ratio so valvetrain geometry doesn't change.


The heads take pedestal rockers, it won't change the geometry. The 1.7's were stock on the GT40's fitted to the 93 Cobra and are a stock Ford part #. You are supposed to buy them with a set of shims and set the pattern over the valve stem with a sharpie (how I did mine on the Town Car) but often you get lucky (like I did on the Mustang) and pushrod height giving the proper pattern is stock.

He'll need to check pushrod height whether he runs 1.6's or 1.7's anyway if he's using roller rockers, and he's going to need to potentially shim them anyway, since the heads take pedestal rockers.

It is pretty easy to fab up an adjustable pushrod (I took a stock one, cut it on half, hauled out the tap and die set and some threaded rod and voila!) to set the pattern over the valve stem for proper pushrod length and rocker height. And it doesn't cost anything if he already has a stock pushrod kicking around that came out of the engine. He should be checking it anyway, as he doesn't want to be hanging a valve open with too much pre-load, since it isn't adjustable via the fastener for the rocker like it is with a stud-mount setup.
 
Originally Posted By: Bradford

So...what did you finally settle on?



Brad
Salt Lake City, UT
------------------------------------------------


I ended up going with stock GT40 heads, but I recently purchased a set of TW170 head to install at some point. With regards to the camshaft, I went with Comp Cams 35-512-8. I wasn't looking to build the ultimate flamethrower, I just wanted a truck that could get out of its own way, and it does that very well. Also, I had the lower intake manifold ported.
 
Originally Posted By: Bradford
Since I have the MAF motor, the 331 stroker will be built as a mild performer that is fully emission compliant but still gives me some extra torque for my desert pre-running and off-road excursions. The hydraulic roller cam is emissions compliant and recommended my CompCams for my application (Xtreme Energy #35-512-8, 206º/212º @ .050”, .480”/.480”, 114º LS).

Brad
Salt Lake City, UT
------------------------------------------------


I would investigate a custom ground for that 331 and see how much different it is from that Comp camshaft. Usually, they are about $50 more than an off the shelf cam. You might be leaving just a little bit on the table. I understand exactly where you are coming from with the camshaft selection. I didn't want the flamethrower of all flamethrowers, I just wanted something better than stock.
 
A custom cam grind is mostly subjective, the Trick Flow cams are already flow matched for the TF Twisted Wedge heads... Unless maybe one wanted more low end torque than the mildest grind offered there would be very little if any performance gain by going custom(in my opinion that's what deeper gears and/or higher stall speed converters are for)...

I've run the TW heads and cam on the old 5.0 in my T-Bird and was very happy, will be using same on the new 331...
 
Originally Posted By: qdeezie
Originally Posted By: Bradford
Since I have the MAF motor, the 331 stroker will be built as a mild performer that is fully emission compliant but still gives me some extra torque for my desert pre-running and off-road excursions. The hydraulic roller cam is emissions compliant and recommended my CompCams for my application (Xtreme Energy #35-512-8, 206º/212º @ .050”, .480”/.480”, 114º LS).

Brad
Salt Lake City, UT
------------------------------------------------


I would investigate a custom ground for that 331 and see how much different it is from that Comp camshaft. Usually, they are about $50 more than an off the shelf cam. You might be leaving just a little bit on the table. I understand exactly where you are coming from with the camshaft selection. I didn't want the flamethrower of all flamethrowers, I just wanted something better than stock.



All & qdeezie,

Yes. .480" is at the valve. Thanks for feedback. And yes, before I buy, I will be checking back in with CompCams one more time with all my 'specs' to make sure the 35-512-8 is still what they recommend. This was ~three years ago that I last submitted an online cam recommendation request, so maybe they have some other HR truck cam that would suit me better...like Scott_Tucker said...with a little more lift...or maybe deploy those 1.7 rockers!

A custom grind? Possibly...from whom would you suggest?

I just don't want to jack up the computer with anything less than a 114 degree LSA...as I've heard that the OBD-II computers perform best with that much of an LSA (or more).


Here is the CompCams Cam spec page: http://www.compcams.com/Company/CC/cam-specs/Details.aspx?csid=1446&sb=0
 
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