OVERKILL
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Maybe EM will bury Valvoline over this one
Anyone see this?
- Thread starter buster
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I know most of Valvoline's base oils are sourced from ExxonMobil including the PAO they blend with group III to make SynPower, and from what I recall the additive package came from Infineum which is a Shell/Exxon joint venture.
I am not saying it's an ExxonMobil oil, I am saying it's kind of funny to buy something from someone, put it together then try to take them down with it.
I am not saying it's an ExxonMobil oil, I am saying it's kind of funny to buy something from someone, put it together then try to take them down with it.
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Originally Posted By: sunfire
Amsoil used to make claims that they are better than Mobil too.
Yep, I believe their marketing info still shows them slightly "better" than M1....... But they also use some EM base stocks.....
Amsoil used to make claims that they are better than Mobil too.
Yep, I believe their marketing info still shows them slightly "better" than M1....... But they also use some EM base stocks.....
I thought Amsoil used base stocks from Lubrisol ?
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Originally Posted By: rubberchicken
I thought Amsoil used base stocks from Lubrisol ?
I believe it was one of the Amsoil guys on here that stated that they do in fact use some EM base stocks.
I thought Amsoil used base stocks from Lubrisol ?
I believe it was one of the Amsoil guys on here that stated that they do in fact use some EM base stocks.
"ExxonMobil has requested Valvoline to provide the substantiating data to support this claim immediately"
Thats great..lol
Thats great..lol
What we are missing here is since Amsoil is "just a bit better" than M1 in the Amsoil white papers and other comparisons Valvoline is better than Amsoil.These kind of things snowball.
Once again...with no response variable whatsoever listed or a scale of dimension we can not conclude anything other than someone is ringing Pavlov's bell from the marketing group.
Well Mobil 1 at times does show higher Fe, so it could be something along those lines and it did say the results were based off of the Seq IVA test.
However, from the people I have spoken with over the years that work in the field and use M1, they all like it a lot and consider Mobil 1 to be the best. Jason Whitfield, GM engineer among others have said M1 is outstanding.
Valvoline is touting great deposit control yet they don't meet Honda HTO-06, which I assume it failed based on that Honda R&D chart. Unlike the others, Mobil doesn't sling mud at it's competition. They just list OEM endorsements and specifications met.
However, from the people I have spoken with over the years that work in the field and use M1, they all like it a lot and consider Mobil 1 to be the best. Jason Whitfield, GM engineer among others have said M1 is outstanding.
Valvoline is touting great deposit control yet they don't meet Honda HTO-06, which I assume it failed based on that Honda R&D chart. Unlike the others, Mobil doesn't sling mud at it's competition. They just list OEM endorsements and specifications met.
Originally Posted By: buster
Mobil doesn't sling mud at it's competition. They just list OEM endorsements and specifications met.
4 times more Buster!!!
Mobil doesn't sling mud at it's competition. They just list OEM endorsements and specifications met.
4 times more Buster!!!
Maybe wee need aggressive Valvoline site sponsor in here so no one would even doubt about their charts...lol. Amsoil can publish anything they want while their dealers fighting to death in order convince people that nothing outperform their oil by throwing charts left and right.
http://www.fleetmag.com/web/online/Indus...otection/135
Quote:
According to Valvoline, the claim is based on the industry standard Sequence IVA test. The Sequence IVA is the industry standard test for determining wear performance of an engine oil and is required to meet the API SL and SM requirements. Multiple tests showed that Valvoline SynPower provided four times better wear protection than Mobil 1, as measured in these tests of 5W-30 grades.
“We stand behind the ASTM standard tests completed recently at our own fully certified engine testing laboratory and at an independent laboratory,” said Valvoline Marketing Director John Stotz. “Consumers tell us it is wear protection that matters most to them,” he said.
Key to Valvoline’s anti-wear chemistry is its zinc/phosphorus additive known as ZDDP. Increasingly lower levels of phosphorus in motor oil have been the subject of concern to automotive enthusiasts. SynPower’s low volatility ZDDP formulation causes the phosphorus to stay in the oil longer, according to Valvoline Technical Director Thom Smith. Phosphorous bonds to metal parts in the engine to form a ‘sacrificial’ layer that helps protect against engine wear, Smith said.
Mobil could very well be "skimping" down on quality. Wouldn't surprise me at all.
Amsoil, I was told, always bought higher quality zdp than some of the other marketers. I don't know if it's true but it could be along the same lines as this.
Quote:
According to Valvoline, the claim is based on the industry standard Sequence IVA test. The Sequence IVA is the industry standard test for determining wear performance of an engine oil and is required to meet the API SL and SM requirements. Multiple tests showed that Valvoline SynPower provided four times better wear protection than Mobil 1, as measured in these tests of 5W-30 grades.
“We stand behind the ASTM standard tests completed recently at our own fully certified engine testing laboratory and at an independent laboratory,” said Valvoline Marketing Director John Stotz. “Consumers tell us it is wear protection that matters most to them,” he said.
Key to Valvoline’s anti-wear chemistry is its zinc/phosphorus additive known as ZDDP. Increasingly lower levels of phosphorus in motor oil have been the subject of concern to automotive enthusiasts. SynPower’s low volatility ZDDP formulation causes the phosphorus to stay in the oil longer, according to Valvoline Technical Director Thom Smith. Phosphorous bonds to metal parts in the engine to form a ‘sacrificial’ layer that helps protect against engine wear, Smith said.
Mobil could very well be "skimping" down on quality. Wouldn't surprise me at all.
Amsoil, I was told, always bought higher quality zdp than some of the other marketers. I don't know if it's true but it could be along the same lines as this.
The Sequence IVA test evaluates a lubricant’s performance in preventing camshaft lobe wear in an overhead camshaft engine. Taxi cab, light-delivery truck, or commuter service is simulated.
Sequence IVA Test Equipment and Procedure
The Sequence IVA test fixture is a KA24E Nissan 1994 2.4-liter, water-cooled, fuel-injected engine, 4-cylinder in-line, overhead camshaft with two intake valves, and one exhaust valve per cylinder.
The test is a 100-hour test of 100 hourly cycles. Each cycle consists of 2 operating modes or stages. Unleaded “Haltermann KA24E Green” fuel is used.
Sequence IVA Test Results
At the end of the test, each of the 12 cam lobes is measured at 7 locations using a surface profilometer, which measures maximum depth of wear. Measurements of wear on all 7 positions of each lobe are added, then all 12 lobe measurements are averaged for the wear result. This result is the primary evaluation for the test.
At 100 hours, the used oil is evaluated for:
Kinematic viscosity
Fuel dilution
Wear metals iron (Fe), and copper (Cu)
http://www.swri.org/4org/d08/GasTests/IVAtest/default.htm
The test proceedure is above. It would be interesting to see the the response from Valvoline...
Sequence IVA Test Equipment and Procedure
The Sequence IVA test fixture is a KA24E Nissan 1994 2.4-liter, water-cooled, fuel-injected engine, 4-cylinder in-line, overhead camshaft with two intake valves, and one exhaust valve per cylinder.
The test is a 100-hour test of 100 hourly cycles. Each cycle consists of 2 operating modes or stages. Unleaded “Haltermann KA24E Green” fuel is used.
Sequence IVA Test Results
At the end of the test, each of the 12 cam lobes is measured at 7 locations using a surface profilometer, which measures maximum depth of wear. Measurements of wear on all 7 positions of each lobe are added, then all 12 lobe measurements are averaged for the wear result. This result is the primary evaluation for the test.
At 100 hours, the used oil is evaluated for:
Kinematic viscosity
Fuel dilution
Wear metals iron (Fe), and copper (Cu)
http://www.swri.org/4org/d08/GasTests/IVAtest/default.htm
The test proceedure is above. It would be interesting to see the the response from Valvoline...
MolaKule
Staff member
Quote:
I thought Amsoil used base stocks from Lubrisol ?
Lubrizol is an additive supplier, formulator, blender, but not a base oil supplier.
There are two major PAO suppliers those being Chevron and EXOM.
I thought Amsoil used base stocks from Lubrisol ?
Lubrizol is an additive supplier, formulator, blender, but not a base oil supplier.
There are two major PAO suppliers those being Chevron and EXOM.
""ExxonMobil is not aware of any accurate technical data to support the claim that Valvoline SynPower is in any way superior to Mobil 1. All such claims must be substantiated and ExxonMobil has requested Valvoline to provide the substantiating data to support this claim immediately.""
when data becomes avalible then everyone can coment till then is all just hot air.
bruce
when data becomes avalible then everyone can coment till then is all just hot air.
bruce
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