Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 7477 mi., '08 Subaru WRX STI

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: Pablo
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Can we really blame the engine for the fuel dilution? Or could it be the type of service, climate, engine design, and/or conditions? My point is one size doesn't fit all, this car proved it. W/O a UOA following Amsoil's recommendations this engine would have lived a short life. More frequent shorter OCI's would be my recommendation with a less expensive oil. My point is SSO would not have made a year, or 17,500 miles under those conditions.


Your point is the usual. Amsoil does NOT recommend "one size doesn't fit all". In your quest to prove your point your sorta missed bluesubie's post.

Example:

http://www.amsoil.com/mygarage/vehiclelookup.aspx?url2=2008+SUBARU+IMPREZA+F


Your defense as usual...........ADT [Amsoil Defense Team] keeping it real! LOL I guess its best to read their fine print first. So 1 year or 15,000 miles for severe service only applies to "certain applications". Why not just follow the owners manual for OCIs? That would make life so much easier, and in the end the car will be better off.

 

[gathermewool]

Originally Posted By: Pablo
Or just use Amsoil OE or XL.


I tried Amsoil SSO because the extra money and effort is worth it to me to find a long-drain oil for my application. Just because Amsoil SSO didn’t make it as far as I’d hoped doesn’t mean another flavor can’t, but it won’t be until after I give RLI and maybe RL a try before I think of using Amsoil again – nothing against Amsoil, of course. If I do eventually say to heck with all the boutique oils and settle on running a group III, then it’ll be something I can find easily at Walmart or AAP.

Originally Posted By: INDYMAC
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I'd follow Subaru's recommendation for severe service and play it safe with PP, PU, M1, or Edge. JMO


Or just use Amsoil OE or XL.

Fuel dilution is pretty huge here. Maybe find the root cause.


The root cause has already been identified. He needs to move further away from work and move to a warmer climate. 1.73% fuel on a Dyson report is fleet average on mechanically sound engines, from what I've seen. So he did pretty well considering his driving style and environment. The SSO worked well and it should again on this fill.


Exactly, though all tunes, off-the-shelf or professional will maintain the super rich AFR’s while in boost. In the end, it’s worth it to protect the motor despite the oil. However, the off-the-shelf tune has shown to be excessively rich (AFR’s in the mid 10:1) when base-lined using a wide-band O2 sensor – the OEM O2 sensor isn’t very accurate < 11:1, from what I’ve read. If this is the case, then even adding power with a professional tune might lower fuel dilution and allow for longer drains.

Originally Posted By: bluesubie
Didn't I caution you not to go far on SSO.

As for the extended interval comments, Amsoil does not recommend exceeding 3,750 miles with any of their oils in this car. Good oil, but maybe not the best choice for this application. The fuel is probably from the Cobb Off The Shelf map but you know that.

In regard to the new 7,500 mile intervals for 2011's, someone at nasioc spotted some changes in the FSM.

Quote:

C: OIL PIPE
• A dedicated turbo oil supply pipe (circuit) has been adopted.
The use in existing models of a common pipe (with filter) for both the OCV and turbo oil supply pipes, has been changed with adoption of a dedicated turbo oil supply pipe (circuit).

D: AVCS PIPE (RH)
The AVCS pipe (RH) has been changed in order to improve turbo quality.



-Dennis


You did haha. Again, I didn’t plan on running it any longer than 6,500 miles. I was in the shop and could have changed it at 5,700, but figured that was WAY too soon. A month and a half later and I still hadn’t had a chance to change the oil. I could have MADE time, but thought I had a little more of a cushion with Amsoil.

AFA as the Amsoil-recommended 3,750 mile interval is concerned, I believe that’s just them parroting Subaru’s concern with respect to turbo supply line screen clogging, and isn’t based on any empirical data. Also, I’ve asked the question before, but no one seems to be able to answer whether the ’08 STI has a screen upstream of the turbo. I’ve only seen pics of older models and read tons of conjecture, but no evidence.

With respect to the FSM quote, I wonder how the circuit has changed. Does this mean that the DAVCS and turbo feed lines are separate? I wonder how this effects the interval. If the tubing is sized and /or orificed correctly, then will the flow rate really change through the turbo? Hmmm

 

[Pablo]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint


Your defense as usual...........ADT [Amsoil Defense Team] keeping it real! LOL I guess its best to read their fine print first. So 1 year or 15,000 miles for severe service only applies to "certain applications". Why not just follow the owners manual for OCIs? That would make life so much easier, and in the end the car will be better off.


Well you were incorrect.

I tell people all the time extended drains are not for everyone, just like following a 3K interval is not for everyone. You JUST said one size doesn't fit all and now you tell everyone just to follow the manual. Dude, you are hilarious!

I mean that in a nice way. Motorsporting (above), engines with issues, etc and so on are not an area for blind extended intervals. Gathermewool obviously knew this. No harm done.

If I had a say in this I would have all over recommending HDD instead of SSO. Just my .02$

 

[Pablo]

Originally Posted By: gathermewool

AFA as the Amsoil-recommended 3,750 mile interval is concerned, I believe that’s just them parroting Subaru’s concern with respect to turbo supply line screen clogging, and isn’t based on any empirical data. Also, I’ve asked the question before, but no one seems to be able to answer whether the ’08 STI has a screen upstream of the turbo. I’ve only seen pics of older models and read tons of conjecture, but no evidence.


Yeah I doubt empirical data, but there have been issues and prudence led Amsoil to shoot this out in 2008:

https://www.amsoil.com/techservicesbulle...Version%205.pdf

 

[gathermewool]

Originally Posted By: Pablo


If I had a say in this I would have all over recommending HDD instead of SSO. Just my .02$

I actually bought the 10 qts from a member here on Bitog for a good price. Otherwise, I would have gone with either the HD or Euro formula. If/when I try Amsoil again, it'll be either of those.

The issue is still with the mesh screen, not the oil. If any then-API-SM oil was ok to 3750 due to the potential for sludge clogging this screen, then why shouldn't Amsoil be able to go longer, screen or no screen? I'd expect a better oil to take a longer time to break down to the point of sludge formation, so why maintain a longer interval for every other vehicle, but make an exception for the turbo Subies, if the only argument is oil screen clogging...again, due to oil degradation and sludge formation?

AFA as consumption, I have none perceptible. If anything, that would HELP with the extended drains!

 

[demarpaint]

You're pretty funny too, in a nice way.

I guess Amsoil used people to test their products in Subaru vehicles and realized in 08, extended drains weren't a good idea, oh well. When you read all the Amsoil hype, one is lead to believe one size fits all. I mean 1 year 25,000 miles normal service, or 1 year 15,000 miles for severe service. Oh wait that's two sizes, and then the fine print. You got me there!

I think the OP did a bang up job and complimented him above!

 

[SteveSRT8]

Some of us with an agenda against Amsoil are becoming a little overzealous here.

ANY car with an aftermarket tune that is already known to be hard on oil would not qualify for ANY oil manufacturers extended service intervals. Don't underestimate how much additional stress the tune puts on the whole drivetrain, not just the oil.

Cheaper oil and shorter OCI sounds good here. I drive a car with a factory specified 3000 mile interval, and I think it's ridiculously short. But someone who is a lot more familiar with my engine and with tons of developmental testing recommended it, so it becomes (to me) something that you would ignore at your own risk.

Thanks to the OP for posting this data.

 

[bluesubie]

Originally Posted By: gathermewool

With respect to the FSM quote, I wonder how the circuit has changed. Does this mean that the DAVCS and turbo feed lines are separate? I wonder how this effects the interval. If the tubing is sized and /or orificed correctly, then will the flow rate really change through the turbo? Hmmm

Here's a good post by 09rexwagon in nasioc's warranty forum. He's also saying the inlet screen was eliminated after MY 05. Although I thought it was even a little later than that.

Quote:
This just means that there will be a seperate oil supply pipe to the turbo and a separate pipe to the passenger side AVCS solenoid. My hunch is that the AVCS pipe banjo from the block will have a filter screen in it and the banjo from the block for the turbo will not have one. Turbos are cheap....blocks are not. This is likely the reason on the 2010 and earlier EJ25X they didn't eliminate the outlet banjo filters (after 05 they eliminated the inlet banjo filters) because they still want the filtering of the oil going to the AVCS solenoids and back through the block whereas the turbo can probably live fine with the particulate that goes through it as long as it's getting a steady supply of oil. Plus oil discharges back into the sump from the turbo where it will shortly go back into the oil filter.

An interesting point to bring up is how well SN rated conventional oils seem to be doing in UOAs. The performance gap in SN oil between conventional and 'synthetic' is getting awfully tight and yet the price gap is ever growing

. [censored] I'd say that a good portion of SN rated conventionals are probably better than a good portion of the out going SM rated off the shelf synthetics. Just more fuel for the fire that the newly mandated synthetic is due to the extend OCI rather than anything 'needing' synthetic.



-Dennis

 

[PontiacFan]

Originally Posted By: Pablo
Or just use Amsoil OE or XL.


Good Point, maybe his Amsoil Salesman should have asked him about his driving habits.

I am sure most people just call there Amsoil Salesman up and just order whatever oil they want or maybe the most expensive oil Amsoil sells, but in this case it seems the OP would be better off with a cheap dino oil and maybe change it every 3000 miles.

Quote:
Fuel dilution is pretty huge here. Maybe find the root cause.


When a UOA is bad, it seems there are excuses, but when it is good then Amsoil is the greatest.

If I was doing short trip driving like the OP, I would not be using Amsoil, I would just find the cheapest oil at Wal-Mart or when some auto parts store is running a sale. JMO

 

[Turbofig]

Originally Posted By: Pablo
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Can we really blame the engine for the fuel dilution? Or could it be the type of service, climate, engine design, and/or conditions? My point is one size doesn't fit all, this car proved it. W/O a UOA following Amsoil's recommendations this engine would have lived a short life. More frequent shorter OCI's would be my recommendation with a less expensive oil. My point is SSO would not have made a year, or 17,500 miles under those conditions.


Your point is the usual. Amsoil does NOT recommend "one size doesn't fit all". In your quest to prove your point your sorta missed bluesubie's post.

Example:

http://www.amsoil.com/mygarage/vehiclelookup.aspx?url2=2008+SUBARU+IMPREZA+F

I think thats pretty cool amsoil is paying attention, sometimes parts people, companies etc dont know the first thing about their products or what there going into.