Additive to help with direct injection carbon B/U?

[Brons2]

I haven't heard of any major blowback on Ford's EcoBoost, sure some people have reported issues, but for the most part they seem reliable. Now, the early VW/Audi turbo/DI models, I have seen pictures of an inch of crud on the valves after 50,000 miles.

OP: are you sure there's actually an issue here? I would just drive it....

 

[NattyBoh]

Yeah that's guys. I need the other guys DI engines and got turned off initially. But not so much now... Thanks again

 

[roadrunner1]

Just drive and smile, we are on our 2nd ecoboost, with the first being an 2.0 Escape, with zero issues. The current F150 with the 2.7 currently only has 13,000 mi. but has been flawless. I too have read a lot of the horror stories associated with DI, but have never seen or know of anyone with the deposit issue.

I have all of my fuel delivered on-site and the gas is spiked with MMO, one quart to 100 gallons. I don't know if it makes any difference with the newer DI engines or not, but made a huge improvement in the older carburetor engines in the fleet.

 

[RooflessVW]

I don't understand what the big freaking deal is here.

What horror stories?

You may get deposits that affect engine performance at some point in the engine's life. At that point, if you reach that point, you will need a carbon cleaning on the intake valves. Up to that point, you will have enjoyed the benefits of DI: increased power and efficiency.

CARS. NEED. MAINTENANCE.

 

[Jimzz]

Originally Posted By: rooflessVW
I don't understand what the big freaking deal is here.

What horror stories?

You may get deposits that affect engine performance at some point in the engine's life. At that point, if you reach that point, you will need a carbon cleaning on the intake valves. Up to that point, you will have enjoyed the benefits of DI: increased power and efficiency.

CARS. NEED. MAINTENANCE.


Says thew guy with VW in his name.

And I am not sure how doing upkeep is better then not doing it and waiting for it to get so bad it requires pulling a intake or even head to fix. Thats like saying don't change your oil, just wait till your engine blows up and then fix it.
I rather spend $3-$10 and a little time spraying out the throttle body to keep and maintain my performance and mileage vs waiting for it to become a problem and spending hundreds maybe thousands to fix.

 

[RooflessVW]

I'm telling you right here, right now, that nothing you spray in the intake will help or affect your deposits in any way. At 10k miles the deposits are there. They're starting to form and they are CARBON. They're rock-hard. They need MANUAL cleaning with PICKS and MEDIA blasting. They are NOT oily deposits that can be washed away.

It. Doesn't. Work. You're not "doing upkeep," you're "wasting time and money."

Been there, done that, tried a machine and chemicals worth the same amount as some cars.

 

[ziggy]

suppose you spray a whole bottle or half, of berrymans, MMO, valvolibe bluebottle intake cleaner,mixed together,letm it sit a few hours then spray distilled water in it? just an idea i had...

 

[ziggy]

the reason i mentioned the above, the mmo will act as an oil that stixks , and the rest, chemicals thatll stick within the mmo, thus eating away at the carbon.
how about acetone? spray acetone in the intake?

 

[Kamele0N]

Originally Posted By: 09_GXP
Originally Posted By: NattyBoh
So my wife got a new car with a ford 2.0 twin scroll engine and from reading around ( I come from diesels ) it seems that these engine build up carbon due to the direct injection. Is there anything you can add here and there to help with the carbon build up?


If you come from the diesel world and are comfortable with the performance there you will have no concerns about the valves on your gas engine. Diesels have been DI forever and with the massive (relatively speaking) amounts of EGR they have to flow for emissions the intake valves are subjected to a lot more than you will ever see in a gas engine.


DI plus TURBO (wash) is completely different thing..

 

[Kamele0N]

Originally Posted By: ziggy
the reason i mentioned the above, the mmo will act as an oil that stixks , and the rest, chemicals thatll stick within the mmo, thus eating away at the carbon.
how about acetone? spray acetone in the intake?


If I would spray anything into throttle body... That would be water (trough spray nozzle)

 

[Ohle_Manezzini]

Originally Posted By: rooflessVW
I'm telling you right here, right now, that nothing you spray in the intake will help or affect your deposits in any way. At 10k miles the deposits are there. They're starting to form and they are CARBON. They're rock-hard. They need MANUAL cleaning with PICKS and MEDIA blasting. They are NOT oily deposits that can be washed away.

It. Doesn't. Work. You're not "doing upkeep," you're "wasting time and money."

Been there, done that, tried a machine and chemicals worth the same amount as some cars.


You'd be shocked to see what shock cooling can do to crack carbon bits. What cleans isn't the chemistry, it is the shock cooling, be by a bottle of a famous product (waste of money) or specially water.

 

[RooflessVW]

Originally Posted By: Ohle_Manezzini

You'd be shocked to see what shock cooling can do to crack carbon bits. What cleans isn't the chemistry, it is the shock cooling, be by a bottle of a famous product (waste of money) or specially water.


No, I wouldn't be shocked. Because it won't do a thing.

 

[Kamele0N]

If you have ever pulled down head on a engine with headgasket leak...you saw that the most clean cylinder (valves head piston) is that in wich headgasket evolved leak...

 

[Ohle_Manezzini]

Originally Posted By: rooflessVW
Originally Posted By: Ohle_Manezzini

You'd be shocked to see what shock cooling can do to crack carbon bits. What cleans isn't the chemistry, it is the shock cooling, be by a bottle of a famous product (waste of money) or specially water.


No, I wouldn't be shocked. Because it won't do a thing.


Just need to understand the physics to compare the metal dilatation reason to the carbon and you'll see it cracking when heated and subsequent shock cooling...

 

[ziggy]

How about berryman B12? I used that with someone a few years ago, on a plugged up carb on a snoblower, owner used low grade gas. left hard deposits, not black though, memory serves me right, it was crusted light yellow or tan. berryman b 12 took it right off...

 

[RooflessVW]

Alright, again I see experience counts for naught here. I'll stay out of these threads and let you all shoot whatever the [censored] you want into your engines, all the while doing nothing but wasting time and money. Before I go:

I can tell you, having pulled the intake to clean many a valve, that the only deposits that you need to worry about (impacting fuel economy or performance) WILL NOT be removed by anything other than a physical cleaning. On certain engines, they're unpreventable. Delayable, possibly. There are too many variables to be certain. Maybe catch cans help; hard driving certainly seems to help.

Water-methanol injection is popular with big turbo VW, Audi, and BMW tuners... But guess who still needs regular carbon cleaning?

Again, we had a VW 2.0t RUNNING on BG 44k, and it did nothing to the deposits.

Just because you really really want there to be another solution, does not mean one exists...

 

[NattyBoh]

Thanks for the discussion guys. I was merely after something that would allow me to delay the inevitable. Not delay it in terms of putting it off, but doing something NOW to help later on, if that makes sense

 

[Olas]

The only way to stop it is to modify the PCV and EGR systems.
What is your State like with emissions testing?

 

[Bgallagher]

Originally Posted By: ziggy
How about berryman B12? I used that with someone a few years ago, on a plugged up carb on a snoblower, owner used low grade gas. left hard deposits, not black though, memory serves me right, it was crusted light yellow or tan. berryman b 12 took it right off...


B12 is awesome for small machines and older styled engines. The only way to keep a troublesome DI engine behaving is to use top tier fuel, quality oil and change it whatever the manufacturer states. A bottle of techron, gumout or any other PEA cleaner will help but top tier fuel will help more in the long run

 

[WhizkidTN]

For my "Red Sled" which has a hot little 2.0L turbo (pushing 300+HP@crank now), I have a layered approach to the issue:

I use only Top Tier 93 octane gas (mainly Costco and Shell), I run Mobil 1 0W-40 oil with 4K OCI, I have a very good OCC on the PCV, I once a year run Redline SI-1 cleaner in my gas tank and I do have a daily commute of 40 miles (round trip) and do a nice Italian Tune-up wherever possible. I've not yet, to my knowledge, had any performance issues with the intake valve getting carboned up but I have toyed with removing the intake to inspect it. If it is an issue, I would use walnut blasting (aka, like BMW/Audi does) to remove/clean the intake path. I should note that my engine does NOT have an EGR path. It uses the CVVT on intake/exhaust to achieve the same thing, so at least I don't have that pathway.