Yuh, I had a guy at a Midas shop plug a tire on my work van for free. It was a slow leak that had me topping off the tire daily. A well installed plug is fine for a simple nail puncture. Better than running around on a soft tire.
A good guy at a tire store
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Wow..felony huh ? Plugged more than I can remember, never had a leak or failure from a properly plugged tire. The tires wear out before that happens. Plugs may be temporary...but then again so are tires.
Wow. This thread went sideways pretty quick. A big thumbs up to the guy who helped fix a tire is all that this about!
Hello, Yeah, I applaud the Albany Mavis fellow too. Being a big chain I would automatically think everyone within the shadow of the place would be non-caring. I have been changing in my old age though. There are good, helpful people out there.
Heck, if you're on the job and it's an OK to slow day, helping someone out moves the day along.
On the other side of the coin, now that I'm thinking about it, I went into a "Main St. USA" stand alone tire store recently and was condescended to horribly. The mush-to-lies which were coming out of this guy's mouth were stunning.
Patronize the good people and spread the word. It's all you can do when you think about it. Kira
Heck, if you're on the job and it's an OK to slow day, helping someone out moves the day along.
On the other side of the coin, now that I'm thinking about it, I went into a "Main St. USA" stand alone tire store recently and was condescended to horribly. The mush-to-lies which were coming out of this guy's mouth were stunning.
Patronize the good people and spread the word. It's all you can do when you think about it. Kira
First I agree that what the store worker did was a nice thing, seems above beyond what is the norm. So kudos to the store employee.
Second, I too have used the rope/string repairs with good success when used in what's considered a repairable area by Discount Tire published standards. When closer to the edge they have also worked fine except they haven't lasted as long, but even then most I got was a slow leak after a time that I repaired again. So I'll not condemn the rope/string plug repair.
All that said, since Discount Tire came to the area, haven't needed my plug kit. SOP at DT is a plug/patch repair and tire rebalance for no charge whether tire was purchased at DT or not. But service-wise, DT is unlike any tire store I've dealt with previously, or any store for that matter.
Again though, props to the store employee.
Second, I too have used the rope/string repairs with good success when used in what's considered a repairable area by Discount Tire published standards. When closer to the edge they have also worked fine except they haven't lasted as long, but even then most I got was a slow leak after a time that I repaired again. So I'll not condemn the rope/string plug repair.
All that said, since Discount Tire came to the area, haven't needed my plug kit. SOP at DT is a plug/patch repair and tire rebalance for no charge whether tire was purchased at DT or not. But service-wise, DT is unlike any tire store I've dealt with previously, or any store for that matter.
Again though, props to the store employee.
Originally Posted By: travlnman
Wow..felony huh ? Plugged more than I can remember, never had a leak or failure from a properly plugged tire. The tires wear out before that happens. Plugs may be temporary...but then again so are tires.
A plug is on the same level as patching a tire with duct tape.
Wow..felony huh ? Plugged more than I can remember, never had a leak or failure from a properly plugged tire. The tires wear out before that happens. Plugs may be temporary...but then again so are tires.
A plug is on the same level as patching a tire with duct tape.
Guess duct tape would have worked for me then...cause I have put on more than 500K on various vehicles in the last 10 yrs. All at some point in their life have had plugs (properly done)and zero have failed, leaked, or been any problem. I say props to the guy for doing it for free, it build good customer relations. There are way more people driving around on maypops , temp spares, underinflated, overinflated, mismatched tires etc that are a much larger threat to the public at large.
I've generally heard that the proper fix would be a plug and patch combination. It would be either a mushroom shaped patch or a separate plug and patch. I know Goodyear sells assorted kits and of course Rema is the biggest maker of these kits. Some of the kits I see come with industrial diamond coated or carbide reamer bits of different sizes to drill out the puncture area to a specific size to fit a specific plug.
My understanding about reaming out the puncture is to get a considerably better seal with a specific round plug (reduces chance of the belts rusting as well as leaks), and to remove loose strands of steel. A properly done patch prevents loss of air since the inner liner is what keeps a tire from leaking, and that's been compromised.
I personally have never found a place willing to do a plug only. The one time I did find a shop that would do a plug and patch, they refused to so it because it was too close to the sidewall. Another shop said they'd do it since I'd ordered tires there which would be installed in week.
Quote:
http://www.rma.org/wp-content/uploads/prp_wallchart1111.pdf
NEVER perform a tire repair without removing the tire from the rim/wheel assembly for internal inspection. (Do not perform an outside-in tire repair or on-the-wheel repair). It is essential that only a specially trained person remove any tire from the wheel when it has been damaged or is losing air. A thorough inspection for any internal damage can then be made. See WARNINGS.
NEVER use only a plug (stem) or never use only a patch to repair a puncture. The injury must be completely filled with a suitable vulcanizing material or rubber stem and a patch must be applied to the inner liner to prevent air loss.
Quote:
http://www.tirebusiness.com/article/2012...mplate=printart
Among the criteria the RMA recommends for a proper repair are:
* Repairs are limited to the tread area only;
* Puncture injury cannot be greater than 1/4-inch (6mm) in diameter;
* Repairs must be performed by removing the tire from the rim/wheel assembly to perform a complete inspection to assess all damage that may be present;
* Repairs cannot overlap; and
* A rubber stem, or plug, must be applied to fill the puncture injury and a patch must be applied to seal the inner liner. A common repair unit is a one-piece unit with a stem and patch portion. A plug by itself or a patch by itself is an unacceptable repair, the RMA said.
My understanding about reaming out the puncture is to get a considerably better seal with a specific round plug (reduces chance of the belts rusting as well as leaks), and to remove loose strands of steel. A properly done patch prevents loss of air since the inner liner is what keeps a tire from leaking, and that's been compromised.
I personally have never found a place willing to do a plug only. The one time I did find a shop that would do a plug and patch, they refused to so it because it was too close to the sidewall. Another shop said they'd do it since I'd ordered tires there which would be installed in week.
Quote:
http://www.rma.org/wp-content/uploads/prp_wallchart1111.pdf
NEVER perform a tire repair without removing the tire from the rim/wheel assembly for internal inspection. (Do not perform an outside-in tire repair or on-the-wheel repair). It is essential that only a specially trained person remove any tire from the wheel when it has been damaged or is losing air. A thorough inspection for any internal damage can then be made. See WARNINGS.
NEVER use only a plug (stem) or never use only a patch to repair a puncture. The injury must be completely filled with a suitable vulcanizing material or rubber stem and a patch must be applied to the inner liner to prevent air loss.
Quote:
http://www.tirebusiness.com/article/2012...mplate=printart
Among the criteria the RMA recommends for a proper repair are:
* Repairs are limited to the tread area only;
* Puncture injury cannot be greater than 1/4-inch (6mm) in diameter;
* Repairs must be performed by removing the tire from the rim/wheel assembly to perform a complete inspection to assess all damage that may be present;
* Repairs cannot overlap; and
* A rubber stem, or plug, must be applied to fill the puncture injury and a patch must be applied to seal the inner liner. A common repair unit is a one-piece unit with a stem and patch portion. A plug by itself or a patch by itself is an unacceptable repair, the RMA said.
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
The only thing we have is anecdotal evidence.
To put this in perspective, would it be a good idea to compare the rate of tire failures to the rate of tire plug failures? I think so.
Anecdotally, I used plugs for the taxi fleet with good results. Rarely, a plug would leak. As for other issues that are possible with plugs, the taxis had the vast majority of their driving done at city speeds (i.e. under 30 mph). At the time, too, tire lifespan was nowhere near what it is now, either.
The only thing we have is anecdotal evidence.
To put this in perspective, would it be a good idea to compare the rate of tire failures to the rate of tire plug failures? I think so.
Anecdotally, I used plugs for the taxi fleet with good results. Rarely, a plug would leak. As for other issues that are possible with plugs, the taxis had the vast majority of their driving done at city speeds (i.e. under 30 mph). At the time, too, tire lifespan was nowhere near what it is now, either.
Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
The only thing we have is anecdotal evidence.
To put this in perspective, would it be a good idea to compare the rate of tire failures to the rate of tire plug failures? I think so.
Anecdotally, I used plugs for the taxi fleet with good results. Rarely, a plug would leak. As for other issues that are possible with plugs, the taxis had the vast majority of their driving done at city speeds (i.e. under 30 mph). At the time, too, tire lifespan was nowhere near what it is now, either.
This is EXACTLY what I have been saying. If you do enough plugs, you'll start to note plug failures. The number isn't large, and it is difficult to determine if the failure rate is higher than tire failure rate.
My experience says it is an order of magnitude higher.
I'm not saying that you can't get away with using plugs - I have done so myself - but I just want everyone to be aware that there is a risk and sometimes the consequences of a plug failure can be quite tragic. I don't want anyone to be a part of that statistic.
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
The only thing we have is anecdotal evidence.
To put this in perspective, would it be a good idea to compare the rate of tire failures to the rate of tire plug failures? I think so.
Anecdotally, I used plugs for the taxi fleet with good results. Rarely, a plug would leak. As for other issues that are possible with plugs, the taxis had the vast majority of their driving done at city speeds (i.e. under 30 mph). At the time, too, tire lifespan was nowhere near what it is now, either.
This is EXACTLY what I have been saying. If you do enough plugs, you'll start to note plug failures. The number isn't large, and it is difficult to determine if the failure rate is higher than tire failure rate.
My experience says it is an order of magnitude higher.
I'm not saying that you can't get away with using plugs - I have done so myself - but I just want everyone to be aware that there is a risk and sometimes the consequences of a plug failure can be quite tragic. I don't want anyone to be a part of that statistic.
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
This is EXACTLY what I have been saying. If you do enough plugs, you'll start to note plug failures. The number isn't large, and it is difficult to determine if the failure rate is higher than tire failure rate.
For catastrophic failures, that's why I mentioned the fact that taxis stay around 30 mph or less. Around the city, there will be no catastrophe from having a plug fail.
As for the mileage aspect, that was another advantage of plugs. Given that tires would last six months or so on taxi service, given all the miles, and new tires at the time were roughly $50 a piece, the downtime and the price of a proper repair were not worth it.
Now, considering my own vehicles spend much more time on the highway and I use higher end tires than the taxis saw (and tires generally last longer these days), I prefer to go and get a proper fix done. Spending $20 to properly patch a $50 tire that probably has two months' service left is a waste. A $20 fix on a $200 tire on my G is a bargain.
This is EXACTLY what I have been saying. If you do enough plugs, you'll start to note plug failures. The number isn't large, and it is difficult to determine if the failure rate is higher than tire failure rate.
For catastrophic failures, that's why I mentioned the fact that taxis stay around 30 mph or less. Around the city, there will be no catastrophe from having a plug fail.
As for the mileage aspect, that was another advantage of plugs. Given that tires would last six months or so on taxi service, given all the miles, and new tires at the time were roughly $50 a piece, the downtime and the price of a proper repair were not worth it.
Now, considering my own vehicles spend much more time on the highway and I use higher end tires than the taxis saw (and tires generally last longer these days), I prefer to go and get a proper fix done. Spending $20 to properly patch a $50 tire that probably has two months' service left is a waste. A $20 fix on a $200 tire on my G is a bargain.
Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
This is EXACTLY what I have been saying. If you do enough plugs, you'll start to note plug failures. The number isn't large, and it is difficult to determine if the failure rate is higher than tire failure rate.
For catastrophic failures, that's why I mentioned the fact that taxis stay around 30 mph or less. Around the city, there will be no catastrophe from having a plug fail.
Where?
I have a freeway commute most days and see taxis on the freeway quite often. It's mostly airport runs. San Francisco Airport is actually a good 7 miles away from the city itself, and the most practical way to get there is by US-101. I recently did that from the far end of the city, and it's about 13 miles on the freeway. Even in New York City, an airport run from Manhattan to either of the three major airports goes over expressways and bridges.
I certainly understand the worry about blowing out a plug on the highway. I've had a blowout at freeway speeds and the tire was gone within seconds. I haven't had anything crazy like catastrophic loss of control, but who hasn't heard of the Firestone/Explorer fiasco? Of course a compromised plug repair on an otherwise well-built tire shouldn't fall apart like that. Still - I've had fairly good tires like a Continental ExtremeContact DWS or a Dunlop D60M2 shred itself within seconds after a freeway blowout, but with a controllable situation.
And with all that, I've had one [censored] of a time trying to find a place that would do a full patch and plug repair.
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
This is EXACTLY what I have been saying. If you do enough plugs, you'll start to note plug failures. The number isn't large, and it is difficult to determine if the failure rate is higher than tire failure rate.
For catastrophic failures, that's why I mentioned the fact that taxis stay around 30 mph or less. Around the city, there will be no catastrophe from having a plug fail.
Where?
I have a freeway commute most days and see taxis on the freeway quite often. It's mostly airport runs. San Francisco Airport is actually a good 7 miles away from the city itself, and the most practical way to get there is by US-101. I recently did that from the far end of the city, and it's about 13 miles on the freeway. Even in New York City, an airport run from Manhattan to either of the three major airports goes over expressways and bridges.
I certainly understand the worry about blowing out a plug on the highway. I've had a blowout at freeway speeds and the tire was gone within seconds. I haven't had anything crazy like catastrophic loss of control, but who hasn't heard of the Firestone/Explorer fiasco? Of course a compromised plug repair on an otherwise well-built tire shouldn't fall apart like that. Still - I've had fairly good tires like a Continental ExtremeContact DWS or a Dunlop D60M2 shred itself within seconds after a freeway blowout, but with a controllable situation.
And with all that, I've had one [censored] of a time trying to find a place that would do a full patch and plug repair.
Look at my location. That explains it. If a taxi here, particularly back in the day, spent more than 5 minutes at a time over 30 mph, that would be a miracle. To get to our airport, one can do so easily without driving on a road where the speed limit exceeds 30 mph.
As for the Firestone/Explorer fiasco, it became exceedingly clear at the time that some people simply shouldn't be driving.
As for the Firestone/Explorer fiasco, it became exceedingly clear at the time that some people simply shouldn't be driving.
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