5.1 sound bar?

I have heard several sound bars. I don't know what brand or model they were, but I do know that none of them were really high end or expensive. Of the ones I've heard, they all seem to display the same trait; the sound bar itself has sounded good to me, as good or better than the regular speakers used in a typical surround sound system, but the subs that come with them lack the power and punch I'm looking for. I'm used to running a separate powered sub of substantial size and power (i.e. 15" driver and at least 250 watts), so none of the subs that come with the sound bars are going to work for me. I am finding out the only sound bar systems that are capable of connecting to wireless speakers don't have a wired sub out. They can only be used with the wireless sub that comes with them. So my only option appears to be trying to find a sound bar that simulates surround sound. The one my bro-in-law has does this and it seems to do a good job doing it. I can live without rear speakers easier than I can do without a powerful sub...
 
Originally Posted by alarmguy
Well, Your going to have to spend money to get what you want, anytime you buy something ala-cart its going to cost. OR Buy the complete system and simply choose not to use the sub that comes with it, really simple if you think about it. I do question how you are going to fill your big room with sound from a sound bar though. Having a big sub woofer is not going to take the place of all the other sounds. In fact to me, might screw it up. Our room has 16 foot ceilings and never in my life would I think a sound bar is going to satisfy my desire for a theater like environment. But, if sound bar is your thing with compromised sound in a big room, you could always try this, then use your own sub and if you dont like it, return it direct to JBL. https://www.jbl.com/soundbars/JBL+B...ar%205.1_color=Black-USA-Current#start=1 Bottom line (this is ONLY because of your statement of wanting to keep your sub for your large room) you need to move lots of air from the speakers for the midrange and mid bass in a large room not just from the sub, a sound bar doesnt cut it from what you say you want. So keep what you have or buy the sound bar kit, settle for a little less, for the convenance of wires not all over the place. Sort of cant have a Escalade or a Prius budget. But you may be happy with the JBL above.
I tried this system for a sound bar it was ok ended up returning it. I ended up updating my receiver and sub and using my old studio JBL speakers then added two speakers into the ceiling extremely happy with the outcome. Large room and a sound bar didn't work out for me.
 
You could use an audio signal extractor or splitter to get the audio signal to the subwoofer.
 
Quote
That said, the only soundbar that might tempt me is the Sennheiser Ambeo.
Impressive but for that price it needs to cook supper and clean the house while sounding good. grin
 
I'd rather put together a mid range 5.1 system for similar money, but if you want a really excellent soundbar you have to pay to play.
 
Originally Posted by wkcars
You could use an audio signal extractor or splitter to get the audio signal to the subwoofer.
Please elaborate...
 
Originally Posted by grampi
Originally Posted by wkcars
You could use an audio signal extractor or splitter to get the audio signal to the subwoofer.
Please elaborate...
You could take the output from the tv and use a splitter then send the signal to the soundbar and to the subwoofer. Or if the soundbar has an output you could try and find a converter to convert that to whatever the input the subwoofer takes. There's plenty of converters/splitters on amazon depending the inputs and outputs you're working with using something like this https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00BIQER0E/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A2IX3RNQE846HA&psc=1
 
Originally Posted by MCompact
I'd rather put together a mid range 5.1 system for similar money, but if you want a really excellent soundbar you have to pay to play.
I've already been that route. The sound was exceptional, but the look with all of the speakers and wires was just plain ugly and cluttered. Plus, the required HT receiver is another component that has to be added into the system. I love the look of just a sound bar (which pretty much blends in with the TV and the TV stand). No wires are seen and it looks very modern. A sub can be hidden and/or placed to look like a piece of furniture. In-wall speakers would've been my #1 choice if my listening area was more conventionally shaped, but it basically goes from corner to corner, making in-wall mounted speakers impossible. I am seriously considering the Ambeo sound bar...the price is high, but it will do everything and more than a 5.1 or 7.1 system will do all by itself. The company that makes it even claims it puts out powerful, deep bass, so a separate sub may not be needed. If I want to add one, it has a pre-amp sub out. I'm going to do some more searching and see what else is out there...
 
Originally Posted by wkcars
Originally Posted by grampi
Originally Posted by wkcars
You could use an audio signal extractor or splitter to get the audio signal to the subwoofer.
Please elaborate...
You could take the output from the tv and use a splitter then send the signal to the soundbar and to the subwoofer. Or if the soundbar has an output you could try and find a converter to convert that to whatever the input the subwoofer takes. There's plenty of converters/splitters on amazon depending the inputs and outputs you're working with using something like this https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00BIQER0E/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A2IX3RNQE846HA&psc=1
The only audio output my TV has is an optical output. I would need a converter that would convert one output to an RCA pre-amp out, and one to optical as I would still need that to go the sound bar...
 
Originally Posted by grampi
Originally Posted by wkcars
Originally Posted by grampi
Originally Posted by wkcars
You could use an audio signal extractor or splitter to get the audio signal to the subwoofer.
Please elaborate...
You could take the output from the tv and use a splitter then send the signal to the soundbar and to the subwoofer. Or if the soundbar has an output you could try and find a converter to convert that to whatever the input the subwoofer takes. There's plenty of converters/splitters on amazon depending the inputs and outputs you're working with using something like this https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00BIQER0E/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A2IX3RNQE846HA&psc=1
The only audio output my TV has is an optical output. I would need a converter that would convert one output to an RCA pre-amp out, and one to optical as I would still need that to go the sound bar...
Then perhaps use a https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00HQ2R314/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A2IX3RNQE846HA&psc=1 and a https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00KNNSKV0/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?smid=A1L1WUWYKZGTBQ&psc=1 Also be aware that using optical out signal from the tv usually means you won't be able to control the theater speaker volume using the tv volume controls, the tv volume controls still controls the tv volume but you'll need to control the volume of the home theater speakers using the controls for the home theater speakers.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted by wkcars
The only audio output my TV has is an optical output. I would need a converter that would convert one output to an RCA pre-amp out, and one to optical as I would still need that to go the sound bar...
Then perhaps use a https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00HQ2R314/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A2IX3RNQE846HA&psc=1 and a https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00KNNSKV0/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?smid=A1L1WUWYKZGTBQ&psc=1 Also be aware that using optical out signal from the tv usually means you won't be able to control the theater speaker volume using the tv volume controls, the tv volume controls still controls the tv volume but you'll need to control the volume of the home theater speakers using the controls for the home theater speakers.[/quote.] Or if the sound bar accepts an HDMI (ARC) connection, I could use an HDMI out from the sound bar and convert that to RCAs, if that's possible...
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted by grampi
Originally Posted by wkcars
The only audio output my TV has is an optical output. I would need a converter that would convert one output to an RCA pre-amp out, and one to optical as I would still need that to go the sound bar...
Then perhaps use a https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00HQ2R314/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A2IX3RNQE846HA&psc=1 and a https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00KNNSKV0/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?smid=A1L1WUWYKZGTBQ&psc=1 Also be aware that using optical out signal from the tv usually means you won't be able to control the theater speaker volume using the tv volume controls, the tv volume controls still controls the tv volume but you'll need to control the volume of the home theater speakers using the controls for the home theater speakers.[/quote.] Or if the sound bar accepts an HDMI (ARC) connection, I could use an HDMI out from the sound bar and convert that to RCAs, if that's possible...
I'm sure whatever inputs or outputs you're working with there's an extractor, splitter, or converter out there for it lol
 
Originally Posted by nickaluch
Originally Posted by alarmguy
Well, Your going to have to spend money to get what you want, anytime you buy something ala-cart its going to cost. OR Buy the complete system and simply choose not to use the sub that comes with it, really simple if you think about it. I do question how you are going to fill your big room with sound from a sound bar though. Having a big sub woofer is not going to take the place of all the other sounds. In fact to me, might screw it up. Our room has 16 foot ceilings and never in my life would I think a sound bar is going to satisfy my desire for a theater like environment. But, if sound bar is your thing with compromised sound in a big room, you could always try this, then use your own sub and if you dont like it, return it direct to JBL. https://www.jbl.com/soundbars/JBL+B...ar%205.1_color=Black-USA-Current#start=1 Bottom line (this is ONLY because of your statement of wanting to keep your sub for your large room) you need to move lots of air from the speakers for the midrange and mid bass in a large room not just from the sub, a sound bar doesnt cut it from what you say you want. So keep what you have or buy the sound bar kit, settle for a little less, for the convenance of wires not all over the place. Sort of cant have a Escalade or a Prius budget. But you may be happy with the JBL above.
I tried this system for a sound bar it was ok ended up returning it. I ended up updating my receiver and sub and using my old studio JBL speakers then added two speakers into the ceiling extremely happy with the outcome. Large room and a sound bar didn't work out for me.
Yeah, I agree, if and that is if someone wants a theater experience, they are not going to get it from a sound bar but most for most people its good enough, its always been that way, sound for the masses and sound for the bit more discriminating, whatever makes one happy. Just the fact that so many people are happy with streaming music and satellite radio says what is good enough for most people. Nothing wrong with it, we all do what makes us happy. I agree, as you experienced, I wouldn't be happy with the sound bar in my size room, heck Ive been playing movie sound through a hifi system since the almost first Panasonic VHS with HIFI audio came out. And son of a gun, I just did a search and darn, this looks exactly like it ... on eBay no less ... Panasonic Omivision PV-1740 (the good old days *L*) https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Pa...9?hash=item2adcdf12c9:g:n-cAAOSw8o9d~-su (no doubt in my mind this is the model)
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted by alarmguy
[quote=nickaluch][quote=alarmguy] I agree, as you experienced, I wouldn't be happy with the sound bar in my size room, heck Ive been playing movie sound through a hifi system since the almost first Panasonic VHS with HIFI audio came out. And son of a gun, I just did a search and darn, this looks exactly like it ... on eBay no less ... Panasonic Omivision PV-1740 (the good old days *L*)
In the early '90s I was using a Vector Research VHS HIFI VCR with a Carter 6250 receiver and Klipsch KG4 speakers. I still use the KG4s for my front L&R speakers in my 7.1 system.
 
Originally Posted by alarmguy
Yeah, I agree, if and that is if someone wants a theater experience, they are not going to get it from a sound bar but most for most people its good enough, its always been that way, sound for the masses and sound for the bit more discriminating, whatever makes one happy. Just the fact that so many people are happy with streaming music and satellite radio says what is good enough for most people. Nothing wrong with it, we all do what makes us happy. I agree, as you experienced, I wouldn't be happy with the sound bar in my size room, heck Ive been playing movie sound through a hifi system since the almost first Panasonic VHS with HIFI audio came out. And son of a gun, I just did a search and darn, this looks exactly like it ... on eBay no less ... Panasonic Omivision PV-1740 (the good old days *L*) https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Pa...9?hash=item2adcdf12c9:g:n-cAAOSw8o9d~-su (no doubt in my mind this is the model)
It depends on which sound bar you're talking about, and the room it's in. The one my bro-in-law has is a $159 Samsung, not a high end unit at all, and I was shocked at how well it sounds. It's as clear as any speakers, and it does a good job at projecting directional sounds. It can makes sounds sound like they're coming 90 degrees left or right. About the only thing it can't do is reproduce the sounds coming from directly behind the listener, and it doesn't have voice enhancement, which is a feature I want. There are sound bars now that will do 5.1 and 7.1, and do it effectively. Maybe a professional audiophile can hear the difference between a good sound bar and a full surround system, but I have heard sound bars that sound just as good, thing is, I don't know if I want to spend that much $$$ on one...
 
Originally Posted by grampi
Originally Posted by alarmguy
Yeah, I agree, if and that is if someone wants a theater experience, they are not going to get it from a sound bar but most for most people its good enough, its always been that way, sound for the masses and sound for the bit more discriminating, whatever makes one happy. Just the fact that so many people are happy with streaming music and satellite radio says what is good enough for most people. Nothing wrong with it, we all do what makes us happy. I agree, as you experienced, I wouldn't be happy with the sound bar in my size room, heck Ive been playing movie sound through a hifi system since the almost first Panasonic VHS with HIFI audio came out. And son of a gun, I just did a search and darn, this looks exactly like it ... on eBay no less ... Panasonic Omivision PV-1740 (the good old days *L*) https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Pa...9?hash=item2adcdf12c9:g:n-cAAOSw8o9d~-su (no doubt in my mind this is the model)
It depends on which sound bar you're talking about, and the room it's in. The one my bro-in-law has is a $159 Samsung, not a high end unit at all, and I was shocked at how well it sounds. It's as clear as any speakers, and it does a good job at projecting directional sounds. It can makes sounds sound like they're coming 90 degrees left or right. About the only thing it can't do is reproduce the sounds coming from directly behind the listener, and it doesn't have voice enhancement, which is a feature I want. There are sound bars now that will do 5.1 and 7.1, and do it effectively. Maybe a professional audiophile can hear the difference between a good sound bar and a full surround system, but I have heard sound bars that sound just as good, thing is, I don't know if I want to spend that much $$$ on one...
I think you mean emulate 5.1 and 7.1 wink There is no way you are getting 5 or 7 discrete speaker positions from something that exclusively sits in front of the listener. However, you can certainly make it sound like you have a broader sound stage and even cast placement of sounds to emulate one of those setups reasonably effectively, which I believe is what you are actually saying. I've installed both the Sonos sound bar as well as the Paradigm one and while they both sound good, my 3.1 setup sounds significantly better in terms of providing a full-range sound experience, something you simply cannot replicate with drivers the size of those in a sound bar.
 
Something else that makes this selection process difficult is most of these sound bars aren't available for auditioning. Sure, I can go to Best Buy and listen to what they have, but usually their highest end units are made by Bose, which I think Bose is more name than performance. There's also Fry's, but their selection of high end stuff isn't that great either. The brick and mortar audio stores are few and far between, and those that sell high end stuff like the Sennheiser Ambeo are almost non-existent. You have to base your choices on the online reviews. I'm not real keen on forking over $1500 or more for a speaker I've never heard. I suppose I could go the Crutchfield route where they a have a no questions asked 30 day return policy, and I can just keep trying different sound bars until I find one I like. Either way, the process looks like it's going to be a long one...
 
Originally Posted by OVERKILL
Originally Posted by grampi
Originally Posted by alarmguy
Yeah, I agree, if and that is if someone wants a theater experience, they are not going to get it from a sound bar but most for most people its good enough, its always been that way, sound for the masses and sound for the bit more discriminating, whatever makes one happy. Just the fact that so many people are happy with streaming music and satellite radio says what is good enough for most people. Nothing wrong with it, we all do what makes us happy. I agree, as you experienced, I wouldn't be happy with the sound bar in my size room, heck Ive been playing movie sound through a hifi system since the almost first Panasonic VHS with HIFI audio came out. And son of a gun, I just did a search and darn, this looks exactly like it ... on eBay no less ... Panasonic Omivision PV-1740 (the good old days *L*) https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Pa...9?hash=item2adcdf12c9:g:n-cAAOSw8o9d~-su (no doubt in my mind this is the model)
It depends on which sound bar you're talking about, and the room it's in. The one my bro-in-law has is a $159 Samsung, not a high end unit at all, and I was shocked at how well it sounds. It's as clear as any speakers, and it does a good job at projecting directional sounds. It can makes sounds sound like they're coming 90 degrees left or right. About the only thing it can't do is reproduce the sounds coming from directly behind the listener, and it doesn't have voice enhancement, which is a feature I want. There are sound bars now that will do 5.1 and 7.1, and do it effectively. Maybe a professional audiophile can hear the difference between a good sound bar and a full surround system, but I have heard sound bars that sound just as good, thing is, I don't know if I want to spend that much $$$ on one...
I think you mean emulate 5.1 and 7.1 wink There is no way you are getting 5 or 7 discrete speaker positions from something that exclusively sits in front of the listener. However, you can certainly make it sound like you have a broader sound stage and even cast placement of sounds to emulate one of those setups reasonably effectively, which I believe is what you are actually saying. I've installed both the Sonos sound bar as well as the Paradigm one and while they both sound good, my 3.1 setup sounds significantly better in terms of providing a full-range sound experience, something you simply cannot replicate with drivers the size of those in a sound bar.
Yes, I meant simulate. Maybe my hearing has deteriorated enough that I can't tell the difference anymore, but the sound bars I've heard sound good enough that I'm willing to give up the cluttered mess of running separate speakers and all the wiring. Isn't a 3.1 system just left, right, center, and sub? A sound bar, or least the ones I'm looking at, simulate 5.1 or 7.1, and in my system the .1 will be a separate sub (I'm looking at the HSU VTF-3 MK5 HP)...depending on which sound bar I end up with, it should sound pretty darn good...
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted by grampi
Yes, I meant simulate. Maybe my hearing has deteriorated enough that I can't tell the difference anymore, but the sound bars I've heard sound good enough that I'm willing to give up the cluttered mess of running separate speakers and all the wiring. Isn't a 3.1 system just left, right, center, and sub? A sound bar, or least the ones I'm looking at, simulate 5.1 or 7.1, and in my system the .1 will be a separate sub (I'm looking at the HSU VTF-3 MK5 HP)...depending on which sound bar I end up with, it should sound pretty darn good...
Most decent soundbars have a SW Out RCA jack, so you should be good to go. I'm still using my 15 year old Hsu Research VTF-3R sub. Only 250 watts RMS, but it still sounds impressive. [Linked Image]
 
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