quote:
Originally posted by JohnBrowning:
That is great that a very very small number of Domestic V8's last a long time. I doubt any one would argue that point! I think what is in question is what is the norm for these power trains not the exceptions. It is not the norm for any one with a GM powertrain to hit 300,000-400,000 as a matter of normalicy if it was then these numbers would be meaningless to use. THeir is absolutely no reason under the sun that all engines and transmissions under moderate use should not hit 200,000-300,000 miles as a matter of routine but I am sure we all know that this does not routinely happen. THeir is no reason that the automotic transmission should not hit 200,000-300,000 with no problems at all. Once again we all know that this is not the case! Just as important is how many starters, alternators, water pumps, gasket set, power steering pumps, window regulators, HVAC control heads, sealed hubs, rotors and transmission they have gone through in that 300,000 miles!
Now of us can corralate a given PPM of wear with a millage life expectancy for a power train! I think it is preety silly though for someone not to at least acknoldge that greater wear metals PPM in a UOA indicates greater wear! Once you acknoldge that greater wear metal PPM in UOA indicates greater wear then lower PPM of wear metal must indicate lower wear! If low wear is good wich it is in my book then any company produceing engines that consistently produce low PPM of wear metal in UOA would be an improvement!
I once bought a FOrd Tempo that nickled and dimed me to death. I cared for that car just as well as any other I have ever owned. It is the only car I have ever owned that was DOA at 100,000 miles. It is the only car or truck that I have owned that I had to rebuild the engine at 50,000 miles on. WIth all of this said I never felt the need to lie to myself to justify my rotten purchase decission. I never felt the need to feel good about buying the thing. It was what it was and I do not feel like any less of a man for haveing bough a lemon!
If changeing the oil every 3000 miles was all it took to get an engine that lasts 475,XXX miles then the aftermarket engine business would fold and the new car industry would collapse as well!
From 1971 to 2004 my Family has only had to take Toyota to the dealership twice for work and both times the repairs were under warranty. Once for a transmission input seal leak on my Dads 1995 Tacoma and once for my Mom's 2003 Tundra front axle shift interloc solinoid/actuator. Both vechiles were made here in America. I do not think we have ever traded or sold a vechile with less then 200,000 miles on it. We have never had to do anything other then routine maintence ie oil, filters, O2 senor, brakes. 60% of my friends also owned Toyotas and had the same experince as me.
On the other hand me my 2001 Dakota as much as I loved it had to go to the dealership not less then 6 times for recalls. In addition to the recalls had to take it in for fuel cap failure and my evap/purge lines kept craking. I also had to take it in for alinment issues in the first 12,000 miles and it would get out of alingment about every 6000 miles.
A guy I work with has had his GMC in the shop for warranty work about 30 times not counting TSB's.His engine started knocking at 26,000 miles. Turns out their is a TSB explaining this. The factory installed the wrong bearings on his mains. The dealer claimed that the knoc was just piston slap and did not affect durability. We did not find the TSB until it was out of warranty.He has around 50,000 miles and his truck sounds like a diesel at start up. His 2000 Venture Van is a rattle trap and will die for an unknown reason all the time. He has had it to the dealer alot and they can not figure it out. The passanger side window regulator does not work either. He is trying to sell it. It has around 20,000 miles on it. Know he has to replace his water pump and idler pulley.
He changes his oil every 3000 with 5W30 Quaker State Peak Performance. He changes his trany fluid every year with QS Dex III.
I have another friend from work with Malibu that had to have the intake manifold and gaskets changed 3-4 times under warranty due to coolant leaks. Luckily he purchased the extended 100,000 mile warranty.
Another friend's husband just bought an Avalanch(sp) that is a year old. He hopped up on the tail gate to unload some cargo and the tail gate collapsed. It was rusted through from the inside.
I gurantee that for every exception their is 1000 stories like the ones above.
Right now 10,000 I4 and I5 Canyon and COlorado engines are being sent back to the plant to be reworked. They went out to be installed at the production facility and they found out that none of the engines would run. THey mixed up the I4 and I5 ignition modules and they are not sure what else might have been mixed up. So 10,000 units are being reworked. I saw the converted area that is to be used so far they had 4 stations set up. Last year their was the tensioner problem with the I6 Vortec 4200. They installed the timeing chain tensioner backwards. Then you have the o-ring on the Gen III oil pick up tube problems.......... The list goes on and on.
If your engine and transmission doe not last 200,000-300,000 with out major power train issues then the company that built it has failed you unless you have abused it! If most of the cars other parts do not last at least as long then the same is true.
I am going to guess that TS see's more UOA then most of us. THe expections are not the rule and that is what we should be concerned with!
