2019 Odyssey Elite - Dealer used wrong transmission fluid

[mfdengineer]

I posted this on another forum and was recommended to post here. I really would like to know the affects the Type 3.1 fluid could have on the function and operation of the transmission. I should have just changed myself like I started to do but you'd think the dealership would do better than this.

Hello all. My wife has a 2019 Odyssey Elite that has the 10 speed transmission in it. The maintenance minder noted it was due for trans fluid change so I decided to take it to the local dealer where it was bought to have it done. I started to do it myself but decided not to because of it being a new transmission. When it was picked up today, the invoice clearly states that they used 4 quarts of Type 3.1 fluid (08200-9017). The owners manual clearly states to use Type 2 in the Elite and Touring. I would have confronted the service manager but due to our schedules, the wift paid over the phone and the van was picked up after hours. Has anyone had this kind of experience and if so, how did you address it. Should the vehicle be towed back to the dealership for a flush and fill of the correct fluid? Thanks for any input!

 

[meep]

Wow. Im not aware of this fluid for honda. I thought they were Z-1 and DW-1, with DW1 being the newer.

i would call them in the morning and ask what they wish to do. Since they documented what they put in it, you've got a papertrail.

be kind... it could be an acceptable spec.

m

 

[Hall]

Looks like they are distinct fluids - Type 3.1 for 9-speeds and Type 2.0 for 10-speeds. I bet they'll tell you it's a paperwork error and the technician used the "right" fluid after all.

 

[atikovi]

A 2019 should still be under warranty for many more miles.

 

[slacktide_bitog]

Welcome to BITOG

Wow. Im not aware of this fluid for honda. I thought they were Z-1 and DW-1, with DW1 being the newer.

i would call them in the morning and ask what they wish to do. Since they documented what they put in it, you've got a papertrail.

be kind... it could be an acceptable spec.

m

Honda started using ZF transmissions recently, which can't use Z1 or DW1. Honda's in-house automatic transmissions are more like automated manual transmissions and don't have planetary gears like traditional automatics such as the ones they buy from ZF. The Z1 and DW1 fluids are heavy on zinc, in fact too much to use in a non-Honda transmission.

The 9-speed is the ZF9 used in many FWD cars including other Hondas and many Chryslers.

The 10-speed transmission is a Honda in-house design that finally uses planetary gears.

 

[Gyro Gearloose]

This is a link to an older bulletin that explains the 3.1 fluid has additives specially formulated for the 9 speed transmission. https://honda.oemdtc.com/451/new-atf-and-fluid-naming-convention-honda . The interesting note is that it not backward compatible. Seems like that would apply to a fluid labeled Type 2.0. You might get a hint at what they really used by looking at the price on the invoice. Type 3.1 fluid is $25-30 / quart. That pricing is more like distilled adult beverages than oil. Type 2.0 is more around $10/qt.

 

[Drew7a]

Yes the 3.1 fluid is really rebadged ZF fluid for the 9 speeds only.

2.0 fluid is for the 10 speeds.

A lot of people myself included have used maxlife in place of the dw1, z-1 and 3.1 fluids with no ill effects. Not sure about the 2.0 fluid as it is fairly new. I don’t think you would have a catastrophic failure but I would get them to do a minimum of a 3x D&F to put the correct fluid in at their cost.

 

[HyundaiAbuser]

if you can get a free flush by it, Park it on their doorstep and refuse to take no for an answer.

 

[CharBaby]

Take that thing back to the dealer and DEMAND that they do it correctly.

 

[mfdengineer]

UPDATE: Spoke with service today at lunch. The short of it is that the bill is wrong and they put the correct fluid in. According to him, the parts that are used are scanned and recorded on the parts side, and they confirmed that they used Type 2.0 fluid. They are going to refund me the $65 difference in the cost of the fluid. My problem is that I have lost all confidence in this dealer and still am not sure what fluid is in this vehicle. The service manager was out so I left him a message to call me regarding this service visit. At this point I don't know how they can prove what they put in the vehicle so I don't know how I can be satisfied with this. How can they scan the correct fluid but the bill be printed up wrong? Seriously, what gives?

It even states they used 3.1 fluid on the Honda Owners online maintenance record.

 

[slacktide_bitog]

UPDATE: Spoke with service today at lunch. The short of it is that the bill is wrong and they put the correct fluid in. According to him, the parts that are used are scanned and recorded on the parts side, and they confirmed that they used Type 2.0 fluid. They are going to refund me the $65 difference in the cost of the fluid. My problem is that I have lost all confidence in this dealer and still am not sure what fluid is in this vehicle. The service manager was out so I left him a message to call me regarding this service visit. At this point I don't know how they can prove what they put in the vehicle so I don't know how I can be satisfied with this. How can they scan the correct fluid but the bill be printed up wrong? Seriously, what gives?

It even states they used 3.1 fluid on the Honda Owners online maintenance record.

Do you notice any difference in the way it drives?

 

[mfdengineer]

Do you notice any difference in the way it drives?

I didn't drive it home the 8 mile trip. The wife did but she said she didn't notice anything unusual.

 

[zrxkawboy]

Bad situation, for sure.

 

[Snowflake White]

UPDATE: Spoke with service today at lunch. The short of it is that the bill is wrong and they put the correct fluid in. According to him, the parts that are used are scanned and recorded on the parts side, and they confirmed that they used Type 2.0 fluid. They are going to refund me the $65 difference in the cost of the fluid. My problem is that I have lost all confidence in this dealer and still am not sure what fluid is in this vehicle. The service manager was out so I left him a message to call me regarding this service visit. At this point I don't know how they can prove what they put in the vehicle so I don't know how I can be satisfied with this. How can they scan the correct fluid but the bill be printed up wrong? Seriously, what gives?

It even states they used 3.1 fluid on the Honda Owners online maintenance record.

I wouldn't trust them on that.

I had our Ford dealer put Mercon LV in a transmission that required Ford branded Mobil 3309, I even had the SW put specifically on the RO
and to make sure it was the correct fluid, I went home and checked the fluid and sure enough it was RED mercon LV. The proper fluid is clear to
slightly gold.

I went back and confronted them and I watched them put the correct fluid in. While the other fluid might not destroy the unit immediately it will probably shorten the life of it somewhat.

I'd be interested to know if there is a color difference between the DW-1 and Type 2? Anyone. I wouldn't be surprised if they still put DW-1 in that car.

 

[Hall]

I bet they'll tell you it's a paperwork error and the technician used the "right" fluid after all.

The short of it is that the bill is wrong and they put the correct fluid in.

No one was willing to take my bet

the parts that are used are scanned and recorded on the parts side

I think what they mean is their parts counter/workers scanned 'x' bottles of Type 2 fluid and referenced your work order (??). It doesn't mean the two systems are linked though and that that fluid (type and quantity) get transferred to the service side.

It even states they used 3.1 fluid on the Honda Owners online maintenance record.

That comes from the service record.

 

[slacktide_bitog]

I wouldn't trust them on that.

I had our Ford dealer put Mercon LV in a transmission that required Ford branded Mobil 3309, I even had the SW put specifically on the RO
and to make sure it was the correct fluid, I went home and checked the fluid and sure enough it was RED mercon LV. The proper fluid is clear to
slightly gold.

I went back and confronted them and I watched them put the correct fluid in. While the other fluid might not destroy the unit immediately it will probably shorten the life of it somewhat.

I'd be interested to know if there is a color difference between the DW-1 and Type 2? Anyone. I wouldn't be surprised if they still put DW-1 in that car.

3309 is red according to Mobil

Also, I don't think the LV will cause any problems in an Aisin TF60

 

[mfdengineer]

Ok I drained about an ounce out into a small container. It is clearly red in color. I did browse youtube and found a video of a guy changing the fluid in his ZF9 with Type 3.1. Its a clear/gold color.

I also looked up the MSDS sheets on both. They clearly have different ingredients. I was hoping it would indicate the fluid color but neither did.

 

[michael007]

the msds for 3.1 says the colour - clear

https://www.collegehillshonda.com/sds/08200-9017sds.pdf

page 8

 

[mfdengineer]

the msds for 3.1 says the colour - clear

https://www.collegehillshonda.com/sds/08200-9017sds.pdf

page 8

View attachment 50924

Good catch. I missed it. I looked over the one for 2.0 but all I found was "liquid"

 

[michael007]

Good catch. I missed it. I looked over the one for 2.0 but all I found was "liquid"

same here.

So according to amsoil, the total capacity is 8.3-8.5L and they would have drained and filled 4.3L-4.5L

That red colour looks pretty dark. I'm guessing it would be lighter if half of it was mixed with clear/golden fluid but of course, I could be wrong

https://www.amsoil.ca/lookup/auto-a...cyl-engine-code-j35y7-2/?volume=metric-volume