2009 Ford Escape ATF foamed, blew, hardened

[patfrompagosa]

There seems to be a problem with RV towing, although allowed by Ford for the 2009 Escape. The factory fill Mercon LV ATF seems to foam and blow out, overheat and harden, killing the trans (6F35).

Mine overheated under RV tow, and blew the ATF, but was still driveable. The dealership mechanics found foreign matter (resembling a cross between a cigar butt and a sponge). Still, they said Ford wouldn't allow removal of the pan under warranty. They replaced a supposedly leaky cooler and refilled to the low mark as Ford spec'd in a new TSB. They didn't flush despite some obvious discoloration of the normally colorless Mercon LV. I think there might be some suspended fine black matter, but my vision is not the best. They didn't replace the filter.

So, I'm thinking I ought to have the filter replaced, and the trans flushed and filled. Does anyone know if there are alternatives to the factory fill ATF that might have more antifoaming agents and resist high temps and oxidation better? I guess it would still need to meet or exceed Mercon LV specs, for warranty.

Thanks
Pat

 

[unDummy]

You shouldn't tow RV's with your Escape!!!

Funny, this transmission was engineered to be splash lube itself when 'flat towed'.

So, their fix is to 'underfill' the unit!!!

I would look at Amalie universal, Amsoil ATL, and Redline D6.

Is it FWD or AWD?

 

[PandaBear]

The problem is Mercon LV is a low viscosity grade that may not be available in other formulation.

If you put a non-certified fluid in there and it fail, warranty may be voided.

Just change it more often yourself via the cooler tubing or drain/refill. That's all I would do if I were you. (15k maybe?)

 

[patfrompagosa]

V6-6F35-AWD
Yes, I can tow an RV if it is under 3600 lbs

Besides underfilling, they now require restarting and running through the gears every 250 miles or 6 hours while on the RV tow. That's inconvenient, but but not impossible.

I'll look into the ATFs you mention.

Thanks
Pat

 

[patfrompagosa]

Looks like the Amalie doesn't claim to meet Mercon LV, while the Redline is ambigous.

The Amsoil claims to meet it, so it might be a possibility.

The Mercon LV is supposed to be 150,000 mile before change. Yeah, OK. 15,000 might just be often enough in the real world!

Thanks,
Pat

 

[JTK]

Pat, what you describe are the symptoms of overloading and overheating an AT (ATF blowing out the vent). I would put a larger auxiliary ATF cooler on it. I thought the Escape didn't have a removable pan on the trans? ie, vertically split case?

Joel

 

[patfrompagosa]

Joel,

Somewhere I have a diagram of the AT, I don't know about the split case/pan, but I'll look. In that case, looks like flush and fill is all I can do.

Regarding the overheating: The specific experience I have is the RV towing issue. First clue was seeing an impressive oil/dust film on the back window and tailgate when I pulled up to refuel the RV. Other folks report dense smoke/spray and people waving madly at them. My Escape started and ran, smelling oily. I just figured it was interstate crud from driving/towing after the first rain in a while.

People on RV/Ford forums report failure to start after towing. Some just had cooler replacements, most report transmission replacement. One guy is on his 3rd replacement.

My Escape ran OK, no transmission stumbles or shift problems. But, 250 miles of driving (the Escape) later, I saw a drip on the driveway and checked levels. The ATF was below the stick. There was a piece of tan rag/sponge-like material wrapped aroung the dipstick (1/8" x 1/2" x 1/2"). I suspected packing material left in the filler (bad morale at an assembly plant?)

A nearby dealer had me tow it in. They replaced the cooler, and found a chunk that looked like a cross between a cigar butt and a sponge. I'm guessing it was ATF foaming, followed by overheating and oxidizing. Maybe due to oil breakdown, gases or the air in the foam caused it to blow (out the filler). Then, some of the remaining fluid cooled and hardened into the cigar butt.

Folks on the ford forums say they measured elevated case temps. They say there is a thermostatic valve that prevents circulation from the AT to the cooler unless under power - so a bigger or better cooler won't help.

Me, I'm just glad for the warranty period! This is a nice AWD, and I guess I'll tow and blow until Ford finds a good fix. Meantime, I was hoping for a more stable ATF. But, as Pandabear said above, optional formulations are limited in the low velocity products.

 

[WishIhadatruck]

I'm confused, are you towing the Escape with a motorhome or are you pulling a travel trailer with the Escape?

 

[JustinH]

What temperature is the ATF getting to under heavy load?

I would strongly suggest a very LARGE transmission cooler to be added on to this vehicle, to keep the ATF under 200 Fahrenheit.

I usually buy from bulk-part.com..

On this vehicle, you should be able to get the ATF temperature from the obd2 port, or hook up another gauge.

 

[patfrompagosa]

WishIhadatruck,

The problem is caused by towing the Escape behind an RV.

I apologize for the bad jokes between myself and unDummy above, that is what caused your confusion.

Pat From Pagosa

 

[patfrompagosa]

JustinH

My Scangauge is parked 500 miles away on my RV. I'll be reunited with it after thanksgiving. I was reading another forum (supermileage people), where better experts than me are looking into the OBD string, and so far cannot find it. Another guy is looking into a remote read radioing it to his RV while towing.

I have to agree with you and Joel. It looks like the ATF is breaking down - has to be getting hot as heck. Ford's fix is designed to minimize the gears stirring it into a foam, and then designed to cool it down again after a few hours. Pandabear suggested changing the fluid OFTEN if the heating can't be minimized or prevented in the first place.

 

[badtlc]

Schaeffers #204 Supreme ATF meets the Mercon LV and has a license number for it.

 

[patfrompagosa]

Badtic,
I found Schaeffer's license for Mercon V, but not for LV. Looks like a good product, but would worry about the warranty without that cert.
Thanks,
Pat

 

[unDummy]

Problem is that you need to drill/tap a couple fittings and plumb an external e-pump to move some ATF through a cooler separately from the OE plumbing. Obviously, splash lubrication when towed behind your RV is not cutting it(Hint: its providing the lubrication needed but not the cooling since no pump is working). Ford forgot to hire you for some of their millions of dollars/hrs/miles of testing. Guess something got overlooked. RV owners seemed to have figured out the problem pretty quickly!!!!

Am I missing something or is OE testing really that pathetic???
BTW, I have higher expectations for Ford. Ouch!

Its either that or you need to stop racing your RV from your vacation spots.

Exercise the warranty as needed.

 

[wgtoys]

I wouldn't flat-tow a vehicle which had such obvious problems when doing so. If it is getting hot enough to boil the fluid, it is getting hot enough to do real damage. A dolly, flatbed trailer or different vehicle seems to be called for. It sounds like Ford messed up when they okayed that vehicle for long distance flat towing.

 

[JTK]

Originally Posted By: patfrompagosa
WishIhadatruck,

The problem is caused by towing the Escape behind an RV.



Gotcha. I though it was the other way around. Is the Escape designed/rated by Ford to be towed flat? I know lots of 4x4/AWD vehicles are by simply placing the transfer case in neutral. The transmission is completely disconnected then. Even the GM T360 chassis (Trailblazer) has this. You rotate and hold the 4x4 selector knob all the way to the right until the little (normally unseen) "N" light lights up.

Joel

 

[patfrompagosa]

I have to agree I should have ignored Ford's stated warranty that it would be towable, and purchased something else. I had an early production Corvair almost 50 years back. It was an oil leaking, spraying, smoker. From that, I should have known better than to buy first production year.

The Escape was at a nice price, and an American build. I do need AWD for snow and need "low" weight. An Escape hybrid would have worked (far different trans situation), but it is $5K more expensive and another 750 lb heavier.

A dolly is not allowed for the Escape. It is either 4 on the ground or 4 on a trailer. I am trying to downsize, so do not want a trailer.

I perhaps should have bought a Honda CRV. They are towable 4 down.

I am also considering an external oil pump. Another guy on a Ford forum, with this problem, has been talking to Remco. I hate to add more and non-standard parts, but this might be the only way to get what I need.

 

[RF Overlord]

I'm confused...I don't do any towing, so please forgive the naive question, but I have friends who tow and may be interested in this topic.

How does ATF overheat when the vehicle isn't under its own power? I though most of the heat was produced by the torque converter and the fact that the fluid was doing "work" by transferring energy from the motor. If the transmission doesn't overheat while driving under its own power, why does it overheat when doing less work?

 

[patfrompagosa]

RF Overlord:

I am going to need to allow someone who understands AWD better than I do to answer the How/Why part of your overheating question. The only part I understand is that lowering the ATF level stops the gears from whipping up so much foam (Ford's "fix").

Someone summarized the forums (Who/What/When/Where) at this link:

http://www.ireport.com/docs/DOC-348195

Pat

 

[JTK]

RF, I think it's because with the drive wheels on the ground, the prop shaft is spinning the driven end of the transmission, w/out the pump forcing any ATF around the internals.

Joel