2008 Sienna 270k mi;

[icucicu]

Hi,

Short story short, my dumb ass forgot that my 08 Sienna has been burning 0.5 qt of oil per 1k mile consistently since I bought it, and I didn't top it off.
According to my wife who drives the van, it started knocking on startups for 1 to 2 seconds when there was around 7000 miles on the oil (would be 2.5 qts of oil left). The engine got louder during acceleration too. At 8000 miles on the oil I finally did an oil drain & refill, and only recovered ~2 qts of dark used oil. Crap! Capacity on this V6 2GR-FE is 6.4 qts.

With 6.4 qts of new oil in, the knock on startup went away, and most of the noise. The engine is still more noisy than 10k miles ago, I think. I performed an oil analysis on the 2 qts of remaining used oil. Results below, it showed high Fe/Al/Cu, poor wear.

Any way to guess how many more miles this engine could last? Will it start grenading itself over the next 10k miles, in which case I need to start shopping for a new engine/vehicle ASAP?
270k miles currently, I just put 1k mile on after the oil change, seemingly no issues so far except the slightly noisier engine.

 

[walterjay]

No way to really know. A relative ran their Hyundai SantaFe pretty much out of oil. It was banging and knocking for lack of oil. We did an oil change like you and added some Liqui-Moly MOs2. Motor ran ok. She used it for another 18 months driving it on the interstate 3-4 times a week for about 30 miles each way. Whenever oil was changed added some Liqui-Moly. Eventually the transmission went bad but the motor was still running ok.

Of course after this I recommend Liqui-Moly for your engine. Good luck.

 

[ctechbob]

Yep, hard to say. Wife ran her 2000 Accord pretty much completely out of oil. I filled, drove and drained it and it was massive bronze sparkles, but the car made no abnormal noise. That Honda engine kept on for several months after with not even a single knock until they were rear ended by a box van and destroyed the car.

How long would it have gone? No clue, but I think engines can be a lot tougher than you think.

 

[JavierH19]

I once put 2 quarts in my 6 quart 6.0 v8 after a change and with a dry filter so it was probably 1.7-1.8 quarts in reality. I started it thinking it would build pressure then drop which i'd then add a half quart and try again since I wanted to see how little oil these engines need to run. Surprisingly with that small amount the engine never lost oil pressure and i was revving and holding 3k. Got out to hear it and it sounded quiet as always.

Engines can get away with a small amount of oil. Did you cut the filter open to see what was in it? If that engine were mine i'd run nothing but 40 or 50 grade. You can run up to 20w-50 in those engines. I'd use 0/5w-40 year round.

 

[JunkdrawerDog]

My aunt used to wait until the low oil pressure light came on to get an oil change. She thought it was an oil change reminder. I don't know how long this went on until she was clued in. Car ran on for years until rust claimed it.

 

[Kurtatron]

Probably wasn’t a true knock if the noise goes away with an oil change. Knock usually happens at start up or operating temp. Doesn’t go away with oil. Probably shaved off a few years of life, but I wouldn’t be surprised if you get another 20k miles.

 

[samven]

Well at least it did not lock up and lucky nothing an engine needs to run is affected by the oil. Air,Fuel and Spark still happen as long as it can turn. But if I had to guess I would say if it used .5 qt/1k, in a short time it will be using 1 qt/1k and I would think the compression would be down causing it to use a bit more gas and less power. That said it may continue to run for many thousands of miles like that.

 

[BigCahuna]

Well if it was mine, being as old as it is, I would change the oil to a heavier grade. That should cover the knock, and cut the consumption. Drive it like a funeral director and hope for a few more miles.,,,

 

[SOUNDMAN5000]

Well let me put it like this, Many years ago I knew a young lady who allowed her Dodge van to get down to about 2 quarts.
She had recently purchased that used high millage van ( she was young with sub prime financing ) she simply gave the van back to the dealer as even with a bad credit hit, giving it back and starting over was her only option.

 

[Lubener]

I would start with oil changes at 4-5000 miles while keeping the oil level up. It shows you are running the oil a little too long and not maintaining the oil level where it should be.

 

[Donald]

So first of all the engine has 270K miles and sounds like marginal care.

I see two paths:
1) try and resolve the oil burning - something like a piston soak with a solvent and/or Valvoline Restore and Protect oil.

2) run a cheap oil like Supertech but keep your eye on oil level.

I know you don't want to hear it, but at 17 yr old and 270K miles it owes you nothing.

Compression test might tell us more. How much smoke at initial startup in the morning? How much smoke driving? Are there oil leaks on driveway?

 

[dnewton3]

First, there is no way a used oil analysis can accurately predict the engine lifecycle left; that's not what they can be used for. They can indicate problems; your used oil analysis is certainly showing cause for concern. But they can't say "you have x,xxx miles left" before it implodes.

Low oil pressure and low oil volume are obviously related, but "low" on oil volume is nearly like a switch; it's either sufficient to maintain pressure, or too low (there is no in-between). Did you wife ever mention the low oil pressure light during operation?

I agree with BS on this; the Si is a potential cause of the wear. (The low oil volume exacerbates this issue.) That's a darn high value for only 7k miles. Check for air leaks in the intake tract.

 

[walterjay]

I just remembered, we had a chevy work van that got run out of oil. I remember walking by it and it was idling and knocking. We added 3.5 qts of oil. The motor seemed to suffer no ill effects. Worked it hard for a couple years and than sold it to someone looking for a beater van. And also as mentioned before knew a girl who only added oil when the oil light flickered. The poor engine soldiered on.

 

[fantastic]

The used oil analysis results are not bad considering the mileage & low capacity but it is showing some elevated wear. Time to throw in some 20w-50 & run it till she goes...

 

[icucicu]

Thanks for all the advice everyone. Looks like it might still live, I'll keep checking on it, inspect the air filter system.
Low oil light never lit up. No smoke on startup. I opened the used oil filter, there was no obvious metal pieces in there, but I did find dust particles (could not say what it was made of).

I'll switch to heavier oil next drain, maybe add some moly. The rest of my fleet (diesels, tractors) run on diesel 15w40. Would that work ok for an 08 sienna, or best to buy 20w50 for gas? I remember something about gas catalytic converters having potential issues when running diesel oil.

 

[JavierH19]

Thanks for all the advice everyone. Looks like it might still live, I'll keep checking on it, inspect the air filter system.

Low oil light never lit up. No smoke on startup. I opened the used oil filter, there was no obvious metal pieces in there, but I did find dust particles (could not say what it was made of).



I'll switch to heavier oil next drain, maybe add some moly. The rest of my fleet (diesels, tractors) run on diesel 15w40. Would that work ok for an 08 sienna, or best to buy 20w50 for gas? I remember something about gas catalytic converters having potential issues when running diesel oil.

If it needs to pass emissions euro or diesel saps might be a bit much for the cat but my sierra burned a lot before running hdeo full time cleaned it along with the yukon which burned a bit less but both it and the yukon never had an emissions problem with the oil consumption they had on the factory cats even when running 15w-40 during the consumption and its gradual reduction to where both burn very little now. You could run regular 10w-40 if it gets near 0f or 20w-50 for 3-5k if it's warmer to play it safe as those have a lower saps. But some cats can be very tolerant of high saps oil consumption. But again if emissions doesn't matter then use whatever.

 

[icucicu]

If it needs to pass emissions euro or diesel saps might be a bit much for the cat but my sierra burned a lot before diesel cleaned it along with the yukon which burned a bit less but both it and the yukon never had an emissions problem with the oil consumption they had on the factory cats even when running 15w-40 during the consumption and its gradual reduction to where both burn very little now. You could run regular 10w-40 if it gets near 0f or 20w-50 for 3-5k if it's warmer to play it safe as those have a lower saps. But some cats can be very tolerant of high saps oil consumption. But again if emissions doesn't matter then use whatever.

Thanks. No emissions where I'm at, I was thinking more of higher amount of additives (ZDDP zinc/phosphorus) in the diesel oil that could potentially accumulate in the cat and create an issue there, like overheating the cat or poor gas mileage. This is out of AI search so I'm not sure how much factual worry there is on that front.

 

[JavierH19]

Thanks. No emissions where I'm at, I was thinking more of higher amount of additives (ZDDP zinc/phosphorus) in the diesel oil that could potentially accumulate in the cat and create an issue there, like overheating the cat or poor gas mileage. This is out of AI search so I'm not sure how much factual worry there is on that front.

There have been cars with the cat performance code on for the longest time yet they're still fine on power. For the cat to get clogged badly enough to where it's down on power it needs to have been fogging bugs for a long time. 1 quart every 2k won't do that. My sierra was burning a quart every 800-900 miles and the yukon about 1300 miles. I saw an immediate consumption reduction from the viscosity increase then more reduction that got better as the higher detergents in hdeo cleaned my rings over time.

 

[addyguy]

It needs Valvoline Restore and Protect to fix it right up….thats the miracle cure these days, isn’t it?
Being serious, it might not hurt to run that and see how it does…

 

[icucicu]

It needs Valvoline Restore and Protect to fix it right up….thats the miracle cure these days, isn’t it?
Being serious, it might not hurt to run that and see how it does…

Didn't know about that product. There might be some gunk from running low on oil, could be worth running that, or some BG EPR, or let it dissolve over time with the HDEO I'll put in now.