2007 Camry 2.4 timing chain issue and engine porn

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At the end of last year, my mom gave me her 2007 Camry with the 2AZ-FE 2-stroke engine, which currently burns a quart of 5w-20 every 1,000 miles or so. So far, I've put about 5,000 miles on it since then, it runs well other than the oil burning problem which I know is due to defective pistons/rings and that these things can run for hundreds of thousands of miles as long as you keep adding oil. If I'm feeling particularly adventurous, I might attempt to tackle that this summer, as I've read it can be done without pulling the engine with creative use of a floor jack, but right now I have a more pressing problem with it, that's stopped me from driving the car for a few days now.

It started with the engine sounding a little funny, but I couldn't quite pinpoint it. It has progressed quickly to a terrible racket at startup that doesn't quite go away, even at warm idle. The engine still runs and I'd like to keep it that way, so the car hasn't moved since last week. And it's coming from the timing chain area and is clearly internal to the engine, so that's unfortunate.

I went ahead and pulled the valve cover this morning and found "excessive play" in the timing chain.
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I don't think it should be doing that, plus I'm able to move the chain side to side without any resistance by putting a screwdriver down the timing cover. From what I can see, the guides look to be intact with their plastic pieces still attached, so I'm hoping it's just the tensioner that's failed. I have one on order that's supposed to arrive today, so I'll see if that fixes it soon enough. If that doesn't work, well, I did the timing chains on my XTerra last year and it looks to be a bit easier on this engine with everything accessible through the wheel well.


And since I had to pull the valve cover anyways, I figured I might as well snap a few pics. The gasket, particularly around the spark plug tubes, was hard as a rock but I've also got one of those coming. The engine has 131,000 miles on it, owned by my mom since 2007, with dealership oil changes whenever the maintenance light comes on.

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I don't know much about those Toyota 2 stroke engines
But would suggest you pull the chain covers off and
look at the chain tensioner
Best of luck.
 
Originally Posted by Ken42
I don't know much about those Toyota 2 stroke engines
But would suggest you pull the chain covers off and
look at the chain tensioner
Best of luck.

It's not a 2-stroke, it just burns enough oil it might as well be!

The tensioner is spring-loaded and external to the engine, I'd rather just replace it than pulling the timing cover if I don't have to.
 
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Tensioner and Guides on this engine when that happens on these engines. Can be done with the engine in the car but it's not fun.

My dad has one of these sitting in the garage that has a cracked head. It's going to the scrapyard, just haven't got around to it.

And... "2 Stroke"
lol.gif
I'm stealing that for oil burning engine descriptions.
 
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Aww, the usual Toyota stuck rings oil consumption problem. "Valvoline Premium Blue Restore" 10w30 can be used to clean it up. Over-The-Road trucks with Cummins ISX engines have had this issue and there are some carbon-cleaning patents Valvoline has which they have used to scour out the rings. It could work. Cheaper than dropping the pistons, thats for sure.
https://www.ryderfleetproducts.com/valvoline-877377/premium-blue-restore-10w30-gallon-p-vvl-877377 for mail-order, or at Cummins service centers scattered around. It must say "Restore" on the jug, not their other "Blue" regular oils, only the "Restore" one.
"If your Cummins ISX15 engine is struggling with excessive oil consumption, it could be caused by carbon build-up on the pistons, also referred to as piston deposits or carbon-packed pistons. Once this hard carbon is removed, the first and second piston rings can begin to move freely and restore oil control.
To achieve maximum deposit cleaning effectiveness, Cummins recommends using Valvoline Premium Blue Restoreâ„¢ 10w30"


https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4778351/1
From a previous thread on bitog, for example:
Originally Posted by fdcg27
This will be a valuable addition to everyone's virtual tool kit. If this oil performs as promised, and I'm thinking it would since fleet Cummins operators are probably not snake oil prospects, then it would certainly be worth a try in any dirty engine or one showing symptoms of stuck rings. It may be pricey, but still orders of magnitude cheaper than a teardown. Would be interesting to try this oil in a Saturn or one of the ring coking Toyotas.
 
Originally Posted by diyjake
That Valvoline Premium Blue Restore looks interesting, talk about expensive.
Only use it if you suspect stuck rings, excessive oil consumption, trying to avoid an expensive teardown.
Its expensive partly because it really has super premium synthetic oil base stock (a lot of POE in there for cleaning), and a proprietary cleaning additive package to boost that base oil's effects.
Trucking companies must be angry at Cummins for their ISX engines gumming up the rings like they do way too much. You'd expect Cummins engines to not need it, yet there it is.... I might use "Restore" every 100k miles in a non-Toyota application just to clean it out good once in a while!
 
Originally Posted by diyjake
Does it actually work? Might give it a try in my 09 camry.
It might. I doubt if Cummins would say it does to all those trucking fleet people if it didn't. Also, its known POE with some additives that work well with that jet-turbine base oil does a lot of cleaning, that we know. At $80 bucks for a jug, its really not that bad in price.
 
Terry Dyson helped develop it. It's really good stuff. Really expensive though. But when you are trying to solve a problem it's worth it.
 
Replaced the tensioner. There's less play in the chain but I can still move it relatively freely with a screwdriver. I figured as much, since the old one still seemed to work properly when I removed it. Unfortunately this means I'll be tearing it apart further
frown.gif


The guide itself on the front (non-tensioner) side seems to move a bit when I poke at it with a screwdriver. I don't think it should be doing that.
 
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Something doesn't sound right. Is this engine in time? The slack should be on the tension side of the chain only. Even without a tensioner, the top of the chain (at least on the few that I've worked on) should not be super loose.

Also, if you installed a new tensioner but have not ran the engine, the chain may be loose (to an extent) since the tensioner is out of oil.
 
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Every Camry Hybrid from that era owned by the major taxi company in our town rattles like [censored] when it drives by...if the gas engine is running. Sounds like detonation to me but it could possibly be timing chain. I asked a friend who worked at a garage that mainly worked on these taxis for a little while and he said it's because they don't change their oil often enough. He didn't explain what the actual problem is though. I think they just run them until they blow and scrap them after that.

Most of the personally owned taxi operators seem to drive cheaper vehicles like old impalas from the 2000s, Buicks, etc.

A city nearby has a lot less money than ours and doesn't have an age limit on their taxis....they still run 90% 2000-2010ish impala's and Buicks. The one company the garage I worked at did work for had a 94 Buick lesabre in their fleet when I worked there full time still about 5 years ago. I drove part time for them for 3 months in a 2005 Impala...60k miles on the oil in it. Shortly after I quit they brought that car in with a major oil leak. Oil filter rusted through. Oil change and it's fixed...the 3800 continued on running like new. This was even an ex police car.
 
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It pings, too. From all the oil burning. I attempted a piston soak, which didn't seem to do anything for the oil burning, but I did notice that the pinging went away for maybe 1,000 miles or so. It probably got rid of the carbon deposits, but they came back because it's still burning oil.

The noise I'm hearing now is definitely mechanical, not pinging. I put the valve cover and spark plugs back in and ran the engine for a few minutes, the sound is still there and the chain might have been a little tighter when I took things back apart, but it still had slack on the exhaust side.
 
Interesting... I just bought my mom's 07 camry 2.4 about 6 months ago. It has 235,000 miles, original chain, guides etc. I have personally maintained it since new and has never had anything other than M1 0w20 AFE every 5000 miles. It burns the same amount of oil now as it did when it was brand new, about a half a quart every 5000 miles. I wonder what it is about driving habits, environment, variability of parts that makes some of these engines basket cases, and others perfectly fine after almost double the miles that the OP's engine has?

Judging by what it looks like under the valve cover this engine clearly wasn't neglected of oil changes. Could it be as simple as a synthetic oil holding up better in the hot ring pack area of the piston? I doubt that it's as simple as that considering the gap between dino and synthetic is not nearly as wide as it once was.

As for the OP's apparent coked ring problem, I doubt piston soaks will take care of it and I have my doubts about anything off the shelf taking care of it. I have torn down engines with this issue and we're generally not talking about soft carbon in this area. we're talking about rock hard, abrasive carbon that requires a lot more than a piston soak to loosen up.
 
I'm pretty sure Toyota specified 7,500 mile oil changes with conventional oil for this car, so that's what my mom got at the dealer. Obviously good enough to keep the rest of the engine clean, but there must be something about the piston rings that is harder on the oil. You using synthetic and changing it early according to Toyota probably prevented any problems.
 
Originally Posted by Anduril
I'm pretty sure Toyota specified 7,500 mile oil changes with conventional oil for this car, so that's what my mom got at the dealer. Obviously good enough to keep the rest of the engine clean, but there must be something about the piston rings that is harder on the oil. You using synthetic and changing it early according to Toyota probably prevented any problems.


"Maintenance Reqr" comes on at 5000 miles on this car. Also, its funny because as I was browsing the manual for this car Toyota mentions Max oil consumption is 1.1 quarts in 600 miles, which is incredibly ridiculous!
 
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