Need A/C compressor help

[Choi]

I have an 03 Ford Taurus with lots of rattling and grinding coming from the compressor area. I found it after replacing an idler pulley, which was making the big ruckus. Afterwards, I found to my dismay that the idler pulley had masked the sounds from the compressor area.

Based on what I saw on the forums, it seems like the procedure is to evacuate the system at a shop, pull off the compressor, plug up the lines to prevent moisture from entering (which seems hard to avoid), slap in a new compressor, reconnect the lines and finally just recharge it with a kit. Am I on the right track so far?

My worries lie with not knowing if the compressor is messing up the rest of the system. The compressor pulley is vibrating with grinding noises, while it is engaging and disengaging periodically. The A/C still produces cool or cold air. I've seen a lot of people recommending that the accumulator and orifice tube be replaced at the same time. Based on what I've written, does that seem necessary? The car had lived by the ocean for a few years recently, if that might be a factor of this part failure.

Yes, this is my first post - Hello! I haven't felt the need to post before because everything I've ever wanted to know has been covered thoroughly in a technical and academic fashion. You can't find this anywhere else! So I just hope you guys don't find this to be "another one of those A/C posts" as I'm feeling reluctantly a bit intimidated by the A/C...

Thanks so much,
Choi

 

[2oldtommy]

It sounds to me like you need a professional to diagnose your problem. Unless a trained ear can listen to your system, anything this forum suggest will be a guess IMO.

Oldtommy

 

[Thermo1223]

It could be just the clutch...however pulling that while still attached to the car is near impossible.

 

[Choi]

I'd like to make try to make the repair myself to hopefully save a buck and also to learn a bit more about A/C repair. I'll go to the pro if I have to tho at some point.

Yes, the pulley/clutch part definitely seems to be bad. I read that without specialized tools, replacing the clutch is a PITA. I guess if I knew how sensitive the system is to being exposed to the atmosphere and the how/why of preventing any damage from exposure, I'd feel more confident in slapping the compressor in after watching some youtube videos.

I found a Spectra Premium compressor for $141. A sweet deal but I want to make sure if I'm missing the larger picture.

 

[Bluestream]

You really don't want to try this repair yourself. If your compressor has sent debris through the system, you will need to flush it with nitrogen to clean it out or your new compressor will be short lived. You also will need a new drier and orifice tube to do this right.

R134A is a greenhouse gas and should be handled by licensed prifessionals

 

[Chris142]

you really need to replace the acumulator,expansion device and possibly the condenser if the system got contaminated. if you plan on keeping the car do the whole thing including a flush. then your starting with all new parts and oil

 

[Choi]

How can you tell if the system has been contaminated? Also, can I still drive the car or will something terrible happen?

 

[xxch4osxx]

Anytime the system is opened up and exposed to air, no matter how quickly you cover the lines up, you have to pull a hard vacuum after you put it back together.

 

[exranger06]

Originally Posted By: Choi
How can you tell if the system has been contaminated? Also, can I still drive the car or will something terrible happen?

Pull the orifice tube out and look for metal chunks or other debris. If you see anything, you should flush the whole system.

You can drive the car, just don't use the AC at all. To make sure the compressor doesn't turn on, disconnect the wiring harness on the compressor, or disconnect one of the pressure switches.

 

[yonyon]

Do the noises only happen only when the compressor is disengaged? If so, you've probably just got a bad clutch (possibly from excessive cycling because some of the refrigerant leaked out) and contamination is unlikely. Once you've got the compressor out, collect the old oil from it (be sure to crank the compressor over by hand) so that you can measure it. The new compressor should come with documentation telling you how much oil is already in the new compressor so you'll know if you need to add any more.

In any case it's worth it to pull the orifice tube just to be sure it's clean. They often break coming out and a new one is cheap, so get a new one. If humidity is low and the orifice tube is clean you can get away with reusing the dryer.

Do not just refill the system with cans and a hose. When you get the old refrigerant recovered it leaves a partial vacuum in the system that fills with air as soon as you open it up to replace parts. You need to pull a vacuum before filling. Rent or borrow the tools or have the vac & charge done by the same outfit that does the recovery for you.

 

[Merkava_4]

Originally Posted By: Choi
Based on what I saw on the forums, it seems like the procedure is to evacuate the system at a shop, pull off the compressor, plug up the lines to prevent moisture from entering (which seems hard to avoid), slap in a new compressor, reconnect the lines and finally just recharge it with a kit. Am I on the right track so far?


If you're doing it yourself at home, you don't need to evacuate the system. Just unhook the lines to the compressor and remove the compressor. There will probably be a wiring harness connected to the compressor you'll need to unplug.

You'll need to replace the screen in the expansion tube. Usually the expansion tube and screen are all one part.

Add 3 ounces of compressor oil to the new compressor. After you get the new compressor installed, you'll need to back flush the condenser. You do that with an A/C system flush kit. All you do is fill up the tank with denatured alcohol and spray it into where the line hooks up to the condenser. You'll want to spray the the alcohol in the reverse direction of normal A/C refrigerant flow. That's where the term "back flush" comes from. You'll need a supply of compressed air to operate the system flush kit.

No need to evacuate moisture out of the system unless you have humidity in the air. Usually this time of year in the middle of the summer, the humidity is practically zero.

 

[artificialist]

You are going to need to flush out the lines, replace the accumulator or drier, and the orifice tube or expansion valve. If you don't do this, the pieces of your old compressor stuck in the system will enter the new compressor, and destroy it prematurely. Sometimes the condenser can't be flushed if it is parallel flow, and has to be replaced.

After the system is flushed, you need to know what viscosity PAG oil you need, and what quantity goes into the accumulator or drier and if necessary, into the condenser. Know the amount of oil your compressor takes, but also keep in mind that some parts companies fill the compressor with oil in advance.

I prefer OEM new compressors if you intend to keep your car for more than 2 years. Some aftermarket new compressors might be okay, but one time I had to deal with a "Compressorworks" brand unit, and the clutch would never engage because it wasn't built correctly, and the second unit from the same company had the same problem.

Using aftermarket orifice tubes, expansion valves, driers, and accumulators has never given me a problem. In fact, some Fords benefitted from certain aftermarket accumulators. Ford often used ones made of painted steel, and road salt destroyed them quickly. Aftermarket accumulators and most other OEM accumulators were made of aluminum and held up much better.

 

[yonyon]

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4

No need to evacuate moisture out of the system unless you have humidity in the air. Usually this time of year in the middle of the summer, the humidity is practically zero.

Um, it looks like the OP is in Georgia which is an east coast state. Some parts can have pretty wet (think hot shower) weather in the summer.

 

[exranger06]

Any time you disconnect an AC line, you should evacuate the system afterwards, regardless of the weather, and regardless of the amount of time the line was disconnected. You do not want any air in the system at all, only refrigerant and oil. Having air in the system will make performance suffer.

 

[Chris142]

compressor is not designed to pump air.it must be evacuated before filled or the pressures will be all wonkey.i see this every day when a customer does not evacuate a system

 

[Samilcar]

Yep, all air needs to be evacuated before the system is recharged with refrigerant. Any air in the system acts as a useless "filler" gas that degrades AC performance. It might work OK without evacuating all that air, but definitely not optimal.

 

[Choi]

Yea, it's humid as heck down down here and it's relentless.

So general concensus sounds like that I should get an accumulator and orifice tube just cuz. A good precaution. Then before I go to evacuate the system with new parts installed, it is recommended to back wash with an ac flush.

Does anyone have any recommendations for a flush product?

Choi

 

[Merkava_4]

Originally Posted By: Samilcar
Yep, all air needs to be evacuated before the system is recharged with refrigerant.


I was right their when the guy recharged my A/C and he didn't evacuate the system. All we did is back flush the condenser with denatured alcohol. It was in the middle of summer with about 105F outside. The A/C blows cold air. It'll blow 40F out the vents when the outside temp is 83F.

 

[paulo57509]

Originally Posted By: Choi
Yea, it's humid as heck down down here and it's relentless.

So general concensus sounds like that I should get an accumulator and orifice tube just cuz. A good precaution. Then before I go to evacuate the system with new parts installed, it is recommended to back wash with an ac flush.

Does anyone have any recommendations for a flush product?

Choi


The accumulator and orifice tube should be replaced any time the system is opened. In fact, I would replace anything that is suspect simply because you do not want to have to open the system over and over to replace sketchy components. Plus, if it doesn't blow cold after you're finished you don't have to wonder, "Should I have replaced that?"

When I did my rebuild/retrofit to R134a on my Lumina back on 2011 after the second compressor blew its guts, I used one of these to flush the components and hard lines:

http://www.amazon.com/Mastercool-91046-A-Conditioner-System-Flush/dp/B000HAUXLE

Flushing really needs vigorous agitation but just shooting solvent through under pressure (several times and then blowing dry with clean, dry compressed air) is about all a DIY can do. So it's better than nothing.

This thing works best if you have the system components off the car. The tank really isn't big enough to hold enough solvent to circulate it throughout the entire system in one shot.

Don't try to flush the hose assemblies or anything that has a muffler. You'll have a hard time getting all the solvent and debris out.

I flushed the condenser and evaporator off the car. I flushed the hard lines in place.

The hose assembly was replaced with a new assembly as was the accumulator, compressor and expansion tube.

I used lacquer thinner as a flush solvent. Nothing else available readily over-the-counter would dry without leaving an oily residue.

I refilled the components with correctly measured amounts of BVA Auto 100 Ester Glo refrigerant oil.

Would I go through this again? Now that I have the equipment and supplies I probably would. If I was starting from scratch? Probably not.

Edit: I'd also add that evacuation is done not only to get the air out of the system but also as a leak check and to get the moisture out of the system. Moisture and refrigerant usually makes for an acidic combination that starts to degrade the system from the inside out.

 

[1 FMF]

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: Samilcar
Yep, all air needs to be evacuated before the system is recharged with refrigerant.


I was right their when the guy recharged my A/C and he didn't evacuate the system. All we did is back flush the condenser with denatured alcohol. It was in the middle of summer with about 105F outside. The A/C blows cold air. It'll blow 40F out the vents when the outside temp is 83F.

yeah i don't think so.