VOA of new Havoline / getting impatient
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Samples Came 2-3 Days ago here it is different vis tho.
Havoline 5/30 NEW deposit control (left side)
Havoline 5/20 OLD (right side)
Boron 72ppm.....70ppm
Moly 226........455
Phos 778........721
Zinc 886........854
Calcium 1860....1441
Mag 41..........58
Others Vis @ 100 9.6.....7.7
Vis @ 40 59.7.....41.6
VI 144............156
TBN 2896 8.55.....8.54
Old to New less moly a lot of other things like a AO and dispersants will not show.
bruce
Havoline 5/30 NEW deposit control (left side)
Havoline 5/20 OLD (right side)
Boron 72ppm.....70ppm
Moly 226........455
Phos 778........721
Zinc 886........854
Calcium 1860....1441
Mag 41..........58
Others Vis @ 100 9.6.....7.7
Vis @ 40 59.7.....41.6
VI 144............156
TBN 2896 8.55.....8.54
Old to New less moly a lot of other things like a AO and dispersants will not show.
bruce
Triple_Se7en
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All I see is less moly and more calcium.
No new trend there. What's the significance of this deposit shield? Is this the same Group base oil - including any + (pluses) after the Group number????
No new trend there. What's the significance of this deposit shield? Is this the same Group base oil - including any + (pluses) after the Group number????
Just what I thought it would be - more Calcium for deposit control, following the same lead as Castrol with their 'sludge protection' formula.
I'm suprised by how thin they have made it - its only just a 30-weight. I know thin oils show good numbers, but it guarantees this will become a 20 weight in no time.....
I don't thnk this new version is going to do as well on UOA's as the old stuff. The add pack on this oil looks somewhat similar to Kendall/Trop Artic....and they only show middlin' to good results, not the outstanding ones that the old Havoline showed....but time and UOA's will tell!
I'm suprised by how thin they have made it - its only just a 30-weight. I know thin oils show good numbers, but it guarantees this will become a 20 weight in no time.....
I don't thnk this new version is going to do as well on UOA's as the old stuff. The add pack on this oil looks somewhat similar to Kendall/Trop Artic....and they only show middlin' to good results, not the outstanding ones that the old Havoline showed....but time and UOA's will tell!
Hmmm. I put the new stuff in my tacoma last oil change with blind faith that the reformulation would not be a bad one. Since my engine sheers oil to smithereens after 1000 miles, this lighter viscosity is probably a bad thing.
Anyone care to speculate on why/if the viscosity change was done and if it was intentional by the blender? A better base oil with a lighter viscosity makes sense if it doesn't sheer back. However, I've already found info on the internet that DS is still group II, but it was from an ad.
Anyone care to speculate on why/if the viscosity change was done and if it was intentional by the blender? A better base oil with a lighter viscosity makes sense if it doesn't sheer back. However, I've already found info on the internet that DS is still group II, but it was from an ad.
Guys the 2 oils tested OLD and NEW were sent to me.
They were a 5/20 and a 5/30 I did not buy them, I just tested what was sent that is why 2 vis grades are shown.
bruce
They were a 5/20 and a 5/30 I did not buy them, I just tested what was sent that is why 2 vis grades are shown.
bruce
At least the left out the SALT!!!
No sodium here please!!!
Looks like it should still be great. At least we kept a good chunk of MOLY.
No sodium here please!!!
Looks like it should still be great. At least we kept a good chunk of MOLY.
I asked Chevron this question. The answer:
"The decrease in the viscosity at 100C results from an improvement in
the shear stability of the viscosity modifier. The more the viscosity
modifier shears, the higher the initial viscosity must be. By
increasing the shear stability we can lower the fresh oil viscosity
which can improve fuel economy and low temperature properties of the
oil."
"The new viscosity improver makes it possible to provide the same protection without using that more viscous oil to compensate for the heat. The HT/HS (High Temp/High Shear) for the new oil is basically the same as it was for the former Havoline with a more viscous oil."
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Don't you love it when a company is willing to answer your questions intelligently and with answers that make sense, and not with marketing blather?
That is one of the many reason's why I like using Pennzoil and Chevron products.
ewetho,
Don't think moly is the magic bullet. The companies adds are there to make the oil pass SM tests and nothing more. They don't add stuff to make us feel good about the oil,
If you doubt my thoughts look on the Chevron website in the area of base oils. They ALWAYS talk about maximizing profits, thru the use of their base stocks that reduces the need for more expensive add packs or the use of expensive Group lll base stocks etc. They only care about profit and loss. But the oil is still good stuff.
Just my views
Greg Harrison
Don't think moly is the magic bullet. The companies adds are there to make the oil pass SM tests and nothing more. They don't add stuff to make us feel good about the oil,
If you doubt my thoughts look on the Chevron website in the area of base oils. They ALWAYS talk about maximizing profits, thru the use of their base stocks that reduces the need for more expensive add packs or the use of expensive Group lll base stocks etc. They only care about profit and loss. But the oil is still good stuff.
Just my views
Greg Harrison
I don't but seems there are a few around. Based on UOA it seemed to be slightly on the better side as far as DINO is concerned and combined with the fact that I like Juan Montoya (OK, OK, I hated him in F1 but that was the Shuemy Fan in me) so that is why I use Havoline. Nothing else. From what I have read from the wiser more informed it is not the magic bullet but it is not a bad thing to have just expensive apparently. So they traded some for some of the other more modern additives while retaining a good level of what seems to be a cult favorite ingredient. Sounds good to me. This new stuff will probably be just great.
If price was no object I would probably use either Redline or Amsoil, followed by GC or PP. Then Dino would be Havoline now based on fan loyalty (my favorite driver apparently uses Joe Gibbs Oil in his Home Depot ride which would not be so good on the street). Oh and yes I know they could be using anything in that 42 ride on the track even a different brand and almost assuredly synthetic.
But all that being said I saw watching a race (Practice actually) about 12 years ago that the pulled the case of Havoline 20W-50 off the toolbox opened and filled the oil sump behind the seat after an engine change. Was amused to see it was not some special oil at the time. Was a big M1 and Redline fan at the time. When the reporter asked if anything special about their oil they replied the actually forgot the oil at the shop and stopped in at like K-Mart or Walmart the day before a got a few cases and that was one of them.
If price was no object I would probably use either Redline or Amsoil, followed by GC or PP. Then Dino would be Havoline now based on fan loyalty (my favorite driver apparently uses Joe Gibbs Oil in his Home Depot ride which would not be so good on the street). Oh and yes I know they could be using anything in that 42 ride on the track even a different brand and almost assuredly synthetic.
But all that being said I saw watching a race (Practice actually) about 12 years ago that the pulled the case of Havoline 20W-50 off the toolbox opened and filled the oil sump behind the seat after an engine change. Was amused to see it was not some special oil at the time. Was a big M1 and Redline fan at the time. When the reporter asked if anything special about their oil they replied the actually forgot the oil at the shop and stopped in at like K-Mart or Walmart the day before a got a few cases and that was one of them.
Likewise, the thinner 100C viscosity. But I suppose once you add a good slug of zddp booster to this oil, you'll get the viscosity back up where it ought to be, somewhere on the higher side of the 30 weight range.
So, thanks for the VOAs Bruce. It looks like a new product and the Havoline customer service seems to have confirmed it.
Seems different. I sent Bruce the sample of 5W20 Old Havoline. They just didn't have the new Havoline here when I sent it, or I'da dropped THAT in the box, too.. Not Bruce's fault. At least they didn't pull a bait and switch on the old formula, and in fact, there's 50PPM mor moly in the sample I sent that I bought on the closeout than there was in the VOA done a couple of years back when the "whole bunch" were posted.
Would anyone expect there to be a radical difference between the additive package in 5W30 and that of 5W20 in the New Havoline? Also, is the oil cheaper to make with the lesser quanities of moly, even though there's a little more calcium?
Thanks for the VOA, Bruce!
Would anyone expect there to be a radical difference between the additive package in 5W30 and that of 5W20 in the New Havoline? Also, is the oil cheaper to make with the lesser quanities of moly, even though there's a little more calcium?
Thanks for the VOA, Bruce!
I just dropped some 5w-20 DS in my RSX. 4q of 5w-20 DS and a odd quart of original Havoline Synth 5w-30. Too bad I mixed it or I'd actually do a UOA. It seemed pretty smooth when I started and drove just to move the car. DEFINATELY thinner. Temps down to -10f made me want to go with this oil.
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