Why is my oil pressure ALLWAYS at 40psi?

Status
Not open for further replies.
While understanding the suggestion on replacing the sender, I checked the resistance of the factory sender while it was in a homemade pressure rig and found it very responsive. Bought a new sender and they correlated perfectly. Installed the new sender anyway and the gauge continued to be comatose. Replaced gauge with one out of a wreck and it showed no improvement.

Conclusion... At least for Dodge the dead needle is by design.
 
Zmoz,
My 96 Cherokee reads way high too. Since the day I got it, with 67,000 miles on her it has always read above 40psi. It didn't move much, so I went to autozone and swapped out sending units, still no change in pressure. I currently run 65-70psi according to the gauge at idle, and normal speeds. After driving down the highway for a bit and coming to a stop, the gauge will drop to about 45psi. I currently have 113,000 miles.
 
The jeep 4.0 and 2.5 vary quite a bit in "normal" pressure even within the same model year. The TJ gauge is accurate ..at least somewhat (mainly due to the numbers ==or lack there of). My 99 4.0 had 42 MAX pressure cold ...24 off idle hot ...and 12-14 hot idle.....while other 99 4.0 owners reported 20 psi as their baseline. I installed an aftermarket high volume oil pump with a 58 lb pressure relief. My gauge goes to 58 off idle (the place just below where 60 would be). It drops to 42 when hot and idling. My 02 2.5 on the other hand runs just shy of 45 psi all the time. It will drop ever so slightly at hot idle.

I believe that if you install an electric or mechanical gauge "tee-d" in you will see the same pressure(s)
 
My 03 Dakota (4.7) has a "dummy" oil pressure guage and I hate it. Always at half way and no numbers
mad.gif


Can anyone explain what is involved in changing the stock "dummy" guage to a "smart" guage.
 
quote:

All Fords since sometime in the early '90's (at least) have had "idiot gauges" for the oil pressure...I'm not sure why...

I think, answer's simple: CHEAP. The same reason that they started giving you a donut with a new car instead of a decent full-size tire. The motto is "save on everything you can".
 
Believe it or not the reason for the donut sized spare tire is for weight savings, and weight savings results in slightly better MPG (for the CAFE numbers!) so that's the motivation behind it, not cost.
 
quote:

Originally posted by Ma-fia:

quote:

All Fords since sometime in the early '90's (at least) have had "idiot gauges" for the oil pressure...I'm not sure why...

I think, answer's simple: CHEAP. The same reason that they started giving you a donut with a new car instead of a decent full-size tire. The motto is "save on everything you can".


I wouldn't agree entirely, the Ford trucks have been very good especially since the early 90s. Most notibly the 302, 351, and V10.. very reliable. The new "modular" 5.4 and 5.7 engines have had alot of problems though and can be called "junk"

I have a 1995 Ford Econoline 150 with a 351W motor, i also have the "L & H" guage on my oil. I always thought this was an oil LEVEL guage as it will go up when i add oil. Maybe i'm wrong but that was my understanding of it since it doesnt have a scale for psi or bars on it, just high and low.

Btw mine has a full sized spare. I have 61,000 miles and only 2 things that broke are:

1.) A couple of fuses burnt out (have alot of electronics and tvs in there!)

2.) Ball joints wore out after 50,000 miles (stock ones aren't greaseable on most cars - replaced with NAPA Lifetime greaseable BJ)

[ January 24, 2004, 08:21 AM: Message edited by: therion ]
 
quote:

Originally posted by therion:
I have a 1995 Ford Econoline 150 with a 351W motor, i also have the "L & H" guage on my oil. I always thought this was an oil LEVEL guage as it will go up when i add oil. Maybe i'm wrong but that was my understanding of it since it doesnt have a scale for psi or bars on it, just high and low.

At work, I used to have a 1990 Econoline E350 with the 5.8, and a 1995 E350 with the 7.5...they both had the "L" & "H" oil pressure gauge, and they were both fake, too...no needle movement of any kind, hot or cold, at idle or at speed. A dealer mechanic showed me the sender in the wiring diagram, and it was definitely an on-off switch, not a true sender. Same with my '94 T-bird...the really galling thing about the Marauder, is that Ford had AutoMeter specially design a NON-WORKING gauge that looks exactly like the real AutoMeter Pro-Comp Ultra-Lite series, so it wasn't the cost factor in this case...the factory gauge always reads 60 psi, while my real gauge varies from almost 100 psi when cold, to about 25 psi when idling in gear, hot.
 
quote:

Originally posted by Ma-fia:

quote:

All Fords since sometime in the early '90's (at least) have had "idiot gauges" for the oil pressure...I'm not sure why...

I think, answer's simple: CHEAP. The same reason that they started giving you a donut with a new car instead of a decent full-size tire. The motto is "save on everything you can".


By having the gauge always point right into the middle of the "normal" range, it keeps people from running to the dealer everytime there's a fluctuation in the gauge, regardless of the cause.

We have a bunch of 3.0 V6 Rangers where I work; they all have the volts and oil pressure gauges uniformly pointing at the middle of the gauge all the time. The temp gauge is the same way - it slowly warms up to the normal spot, and then it stays there all day. Never moves!
 
quote:

Originally posted by css9450:
By having the gauge always point right into the middle of the "normal" range, it keeps people from running to the dealer everytime there's a fluctuation in the gauge, regardless of the cause.

That is essentially what my neighbor, an engineer who works for Ford, said. Also, I heard that there was a TSB for when people complained that the needle was moving around all the time. What they supposedly did was wire in a resistor on the back of the gauge and put an idiot light sender in. Happy customer. Worked so good they made it standard equipment. My 1990 E350 motorhome had the larger funnel shaped sender of a real gauge, but the gauge still acted like the idiot gauge.

quote:

Originally posted by css9450:
We have a bunch of 3.0 V6 Rangers where I work; they all have the volts and oil pressure gauges uniformly pointing at the middle of the gauge all the time. The temp gauge is the same way - it slowly warms up to the normal spot, and then it stays there all day. Never moves!

My '95 F150's gauge stays in one spot like that, but with the wifes '92 Aerostar you can watch it move up and down in cycles, presumably with the thermostat cycling.
 
quote:

Believe it or not the reason for the donut sized spare tire is for weight savings

No kidding. I can barely beleive in that, but I don't really have any hard knowledge of the opposite.
quote:

I think, answer's simple: CHEAP. The same reason that they started giving you a donut with a new car instead of a decent full-size tire. The motto is "save on everything you can".

When I said that, Ford was involved "just because". I did not mean that Fords in general are cheap or bad. I've got one myself and I love it. These days everybody gets a donut, so what; you just throw away the donut and get a real wheel. But the fact is that on low-end cars (like my Ford Focus) you get an idiot light, on higher end -- you get a gauge. Needle in the middle makes perfect sense to me. However, I personally would prefer true readings, since I want to understand what's going on with my vehicles.
 
quote:

Originally posted by therion:
I wouldn't agree entirely, the Ford trucks have been very good especially since the early 90s. Most notibly the 302, 351, and V10.. very reliable. The new "modular" 5.4 and 5.7 engines have had alot of problems though and can be called "junk"

I have a 1995 Ford Econoline 150 with a 351W motor, i also have the "L & H" guage on my oil. I always thought this was an oil LEVEL guage as it will go up when i add oil. Maybe i'm wrong but that was my understanding of it since it doesnt have a scale for psi or bars on it, just high and low.


Not sure what you are getting at in your one comment. You call the V10 reliable and then call the 5.4 V8 junk (and I have no idea what you mean when you refer to a 5.7, since Ford doesn't offer a V8 of this size). Funny thing is the V10 is a 5.4 with 2 more cylinders and it shares nearly all of the issues the 5.4 has. The mod motors have had a few teething problems, but they are definitely very good motors and not junk. After owning two F150's with nearly 300,000 on these supposedly "junk" motors, and not once having to repair anyhting motor related or even having an oil leak, I will respectfully disagee with your assesment...


As to the oil guage, the oil guage you refer to is the glorified idiot guage, not an oil fill guage. Since it is an idiot guage, thats why there is a H and L instead of actual numbers.
 
quote:

Originally posted by MNgopher:

quote:

Originally posted by therion:
I wouldn't agree entirely, the Ford trucks have been very good especially since the early 90s. Most notibly the 302, 351, and V10.. very reliable. The new "modular" 5.4 and 5.7 engines have had alot of problems though and can be called "junk"

I have a 1995 Ford Econoline 150 with a 351W motor, i also have the "L & H" guage on my oil. I always thought this was an oil LEVEL guage as it will go up when i add oil. Maybe i'm wrong but that was my understanding of it since it doesnt have a scale for psi or bars on it, just high and low.


Not sure what you are getting at in your one comment. You call the V10 reliable and then call the 5.4 V8 junk (and I have no idea what you mean when you refer to a 5.7, since Ford doesn't offer a V8 of this size). Funny thing is the V10 is a 5.4 with 2 more cylinders and it shares nearly all of the issues the 5.4 has. The mod motors have had a few teething problems, but they are definitely very good motors and not junk. After owning two F150's with nearly 300,000 on these supposedly "junk" motors, and not once having to repair anyhting motor related or even having an oil leak, I will respectfully disagee with your assesment...


As to the oil guage, the oil guage you refer to is the glorified idiot guage, not an oil fill guage. Since it is an idiot guage, thats why there is a H and L instead of actual numbers.


Well, its kind of like Volkswagen. Either you get a super reliable car, or you get a lemon! And thats how it is the with the new 5.4's from reading on ford-trucks.com and other websites. You were lucky not to have any early failures. I was lucky with my 2003 Audi A4, becuase i seen some of them being lemons
 
I have to go with the "idiot gauge" theory. If you're involved in commercial trucking or off-highway equipment, you EXPECT variations in oil pressure, oil temp, coolant temp, EGT, etc.

Problem is we have "educated" several generations of drivers, or "idiots," to believe that the needle MUST point at a certain range. Even Ford has perpetuated this with the Maurader, what a joke!

Oil pumps are not smooth providers of fluid, many have a slight "pulse" to them. The mechanical gauge in my old Ford always shows a +/- 5 psi bounce, sometimes more. You can watch the mechanical temp as the thermo cycles. Most idgits would run to the dealer and scream "somethings wrong! The needle is bouncing!"

My 2000 GMC the oil pressure gauge does move around, a bit, but I don't trust the temp gauge. It slowly climbs to an indicated 195 and NEVER goes higher. I'm trying to figure out a way of making a mechanical temp gauge work.

Guess how I first figured out factory temp gauges were Idiot Gauges? Drive with the A/C full blast in 100 heat for two hours. Immediatly stop, shut off, and walk into the diner for 25 minutes.

Go back to the car, start it up, and watch the gauge still at the exact "normal" mark. Hmmm. Ever hear of HOT SOAK???

I put Stewart Warner mechanical gauges in my 1984 Ford F-150 back in 1985, as the stock gauges acted up then quit. My oil pressure varies from 30 psi idle in Drive to 85 psi cold fast idle. Shut the truck off after hot high speed driving and with the 160 thermo, the gauge will slowly creep to 185 due to Hot Soak.

Oh, a "gotcha" in case you decide to put in a "real" oil pressure gauge: many fuel injection systems depend on that "on/off gauge" to determine whether to run the fuel pump. If you disconnect the factory sender and run a mechanical gauge, the PCM might decide there is no oil pressure and kill the fuel pump to "protect" the motor.
 
My truck's coolant guage is accurate i have to say. Right now in the winter time the needle doesn't even reach the middle of the dial, instead it stays right at the beginning of the normal range. And when i shut it off and come back in a fuel hours it is completly COLD again and i have to wait for it to warm up.

In the summer time the needle will get closer to the middle, and i have not tried the heat soak idea, but i thought an auxilary fan cools the coolant when the engine is shut off on most cars. I know my old 1986 MB 300E did not have an electric fan so when you shut it off and check the temp it soars really high.
 
quote:

Originally posted by heyjay:
Oh, a "gotcha" in case you decide to put in a "real" oil pressure gauge: many fuel injection systems depend on that "on/off gauge" to determine whether to run the fuel pump. If you disconnect the factory sender and run a mechanical gauge, the PCM might decide there is no oil pressure and kill the fuel pump to "protect" the motor.

Nice feature to protect the motor, but could get you killed if oil pressure drops in the middle of freeway rush traffic. Anyway, if you vehicle has that feature, a T fitting will allow you to run both the gauge and the sender. With an idiot light, I would definitely run both as the light will alert you where you might not look at a gauge.
 
Geez one of those "why the h*** didn't I think of that?" solutions!

Thanks!

T-fitting. I'll never live this one down. Seriously, thanks for that GREAT tip.

Jerry
 
Heyjay: I was going to do the T on my F150 even though I had the idiot gauge. Couldn't get the right size T at several auto parts stores so I gave up and ran only the mechanical gauge. A week later I am in the hardware and happen on the display of air compressor stuff. Sure enough there was the exact T fitting I needed packaged for air compressor lines. At that point I thought why bother. Good thing I did not have the fuel pump interconnection with the oil pressure sender. Your tip may save a few folks from an embarassing situation though. One would hate to install their shiny new gauge and then have to tow the vehicle in only to hear the mechanic say "that'll be a hundred dollars" having reconnected the old sender.

[ January 27, 2004, 12:20 AM: Message edited by: TallPaul ]
 
Well, I still wish I had thought of that t-fitting trick.

I bought new a 1992 Honda Prelude SR and it didn't have an oil pressure gauge. I wanted to put in an Autometer mechanical gauge and Honda told me if I removed the oil pressure switch, the computer would think I had zero pressure and kill the fuel pump.

Geez. Well, live and learn.

Jerry
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top