why all the concern about firearms lubes?

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AUG

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Jul 4, 2004
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Just wondering because I have been around weapons all my life and have been lucky enough to get some professional training along the way thanks to a previous govt. job (non-military) that allowed me to fire thousands and thousands of rounds through handguns, shotguns, SMG, and carbine. Along the way I also shot IPSC and IDPA. I have used everything under the sun looking for the "perfect" product. I never found it.

One thing I did find out is that every single lube I ever used worked. When I first started shooting I used wd-40 as a CLP type product on every gun I had. This was before wd-40 became "bad" for firearms. I never had a primer go bad and to tell the truth I still use wd-40 today when nothing else is around. I have also used motor oil, STP, tranny fluid, grease of all sorts, and every gun specific product I can think of as a gun lube. For cleaning I sometimes used nothing more than a paper towel to wipe off the fouling. I have cleaned guns with kerosene, wd-40, ZEP, ATF, and so on.

These all seem to work. Never one time can I remember a failure of any sort related to the product I was using.

As a matter of fact on my everyday duty weapons I used NO lube at all. I knew my duty pistol would go about 300 rounds without a drop of lube as long as it was clean and I never had that much pistol ammo anyway so I carried it dry to avoid the oil/grease collecting lint and dirt.

On the flipside I once shot around 6K rounds through a 1911 without a single cleaning. Just added a drop of lube to slide rails every weekend before the match. The gun worked flawlessly. The only reason I ended up cleaning the gun was the fact I was worried about the blued finish.

I just can't figure out why gun enthusiasts have so many opinions on gun cleaners and lubes when in my experience they all seem to do about the same.

FWIW, I use Breakfree CLP 99% of the time these days becuase I got a ton of free samples from a dealer friend and peobably have enough to last another 6 or 7 years. The one product that has saved me more time and has been worth it's weight in gold plated diamonds is the bore snake. You could get a pistol barrel clean with canola oil using one of these.

The only problem I have ever run into is that no product seems to work well on heavy lead fouling. If you shoot a lot of hand loads with cast bullets try the lewis lead remover for the best results.

Just wanted to post a few thoughts.

I hope I didn't stir the pot too much because gun guys sure do take thier chosen products seriously.

God Bless America and our shrinking 2nd amendment rights.
 
they worry about gun lubricants because they are lubrication freaks! it really has nothing to do with how well their current lube works, its that they can discuss and try something new and different in every mechanical device they can get their hands on.
if we had a squeaky wheel forum here there would be guys argueing over what works best on squeaky wheels day in and day out.
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I am just as boring with my engine oil selections.

I mostly use Super Tech from wally world.
 
quote:

Originally posted by ruking77:


There is of course as you know MIL spec's for cleaning and maintainance supplies, but truly the sense I had at the time was it was to prevent getting "snake oil" so to speak.


That's pretty much what MIL specs are all about. A MIL spec item isn't necessarily better than a non-MIL spec item, but it has to meet the specified government standards. They need to do that because commercial standards change to often and are often too vague. And, many companies don't even follow established commercial standards.
 
When I was in the service, (USAF) among other things, I was a munitions officer. One of my "clients" was the small arms training facility. (up to gunnery, bombing, disposal and test ranges etc etc; but not germane to your post)

Over time the small arms training facility literally consumed PALLETS upon PALLETS of almost every conceivable small arms munitions in the inventory. The instructers literally felt the same way you did and only let students clean the weapons as a training excercise.

There is of course as you know MIL spec's for cleaning and maintainance supplies, but truly the sense I had at the time was it was to prevent getting "snake oil" so to speak.

I also owned the 20MM gun shop and the stuff we used at the time to clean barrels was banned from civilian use! It worked GREAT !!!
 
One could probably say the same exact thing about engine oil!

I think there's a deep need for men (don't know about women) to absolutely optimize certain things in their lives whether it makes any sense or not.

For me, it's mechanical stuff. I inherited a lawn mower that works good enough...but bought a new Honda anyway and am meticulously maintaining it. I'm running Mobil1 at relatively short intervals and doing other 'unneeded' maintenance to have cars that are like new (well, mechanically at least, don't care too awful much about the interior etc). Perhaps I'm an idiot but it's my money and it keeps me out of the gin mill
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For other guys, it's their lawn, golf clubs, model airplanes, firearms, whatever.
 
quote:

Originally posted by AUG:
I just can't figure out why gun enthusiasts have so many opinions on gun cleaners and lubes when in my experience they all seem to do about the same.

Brother, you are SOOOOO right!!!

I've been to countless combat shooting schools (law enforcement training) and I've never had a single failure so long as my firearm was relatively clean. In my GLOCK model 22, I could literally go 1,000+ rounds without any failures related to the "dirtyness" of the weapon.

I go to the store and I buy whatever gun oil they happen to have at the lowest price.
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Mil-Spec also covers a lot more than you'd probably consider.

I.e. BreakFree CLP had to meet the spec where it wouldn't cause allergic reactions on the user's skin.

This rules out the use of ATF because some ppl can swim in Mercon/Mercon-V while others will break out in hives.

I used CLP and it does jack for the gas piston on my RPK, same for Hoppes #9 and Outers, and etc... Brasso cleans the gas piston very well.

I agree with AstroVic tho, I just keep my rifle clean whenenver possible. I won't scrub the schitt out of it with a bronze brush but I will try to clean the bore with a nylon brush, dry it out, and lubricate the sliding surfaces with ATF. Just so long as its clean before each range session.
 
quote:

I go to the store and I buy whatever gun oil they happen to have at the lowest price.

ATF or a synthetic motor oil like Mobil 1 etc. comes out much much cheaper than Hoppes and such and there is nothing in them that will harm the weapon. I am using Mobil 1 oil and grease at present. ATF is probably a better bet for preventing rust.
 
I think the whole point behind lightly oiling the bore is to prevent it from rusting.

Doing my 3-5 hour salt water corrosion test, ATF came out top with Break Free CLP in a close 2nd spot. However, my ATF was about $1 for 1 quart, whereas CLP was $4/4 oz.

Pound for pound, ATF is a much better choice for rust protection. It doesn't get gunky, it's easy to apply, and it somehow gets absorbed into the metal (my VEPR's painted finish or baked enamel, has a nice shiny luster and is very slippery after I used ATF on it). The receiver slides on my VEPR (RPK receiver) also seem to have less friction, and my safety selector lever pretty much glides on the surface now.

Mobil 1 was not very good at preventing corrosion according to my test.

Some of the folks here that work with lubrications recommend ATF as a general purpose lube around the garage and house and from my experience with doing so, it hasn't let me down.
 
To be honest, I never really put that much thought into gun lubes or cleaners. WD-40 and Break Free have always worked fine for me. I even use CRC Break Cleaner sometimes which also seems to work pretty good (as a cleaner of course, not a lube).

I did buy a large spray bottle of Rem Oil about 8 years ago and it's still about 95% full.

WD-40 or Break Free for cleaning/lube and teflon grease for hinge pins on my doubles.
 
I can't use brake cleaner on my VEPR because of the epoxy paint finish... but that is a good idea for parkerized finishes.
 
quote:

Originally posted by mikep:
I even use CRC Break Cleaner sometimes which also seems to work pretty good (as a cleaner of course, not a lube).

Break cleaner?
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Breakfree is by far the best gun lube I've used. On another subject. How many of you have have malfunctions with Beretta Pistols? I have had stovepiping, feedjams, etc... owned standard military issue 9mms along with 40 cal Elite models. All have jammed or malfunctioned with regular occurance. Tried every ammunition under the sun and still get the same results. I have years of experience in the military and law enforcement with all sorts of firearms and weapons. Are Berettas just held to higher standard than what they should be? If I solely had to rely on a handgun it sure would not be one of these jamamatics. Personally, I strongly favor a .357 magnum revolver of good quality. Just old fashioned wheel gun guy I guess!
 
I've heard of M9 failures in Gulf War II, some exactly as you described with your Beretta.

I was reading up on the history of the Galil/Valmet and they said that the FN FALs were jamomatics in the war of 1967 (3 days war?) and they proceeded to find the best solution. Among the candidates for their QPL were the M16A1, Stoner 63 (aka Robinson Armaments M96), and a few others along with the Galil. The testing was specifically for a rifle that wouldn't jam in desert conditions.

They ended up choosing the Galil and adopted it in 1972 or 1973. It's basically a Klashnikov with lots of differences (aperture sights, thumb safety, etc...)
 
quote:

Originally posted by tom slick:
they worry about gun lubricants because they are lubrication freaks! it really has nothing to do with how well their current lube works, its that they can discuss and try something new and different in every mechanical device they can get their hands on.
if we had a squeaky wheel forum here there would be guys argueing over what works best on squeaky wheels day in and day out.
cheers.gif


Quite possibly the best BITOG forum post to date
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CheckMate mags (aftermarket) are a major problem for the M9 issues. Stick with factory mags and at least BreakFree CLP (or better) for lube your jams should go away. Only problem I evere had with the 92f style (bertta or Tauras) has been related to aftermarket mags. Granted my sampling has only been 4 different types.
 
Gregory,
Thanks for the advice on staying with factory magazines for the Beretta. I got to thinking about it and I do recall that the malfunctions did occur with aftermarket mags for the most part. I have been away from Berettas for a long time now. If I buy another Beretta I will use your advice on the magazines. As for now, Iam going to stick with a wheel gun. I just can't get away from the knock down power of a magnum! I checked with Department of Conservation in my state of Kansas and they told me there has never been a white tail deer taken with a four inch .357 magnum revolver to the best of their knowledge. I guess I'll give it a try and possibly set a new record if I get lucky!
 
The teflon from the BreakFree CLP seems to work very well in preventing powder residue and primer salts from sticking to the inside of the receiver and the receiver cover on my VEPR K (RPK).

From my own tests, Breakfree CLP does an outstanding job of preventing atmospheric rusting.
 
quote:

I checked with Department of Conservation in my state of Kansas and they told me there has never been a white tail deer taken with a four inch .357 magnum revolver to the best of their knowledge. I guess I'll give it a try and possibly set a new record if I get lucky!

NO, but I took one with a 6" 586, with 4-power scope, a few years back (in Wilson County) with handloads.

When I don't want to lug a rifle around and I suspect the shots will be close or in brush, the 586 will do the job.

LAtely, I have been using a 12 guage shotgun with rifled barrel and 1 oz. saboted copper slugs. 75 to 90 yard kills are no problem, and they go down where they are shot.
 
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