2004 Ford 6.0 PSD Amsoil Series 3000 5W-30

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I ran Red Line before switching to Amsoil, but drained all of the RL out of the engine before switching. The high moly levels have me puzzled. Don't know if that could be residual moly from the RL or not. The Amsoil did an outstanding job in my engine. The 6.0 PSD shears the heck out of most oils, but the Amsoil S3K stayed true to its' viscosity. The Amsoil also improved my fuel mileage by a minimum of 1.1 MPG at every tank.
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[ May 08, 2006, 11:07 AM: Message edited by: Go_Hogs_Go ]
 
The Moly is left over from RL. How many miles are on the sample? This is Amsoil's best long drain oil. They claim this and it's evident by the price.
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quote:

Originally posted by buster:
The Moly is left over from RL. How many miles are on the sample? This is Amsoil's best long drain oil. They claim this and it's evident by the price.
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Buster,

Look at my report above and you will notice that it has a column that states the miles on my engine and the oil. To answer your question, the miles on the oil are 5457
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The moly is from the RL and it will dissipate over the next 1-2 changes.

How much of a fuel savings is an increase of 1.1 mpg for you? BTW this is why they formulated the S3000 as an SAE 5w-30 and not a 5w-40.

In closing, I just wanted to add this ....I've had well intended, (but not very knowledgable) folks over at the VW TDI club forums telling me for the past several years that you can't run the Series 3000, 5w-30 in a TDI diesel engine because it will cause abnormal and possible catastrophic wear to the camshaft.

You'll note the comments on this analysis indicate that there are almost no wear metal particles in this oil large enough to show up under microscopic examination. I think that comment speaks for itself....


TS

[ March 31, 2005, 08:10 AM: Message edited by: TooSlick ]
 
quote:

Originally posted by Quick_lude:
Hogs, what are your driving habits? How much idling do you do?

My driving habits are a mix of highway and city. I idle as little as possible. The towing that I do is light/medium duty towing, that is when I do tow.
 
Mr Peterson,

I'd agree with that to some extent, however a bypass filter cleans very slowly and I"d still expect to see some larger particles in the crankcase at any point in time....

I really like your lab report format, by the way - it's very easy to find all the data. I spoke to Mark on the phone the other day for about 15-20 minutes and he really knows his stuff. Whatever you're paying him, it's not enough ...
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Note: The very high apparent oxidation in this sample is due to the esters in the Amsoil Series 3000, basestock blend....

Tooslick
 
Hi Too

Thanks for the kind words. I agree about the filter and would expect to see some particles too, but there were none. The low wear levels do indicate that the oil is preforming very well and I wasn't exaggerating when I said this looked like new oil.

I hadn't thought about it but perhaps this oil is doing such a good job of dispersing soot that it doesn't show up in the filter? I've never seen a diesel engine with no visible soot when we do the microscope exam but properly dispersed soot should be sub-micron in size and it should go right through this 5 micron filter.

It would be interesting to see some samples from engines using this oil without a bypass filter. That would tell us how much the filter impacts the results.

Oh, we got a new reference oil but I suspect the oxidation will remain high due to the presence of the esters (as you indicated) and the fact that the FTIR detects the c=o moiety.

Stinky
 
Stinky,

Actually......a tightly wound roll of TP has a nominal filtration level of 1/10th of a micron. I might get a particle count next time to see absolute level of filtration. I like clean oil....
 
quote:

Originally posted by Go_Hogs_Go:
Stinky,

Actually......a tightly wound roll of TP has a nominal filtration level of 1/10th of a micron. I might get a particle count next time to see absolute level of filtration. I like clean oil....


I don't think so, regardless of what a fine fellow like Ralph says. I've been told by an oil chemist that a sub-micron filter would remove some of the additives in the oil. The usual labs can't determine particles smaller than 2 or 3 microns, anyway, and that's smaller than the thickness of the oil film in the bearings.


Ken
 
I think you might have that backwards Ken. Most labs can't detect particles bigger than 3 microns or so with elemental analysis. The little ones are easy.
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It would be interesting to take a baseline sample immediately after changing oil (and running a few minutes) before the bypass filter has had a chance to do much. Then take another sample again at about 1000 miles to compare additive levels. I predict there would be little change.
 
A roll of TP filters down to one hundred nanometers, eh? Where do you buy this stuff?

The stacked, compressed disk (made from cotton linters), filters are generally absolute down to about 3 um and nominal (50% efficient) down to about 1 um. I'd sure a "spinner" type filter will remove even smaller particles....


TS
 
We tried using a spinner filter on some trucks that had bad soot problems. They did remove soot but not enough to lower it to an acceptable level. I'm not sure how well they work with submicron particles though since they don't have much mass. It wouldn't be hard to tell though if you know the speed the speed of the spinner.
 
Hi,
Stinky - I have extensive experience with MANN-HUMMEL Spinner 2 centrifuge by-pass filters. Many millions of Kms and 8 years on I would never purchase a new heavy diesel engine wiithout one fitted

These were/are comined with Donaldson ELF3998 synthetic media FF filters. In the end after much testing we have moved on to cleanable SS FF 30micron filters - these are serviced annually or at 250kkms as is the centrifuge

In my DDEC 4 Detroit's we saw these results;
Contaminant uptake = 0.0025gr/km
Soot OCI avg.= 3.23% (Mobil limit 3.5, DD limit 3.0)
Iron OCI avg = 130ppm (DD limit 150)
OCI avg = 90 kkms

An iron or soot condemnation limit (mine, Mobils or DD's)was always reached before 130kkms

The centrifuge works very well indeed and we never saw a FF filter with anything in it over many millions of kms and about 5 years so moved on then to the SS FF filters

I have had a lot of exposure to the cartridge type by-pass filters (not TP) on earthmoving equipment and trucks too. The centrifuge is a much better animal and very easy to service

Regards
Doug
 
That sounds pretty good Doug. In our situation the customer was using an engine too small for the job at a load factor that was too high and he wanted to go too far on the oil change. He wouldn't accept the fact that he tried to skimp on the engine and bought one that wasn't right for his application. Its no wonder the filter wouldn't handle the soot. When we took the valve cover off it looked like someone had dumped coffee grounds all over everything.

Did you ever have any issues with additive removal, in particular zinc? I knew a fellow who worked at Westrac in Perth and when I visited him a few years ago he mentioned some concerns but I can't remember the details and he has since moved on.
 
Hi Stinky,
no, no additive issues, we closely monitored the oil's condition (Del 1) over many UOAs prior to deciding on an OCI for all engines

I reported here on another thread that one engine was pulled apart for an "inspect & measure" at 1m kms (620k miles). The engine was amazingly clean everywhere

All parts measued up by the engine's maker as "suitable for reuse" - including the troublesome pistons in this particular engine series
All bearings were as new (the cam bearings were simply rotated), the camshaft and rollers/pins were as new too. All of the liners still had original finish marks over their whole wear surface length

At my insistance new rod bearings and rings were installed and then bedded in via a dyno sequence after 3k kms road use

An important part of the installation of a centrifuge is to ensure that the oil pump has plenty of surplus flow at all times. The centrifuge flows oil when cold too (unlike TP/cartridge types etc). The twin jet drive chamber runs at speeds up to 6000rpm and is audible in action - as soon as the engine cranks over - this serves as a good quick service check!

Because of the way Del 1 handles soot we could have gone much further with OCIs. My conservatism based on the DD limit of 3% amd Mobil's 3.5% I settled on 3.5%. I had been told by "certain people in the know" that 6% is acceptable with this oil. After the "tear down" result I believe this is so

Regards
Doug

[ April 20, 2005, 11:03 PM: Message edited by: Doug Hillary ]
 
quote:

Originally posted by Go_Hogs_Go:
I ran Red Line before switching to Amsoil, but drained all of the RL out of the engine before switching. The high moly levels have me puzzled.

There was probably over 1 quart left in your engine. There is a resevour for HEUI injection system.

Not to mention the light film over oil that is always covering the internals of that large engine. I be it it could be as much as 1/2 quart.
 
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