Hello, I have a 2002 Toyota Camry V6 w/38K; the problem I am having: I was cleaning my engine and decided to remove the intake so I can reach the back of the engine. When I remove the intake from the throttle body there was an excessive amount of oil in the intake and throttle body. I took it to Toyota and they told me this is normal. I have changed the PCV valve (which is connected after the throttle body) I also have leaky valve covers and black dry soot on my exhaust tip (always), and they also told me this was normal. Is this correct? I know if I have dry soot on the exhaust, it means that my car is running too rich.
Oil in my throttle body?
- Thread starter mtnet2000
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Do you really have a PCV valve? Typically most EFI engines use a metered orifice (air dependant idle control). One hose from the valve cover goes below the throttle body (to the metered orifice) and the "vent" goes above the throttle body. Either way the blowby gasses end up in the intake stream.
But ..I think if you've got THAT much oil in your intake plumbing..you've got excessive blow-by. Odd for such a new engine IMHO.
How soon does it "reaccumulate" after you've cleaned it?? Any excessive pinging?
But ..I think if you've got THAT much oil in your intake plumbing..you've got excessive blow-by. Odd for such a new engine IMHO.
How soon does it "reaccumulate" after you've cleaned it?? Any excessive pinging?
Most of the newer (98 - 2003) F150's have that same problem. Over active emissions systems.
Have them fix the valve cover leak. As far as the oil in the intake it would depend on the mileage. If you have under 25000 I would say that is unusual and needs to be looked into. They need to replace valve cover gaskets anyway so might as well have them fix the issue with the intake plenum.
Daily Drives:
-2003 Toyota Tacoma PreRunner XtraCab, 2.7 Liter , Mobil1 Synthetic SS 5W-30.
ODO 8600 Miles.
-1995 Toyota 4-Runner 3.0 V6, Mobil1 Synthetic SS 10W-30.
ODO 84700 Miles.
http://community.webshots.com/user/amkeer
Daily Drives:
-2003 Toyota Tacoma PreRunner XtraCab, 2.7 Liter , Mobil1 Synthetic SS 5W-30.
ODO 8600 Miles.
-1995 Toyota 4-Runner 3.0 V6, Mobil1 Synthetic SS 10W-30.
ODO 84700 Miles.
http://community.webshots.com/user/amkeer
I got the same problem with a 93 Caprice 5.7L engine. Oil in the air filter.
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I'm curious how this can be an overactive emissions system
. This can only add to emissions and would not be an issue if the oil saturated vapor did not exist in such large quantities. It doesn't on most engines. The oil is a byproduct of blow by. Blow by is, by no means, a byprouct of any emissions systme that I'm aware of. That is, although the effective handling of blowby gasses is required in any "total emissions" package ..its presence has nothing to do with emissions and everything to do with poor ring seal. I would think, if anything, that the blowby residue would foul complete combustion and would be better handled by a engineered collection basin that would be emptied and disposed of at maintenance intervals ..if in fact it yields such amounts that you (all of you) are mentioning here.
This could be a perception thing. How long is it between cleaning and "saturation"?? Neither my 99 or 02 Jeeps have ever had any oil residue on the throttle body so I can't view it as "normal".
Maybe your dealer techs can elaborate.
This could be a perception thing. How long is it between cleaning and "saturation"?? Neither my 99 or 02 Jeeps have ever had any oil residue on the throttle body so I can't view it as "normal".
Maybe your dealer techs can elaborate.
Would blow by come from in the engine through the air plenum and into the throttle body? I know that the oil is coming in from one of the hoses on top of the front valve cover and into my intake/throttle body (oil is not coming through the throttle body it is going into it)
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Let me try and clear up what I'm saying here. You have two hoses (typically) coming off of your valve cover(s). ONE goes to a PCV valve (or a CCV metered orifice) ..THIS is attached to the manifold (or just one runner of the manifold) BELOW the throttle body (to get engine vacuum).
The other hose has a primary function of being a vent for the hose attached to manifold vacuum (this hose is the "in" for filtered air..the other is the "out" for blow by gasses). The secondary function of this hose (and it appears in your case ..it operates in this mode quite often) it vents any EXCESS blow by gasses to the same location (the combustion chamber) ..except it dumps its garbage ABOVE the throttle body.
No engine should "normally" do this in any significant amount/volume/frequency. If I heard that from any mechanic ..I'd have to challenge him on why so many other engines do not show this side effect.
The ford 3.8's with spilt port intakes do this as well. Ford supposedly "redesigned" the valve cover (with the PCV port) with a baffle to help prevent oil carry over. Oil still carries over & collects in the nooks & crannies of the intake. Never enough to notice oil loss, but enough to collect over time, swell seals & cause vac leaks. The only way to further prevent this would be to add a seperator to the PCV line.
G/luck
Joel
G/luck
Joel
Okay I need some help here, They where replacing my valve cover gaskets today and I asked to see if I can see my engine while it was apart. When I went to the back of the shop I saw this oil in my intake, actually it was all over and the oil was wet and oil was down inside the engine where this plenum connects to. The mechanic said this is normal! So basically the oil is being forced out the throttle body from the inside! Is this true for a car w/39000 miles? And the best part is when I went to pick up my car, they told me to come back tommorow because the mechanic didn't seat the back gasket correctly, and when he started the engine oil went all over the place!!!
***56K Warning***
***56K Warning***
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No ..it's not true for a car with 39,000 miles ..it's also not true for a car with 100,000,000 miles. The oil in your throttle body and on that intake is not "normal" for any car.
Let me put it this way. Although I could see how an American V8 ..with an open lifter valley couldsuck oil into the intake via perhaps one runner ..but in no way shape or modality would that oil end up going upstream to the carb/tb. The engine is a vacuum cleaner ...unless it backfires ..it is in only!
That oil (if it is the same oil that you see in your throttle body) came from blow by gasses ..or a faulty baffle in one of your valve covers.
I would feel quite shocked if any mechanic could possibly explain to me that this condition is "normal" ...typical ..not unheard of ...frequent ..but never normal. This is not a normal condition for any intake that I've ever seen on any engine (except perhaps a detroit diesel two stroke w/blower). Some turbo engines have troubles with oil migration and infiltration into the intake ..but a normally aspirated engine????? Note that this is considered a "condition" and not "normal".
I would definitely seek a second opinion ...or if someone can actually substantiate that most "normal" operational norms of a normal engine have been turned upside down.
It's "normal" for 03 Cobras and 99-up Lightnings. You should see their intercoolers - they're soaked with engine oil. You can find puddles of oil behind the TB.
This can be found on aforementioned vehicles with less than 100 miles.
My "American V8" does not have an open "lifter" valley (It's OHC) and all the aforementioned vehicles have American V8s, but they're OHC. I do have a PCV valve on the cam cover (aka valve cover) that leads to the intake plenum.
The fix for these engines is to install an air compressor air filter/oil separator inline with the PCV vacuum hose. Some people put 2 or 3 of these units. Others install clear fuel filters. The oil separator is a better idea because you can drain the engine oil from time to time.
This can be found on aforementioned vehicles with less than 100 miles.
My "American V8" does not have an open "lifter" valley (It's OHC) and all the aforementioned vehicles have American V8s, but they're OHC. I do have a PCV valve on the cam cover (aka valve cover) that leads to the intake plenum.
The fix for these engines is to install an air compressor air filter/oil separator inline with the PCV vacuum hose. Some people put 2 or 3 of these units. Others install clear fuel filters. The oil separator is a better idea because you can drain the engine oil from time to time.
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I'm sorry ..for the hi-po types ..especially the SC and TC engines ...sure.. even ones that see the uppper rpm limits regularly ...but for ANY daily drive for John Q. Public ...nah. There is no excuse for that much blow by in any engine that isn't shot ...and I've had plenty. Neither of my jeep engines has this conditon ..nor my beaters a 92 Caravan and a 91 Taurus. The Caravan has some blow-by ..but it is nothing that would coat the entire intake in any thing less than maybe a decade of neglect.
I would have to see bona fide factory printed material saying that oil contamination in the intake is expected and approved to the point that there is no corrective action for it. That is, it IS a routine operational condition that is totally integrated with their combustion management/maintenance modality. This is a side effect of some other condition and not normal. How in the world is this oil NOT going to end up in the combustion chamber and form deposits on the valves and pistons and plugs?
I keep thinking of the story "The Emperor's New Clothes".
I'm not flaming (trying to insult anyone) here ..but I even ran this by you engine builder pal and he can't imagine why anyone would possibly assert that this is normal. This is something beyond his 40+ years experience.
Any properly designed and built engine should never have a blow by management problem that results in this condition under any circumstances that I could find acceptable.
My intake on my wife's 99 4.0 is dry as a bone. It has over 85k on it and I've only cleaned the throttle body once just for the fun of it ..NO OIL.
I would have to see bona fide factory printed material saying that oil contamination in the intake is expected and approved to the point that there is no corrective action for it. That is, it IS a routine operational condition that is totally integrated with their combustion management/maintenance modality. This is a side effect of some other condition and not normal. How in the world is this oil NOT going to end up in the combustion chamber and form deposits on the valves and pistons and plugs?
I keep thinking of the story "The Emperor's New Clothes".
I'm not flaming (trying to insult anyone) here ..but I even ran this by you engine builder pal and he can't imagine why anyone would possibly assert that this is normal. This is something beyond his 40+ years experience.
Any properly designed and built engine should never have a blow by management problem that results in this condition under any circumstances that I could find acceptable.
My intake on my wife's 99 4.0 is dry as a bone. It has over 85k on it and I've only cleaned the throttle body once just for the fun of it ..NO OIL.
We'll check this out... Toyota want's to do an oil consumption test on my vehicle, (here's the best part) IF MY CAR USES MORE 1 QUART OF OIL WITHIN 1000MILES, they will look further into the problem! This is F@%king crazy!! If my car would consume 1 quart in 1000 miles, and the recommended oil change is every 3000 miles, when I do my oil change Iwould have only have 2 quarts left!! Toyota is going to lose a lot of customers if they have this atitude
Ford considers it normal to lose 1 qt every 1000 miles, or was it 1 qt every 3000 miles...
Regardless, my almost-new 4.6L SOHC V8 (well, 13k miles in 4 years) has a nice layer of oil on the intake plenum (cavity behind the Throttle Body).
Regardless, my almost-new 4.6L SOHC V8 (well, 13k miles in 4 years) has a nice layer of oil on the intake plenum (cavity behind the Throttle Body).
Sad to say it's 1 quart every 1,000 miles according to Ford.
Whimsey
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