how hard is abusive driving on a car?

[MRC01]

quote:

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Originally posted by outersquare:
Like on my car, I redline it several times a day, several tire screaming turns and brake torque occasionally.
This is on just a 2000 corolla.

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How abusive it is depends on what in particular you're doing.

Taking it to redline doesn't hurt anything as long as the engine is fully warmed up, all fluids are reasonably fresh & topped up, and you're not spinning the tires.

Hard standing starts, dumping the clutch, slipping the clutch at high RPM, power shifting, and spinning the tires all are very hard on the drivetrain and sooner or later will break something.

Open track events where you brake down frequently and hard from 3 digit speeds will kill your pads & rotors prematurely. Also spinning the engine at or near redline for extended periods of time while under hard lateral acceleration, can accelerate engine wear.

[ August 02, 2003, 01:20 PM: Message edited by: MRC01 ]

 

[JohnBrowning]

If you drive it hard all of the time you can expect to only get 1/3 the life out of power train before it no longer performs up to design spec. I have seen cars that normaly would have lasted 300,000 miles killed in 70,000-84,000 miles of hard driveing. By killed I mean that tthe valves,guides, seals and rings wear worn so bad that compression was way down and they smoked badly.

The same holds true for power output. As you produce more and more HP and Tq. from an engine engine life cylce diminish's. Example: Lets say a 3.0V6 putting out 200 HP is designed to last 200,000 miles. If you tweak it to produce 800HP and race it all out you will be lucky to get 1000-2000 miles out of it beween rebuilds.

Rapid application of torque is what wears out engines and drive trains. When you take of from a dead stop rapidly you are punishing the entire powertrain.

 

[Patman]

quote:

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Originally posted by JohnBrowning:
If you drive it hard all of the time you can expect to only get 1/3 the life out of power train before it no longer performs up to design spec. I have seen cars that normaly would have lasted 300,000 miles killed in 70,000-84,000 miles of hard driveing. By killed I mean that tthe valves,guides, seals and rings wear worn so bad that compression was way down and they smoked badly.

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I think it depends on the design of the engine though. There are many guys out there with LT1 Camaros and Firebirds with 100 to 200k of very hard driving on them and are still on the original engines. Trannies and rear ends are a different story though. I plan on getting 250k out of my LT1, even with 30-40 quarter mile runs per year and tons of full throttle action on the street every day.

 

[outersquare]

Like on my car, I redline it several times a day, several tire screaming turns and brake torque occasionally.

This is on just a 2000 corolla.

 

[moribundman]

I've been driving all my manual shift cars ('80 and '89 VW Scirocco, '94 VW Corrado, '96 Audi A4) routinely hard. I'm treating the engine (and tranny) like a raw egg until properly warmed up, then I'm game. I've never worn out a motor or had any engine damage in any of those cars. The Scirocco needed new valve shaft seals, that's it. My A 4 has currently 126k miles on the engine, and it's running better than when new. I expect to keep the car as long as possible, and I'm not going to baby it.

To clarify: I don't think I'm "abusing" my car. I'm just driving it according to what it and I are capable of. And no, I'm not racing all the time. My car gets also maintained very well. I've had passengers repeatedly tell me I'll blow up an engine, though.

[ August 03, 2003, 01:28 AM: Message edited by: moribundman ]

 

[JohnBrowning]

Ok I guess I better define hard driveing. By hard I mean driveing it like you are in the running for World Rally Championship or are a member of Ivan the Iron Man Stuarts(sp) Baja race team. Constant downshifting and WOT accelration pass's lots of jack rabit starts, high G loading in conjunction with high RPM's.... THese things are hard on a powertrain. I am not talking about the guy that decides to take his Corvette or F body up to 140MPH or to do an 11 second 1/4 pass once in a while.

 

[got boost?]

it's the worst thing you can do to your car. patman, the LT1 IS a VERY good engine, but expecting 250k miles out of an abused engine/tranny (qtr miles runs ARE abusive) is a little ridiculous. there is a reason most serious weekend racers have a dedicated car for race only duty.

[ August 05, 2003, 04:09 PM: Message edited by: got boost? ]

 

[Patman]

quote:

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Originally posted by got boost?:
it's the worst thing you can do to your car. patman, the LT1 IS a VERY good engine, but expecting 250k miles out of an abused engine/tranny (qtr miles runs ARE abusive) is a little ridiculous. there is a reason most serious weekend racers have a dedicated car for race only duty.

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Based on my oil analysis results though, it doesn't look to me like my quarter mile runs are hurting the wear numbers too much, Terry says I have one of the lowest wearing LT1s he interprets results for. I realize I will might go through a transmission before 250k though. But if I leave my LT1 close to stock and don't go over 300hp, I might be ok. 4L60E trannies can survive a lot longer when they aren't pushed too hard (in other words, with my shift points of 5700rpm, it's not as abusive to the trans as those cars out there with 6500rpm shift points)

 

[drm7]

outersquare: I used to own a '90 Corolla with the 1.6l and 100hp. It was a 5spd manual. I beat the crap out of that thing and it took it in stride. I redlined it everyday, used engine braking by downshifting to slow down. It was just so weak, 100hp, that I flogged it just to keep up with city traffic. Now, I'm very careful not to run an engine hard until it's warmed up but if I had another I'd probably drive it the same way without thinking about it. I put 140,000 miles on it and my nephew put it over 180,000 before getting rid of it. With 110k on the clock I could go 5000 miles w/o using a drop of oil. The only things ever replaced were the starter and alternator (besides brakes, tires, 2 cv joints etc). Not even the clutch was replaced. It was a great car and I'm sure it went over 200k and may still be on the road somewhere. Not all cars are built this well so I wouldn't drive a chevy cavalier this way but the toyota is great. Overall the maintenance I performed was less than I should have. Didn't change the oil often enough for dino. Didn't flush the radiator for the first 4 years. I was early 20's when I drove it so 'young and dumb'.

 

[mf150]

look at Mustangs, too. People abuse the **** out of them on a regular basis and get good service life out of them.

Also Police cars and taxi cabs.

What it comes down to is: Abuse your car as well as you take care of it. If you have the money to spend on repairs, your vehicle will never die.

 

[Tyrolkid]

I run 6-8 open track events a year, and 10-15 drag strip days. All of my oil analyses have come out great thus far. '00 VW GTI 1.8T, 45k miles. 145 stock whp, 215 right now.....