I put under 100 hours a year on each of two farm tractors, one small 2810 Ford and an 92hp 826D IHC. My habit has been to change the oil annually, just before putting them into winter storage. Things I have read recently have given me some cause for doubt. I don't like the idea of old oil sitting in the engine all winter, with it's oxidation additives partially or fully used up. I also don't like the idea of letting new oil deteriorate and collect moisture for about 4 months. I'm only going one way or another, I'm not changing oil at both times. With that restriction, I'm open to hearing argument on either side of the question. The oil used is 15W-40 Rotella-T dino and the storage building is unheated. The small tractor does get used a few hours over the winter for plowing and clearing snow. The big tractor will just sit.
Oil Change Before or After Winter Storage?
- Thread starter Jim Allen
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The plant I work at has a 5310 John Deere tractor and a few other riding mowers. We just change the oil at the end of the season, stabilize the fuel and park 'em (do the same with both of my bikes). I would worry more about mice getting into places where they shouldn't be.
Jim,
I'm in mid Michigan and am in the exact same situation with three John Deere Tractors(two sixty hp and one small 25 hp).
In my opinion, the answer may vary according to the recommended OCI and unique operating conditions of your units.
I put about 100 hrs. annually on the 2 bigger tractors that have recommended OCI's of 200 hrs. At 100 hrs. thru November, the oil still has plenty of additives to ward off any problems (UOA). I change my oil in March before the "new" season. Here's my reasoning:
1. Plenty of reserve TBN/additives to handle soot,deposits,moisture, acid, etc. over winter. At higher hrs.(maybe +150)I would consider fall change.
2. I dislike an engine/tractor sitting 4 months with zero operation (unless you do the FULL storage procedure) . I start mine up monthly ("warmer day"), run them full throttle for an hour to distribute lube/burn off moisture, etc.. Also, I use my tractors maybe 10 hrs. over winter, so they are not technically in storage.
3. I want to start the new season with fresh oil when the tracor works the hardest. I question the idea of new oil (partially contaminated by moisture and whatever doesn't drain out)sitting four months in the tractor before the work season.
On my small 4115 25 hp tractor I change oil once in spring and once in fall. We use this tractor year round (plow snow). It gets about 120 hours per year but the oil sump is ONLY 2.5 quarts - way too small, thus more frequent OCI's for me.
Good luck and I would like to hear more arguments. Maybe my way introduces more moisture, contaminants, and wear???
With today's quality oils, probably either way works, depending on your unique situation,. A fall and/or spring UOA would tell you about fuel dilution, TBN, etc. to help you decide.
I'm in mid Michigan and am in the exact same situation with three John Deere Tractors(two sixty hp and one small 25 hp).
In my opinion, the answer may vary according to the recommended OCI and unique operating conditions of your units.
I put about 100 hrs. annually on the 2 bigger tractors that have recommended OCI's of 200 hrs. At 100 hrs. thru November, the oil still has plenty of additives to ward off any problems (UOA). I change my oil in March before the "new" season. Here's my reasoning:
1. Plenty of reserve TBN/additives to handle soot,deposits,moisture, acid, etc. over winter. At higher hrs.(maybe +150)I would consider fall change.
2. I dislike an engine/tractor sitting 4 months with zero operation (unless you do the FULL storage procedure) . I start mine up monthly ("warmer day"), run them full throttle for an hour to distribute lube/burn off moisture, etc.. Also, I use my tractors maybe 10 hrs. over winter, so they are not technically in storage.
3. I want to start the new season with fresh oil when the tracor works the hardest. I question the idea of new oil (partially contaminated by moisture and whatever doesn't drain out)sitting four months in the tractor before the work season.
On my small 4115 25 hp tractor I change oil once in spring and once in fall. We use this tractor year round (plow snow). It gets about 120 hours per year but the oil sump is ONLY 2.5 quarts - way too small, thus more frequent OCI's for me.
Good luck and I would like to hear more arguments. Maybe my way introduces more moisture, contaminants, and wear???
With today's quality oils, probably either way works, depending on your unique situation,. A fall and/or spring UOA would tell you about fuel dilution, TBN, etc. to help you decide.
I do not see the need for full throttle for an hour to distribute the oil and burn off moisture,maybe throttle it up to 1,500 rpm for 15 minutes?
I suppose someone could always do a UOA on fresh oil put in a lawn mower and left over the period of the winter, mowed once and got the UOA results, but then again that probably wouldn't be accurate because there are a few small gas engines around here that when the oil gets changed and even a short duration such as 5 minutes are on then and drained more stuff comes loose and the oil is already dark, so I suppose it really can't be done easily, at least with something that has no filter.
I have always changed the oil before the start of the season on all of my equipment for everything except for my generator, which was used recently. My generator gets a change as soon as the first tank of gas is gone(about 2 hours) and then after 25 hours and once again at the end of its use, but this excludes the 4 times a year 15 minute excercise that I put on it to make sure it's ready when it needs to be.
...In the end, it probably doesn't matter. Whatever engine components that have oil on them will be protected, it would have to be some really disgusting and old oil to cause problems in my opinion. How much more wear could there be? If you trust oil for a month in storage, why can't it be trusted for 6 months.
I have always changed the oil before the start of the season on all of my equipment for everything except for my generator, which was used recently. My generator gets a change as soon as the first tank of gas is gone(about 2 hours) and then after 25 hours and once again at the end of its use, but this excludes the 4 times a year 15 minute excercise that I put on it to make sure it's ready when it needs to be.
...In the end, it probably doesn't matter. Whatever engine components that have oil on them will be protected, it would have to be some really disgusting and old oil to cause problems in my opinion. How much more wear could there be? If you trust oil for a month in storage, why can't it be trusted for 6 months.
Steve,
Farm tractors have a lot of metal mass to warm up and their cooling systems seems to be better than autos. Thus, unless your tilling or something, it takes quite a while to really warm them up.
My tractors run at about 2,200 rpm at PTO speed and they are governed so that "full" throttle is only about 2,500 rpm. And, in reality, I probably run them 1,000 or so under full throttle. No big deal.
Again, a decision must be made on each individual circumstance. I sure would like to know if the answer to "new fall oil" vs. "storage with low hour oil"!
I agree, doitmyself, on your reasoning for your fall/spring OCI on your little tractor. My "little" tractor (not many more HP than yours, but probably lots more torque) holds 8 quarts. The big tractor 11. I probably run the the old 'Binder on nice days, sure, so it isn't really "daed" for four months. We need to get old 'Kule's opinion on this.
MolaKule
Staff member
I prefer fresh oil before winter storage with about 5 minutes of operation to circulate the additives thoroughly. Most oils have a good tbn and rust inhibitor so I wouldn't worry too much. A little cylinder rust after startup is inevitable but not destructive.
If you are concerned about rusting in the engine, our Classic Form engine preservative will prevent rusting and corrosion.
If you are concerned about rusting in the engine, our Classic Form engine preservative will prevent rusting and corrosion.
JHZR2
Staff member
Mola... Can you use the ClassisForm or SX-Up, etc. in oil inan engine that sits, maybe weeks at a time, up to maybe 6 weeks... to help inhibit same?
Sorry for the ignorance, but Classic Form goes INTO the oil, right?
Thanks, I have great need for this.
JMH
Sorry for the ignorance, but Classic Form goes INTO the oil, right?
Thanks, I have great need for this.
JMH
Hi,
some of the excellent oils in the Castrol "Agri" range include a Vapour Phase Inhibitor that effectively protects against internal corrosion above the oil line. These HDEOs oils have been around for some decades, are popular with low use expensive equipment operators and are suitable for all round use in the correct application
According to the "model" they have many official engine maker Approvals so can be used when Warranty obligations still apply!
If the engine is used infrequently or for short trips, a spring OC is desirable
Doug
some of the excellent oils in the Castrol "Agri" range include a Vapour Phase Inhibitor that effectively protects against internal corrosion above the oil line. These HDEOs oils have been around for some decades, are popular with low use expensive equipment operators and are suitable for all round use in the correct application
According to the "model" they have many official engine maker Approvals so can be used when Warranty obligations still apply!
If the engine is used infrequently or for short trips, a spring OC is desirable
Doug
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