Something Funny Going On w/ New Electric Meter

[LoneRanger]

Something seems weird with this electric usage. Retention pond aerator, runs off timer for 12 hr per day runs. Nothing else powered from the pedestal at sidewalk, just the aerator. 09/25/18 they installed new digital meter. Triple the kwH after the new meter was installed, but no increased run time per day, still same timer setting. Single speed motor, 110v. What's up with this? I could understand a few kwH difference but triple the usage (17 x 3 = 51) being shown for a same 14 day run?

 

[Donald]

Have you actually looked at the meter to see if it was read incorrectly? I am thinking its a one time thing and they got the starting reading wrong.

I had a meter read incorrectly and it took months to get it straightened out.

I assume they can read the meter from the central office and do not send around the meter man to take readings.

 

[LoneRanger]

The new meter is possibly the type that emits a near field signal or other wireless that they can drive down the street and pick it up, not sure.

 

[AZjeff]

My wife works for the gas company and started in meter reading. Recently they replaced all the analog meters with digital wireless types and had a few problems with the initial startup. The other possibility is that your old meter was off and/or the new meter is off. It seems your application is very controlled and you can prove a history of 1.15-1.2 kw/day useage with previous bills. I'd certainly call the electric company and report it.

The electric company put a wireless meter on our old house that went bad after a couple of months and shut itself off. Diagnostics were done 100 miles away and the service tech came and switched out meters.

 

[drtyler]

Many of the new meters are far more accurate with low usage device than the older type meters. So if the previous meter was older, it's very likely that it wasn't recording all of your usage.

It is not uncommon for a utility to see a spike in usage when new meters are installed because of this.

 

[ragtoplvr]

also many commercial meters also measure power factor . There are electronic power factor controllers that can pay for themselves pretty quickly. .

Rod

 

[ragtoplvr]

 

[MNgopher]

Our old meter with the wheel with failed, and as it started to fail, went slower and slower - meaning we paid for less electricity than we actually used. Eventually, our readings went to very little, would spring back up, and then back down again. They came to replace the meter based on the behavior of the old one. Apparently, that was the usual way they failed in our system.

New digital meter put in, nice consistent readings as expected again.

It may just be the old meter was faulty.

 

[StevieC]

When my parents had their meter replaced by a smart meter their usage went up on the bill ~30%. They complained and were told all was fine and that every meter goes through strict testing at the factory blah blah blah, but they knew better.

They had their lawyer send a letter because they had 5 years of bills showing about the same usuage year after year and when the 3 new bills they had recieved were compared to the same months in the previous 5 years it was consistently higher by about 30%

A crew came out shortly after and found a faulty meter and it was replaced. All has been fine since.

They bought a monitoring device that has clamps that go around each supply wire in their main breaker panel and keeps track of the usuage so they can compare to their bills. It's pretty accurate.

Our smart meter seems to have been fine since we got ours with no change in the bills.

 

[Colt45ws]

Originally Posted by ragtoplvr
also many commercial meters also measure power factor . There are electronic power factor controllers that can pay for themselves pretty quickly. .

Rod


Right, but they wont if this is a non-commercial property. Is this a commercial property or not? If they are measuring power factor than the inductive load of the motor will have a poor power factor == it will count more power being used.

 

[kschachn]

You should be able to calculate the approximate power consumption given the watts used and your timer information. At least close enough for this purpose to see which meter reading is closer.

 

[mk378]

Make sure the timer actually does turn the pump off when it is supposed to. Compare your kWh usage to what is expected based on the nameplate wattage and run time.

As others said, friction inherent in the old mechanical meters was prone to cause under-measure especially at low loads.

 

[PeterPolyol]

Originally Posted by ragtoplvr
also many commercial meters also measure power factor . There are electronic power factor controllers that can pay for themselves pretty quickly. .

Rod

This. I believe even the residential digital meters around here measure and report reactive power. There is usually a correction factor on the bill and there is a "mystery" page on the digital screen that reads #r####. The # values change every now and then. The r might be for reactive power. Power company will not disclose what it means.

 

[mk378]

Residential rates are strictly on real kWh. The company may also be measuring reactive power but they can't charge you for it. This is another thing that digital meters do better than mechanical ones, their kWh reading is completely immune to reactive power.

A load in the house that consumes reactive power will cause current to flow, leading to I squared R loss of real power in your wiring after the meter, which you will be charged for.

 

[Snagglefoot]

Originally Posted by kschachn
You should be able to calculate the approximate power consumption given the watts used and your timer information. At least close enough for this purpose to see which meter reading is closer.


Working backaward from 51 kwhrs, the pump was on for 12 hrs/day x 14 days = 168 hrs. 51 kwhrs/ 168 hrs = 0.3 kw. 0.3 kw x 1000 w/kw = 300 watts.

P = IV. 300 watts/ 120 volts = 2.5 Amps

So, if your pump is 2.5 Amps, the measurement is correct. If you want to believe 17 kwhrs, your pump is only 2.5/3 = 0.8 Amps

Judging from the sizeable plume, I'd say your pump is 2.5 Amps, your present 51 kwhr reading is correct and you were previously getting a free ride.

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted by Snagglefoot
Working backaward from 51 kwhrs, the pump was on for 12 hrs/day x 14 days = 168 hrs. 51 kwhrs/ 168 hrs = 0.3 kw. 0.3 kw x 1000 w/kw = 300 watts.

P = IV. 300 watts/ 120 volts = 2.5 Amps

So, if your pump is 2.5 Amps, the measurement is correct. If you want to believe 17 kwhrs, your pump is only 2.5/3 = 0.8 Amps

Judging from the sizeable plume, I'd say your pump is 2.5 Amps, your present 51 kwhr reading is correct and you were previously getting a free ride.

Nice, good work.

 

[Gebo]

Originally Posted by StevieC


They bought a monitoring device that has clamps that go around each supply wire in their main breaker panel and keeps track of the usuage so they can compare to their bills. It's pretty accurate.





Got a part number or picture? Sounds interesting...

 

[StevieC]

I'll ask them when I'm back home, still in Ohio until tomorrow.

 

[LoneRanger]

Originally Posted by Snagglefoot

Working backaward from 51 kwhrs, the pump was on for 12 hrs/day x 14 days = 168 hrs. 51 kwhrs/ 168 hrs = 0.3 kw. 0.3 kw x 1000 w/kw = 300 watts.

P = IV. 300 watts/ 120 volts = 2.5 Amps

So, if your pump is 2.5 Amps, the measurement is correct. If you want to believe 17 kwhrs, your pump is only 2.5/3 = 0.8 Amps

Judging from the sizeable plume, I'd say your pump is 2.5 Amps, your present 51 kwhr reading is correct and you were previously getting a free ride.

Go ahead and burst my bubble why don't you ...

I suppose this is what could be going on. I've no idea the power rating on the Kasco, it's an older model I bought used for $100 off the developer of the subdivision (they sell new for $1499.00). It was fresh off of a repair shop service and checkup and given a clean bill of health and fresh oil (oil bath type motor and bearings). So it should be running to spec, I just don't know what the spec is. Of course, now that I've said out loud that it's running fine, it will probably cr@p out tomorrow ...

P.S. meter is on Residential Service rate as it is on my lot and bill addresses to my house. Used to be the HOA covered bill. HOA was dissolved and so with 1/2 the pond on my lot, 1/2 on the neighbor's lot we split the operational cost.

 

[Rand]

Originally Posted by Snagglefoot
Originally Posted by kschachn
You should be able to calculate the approximate power consumption given the watts used and your timer information. At least close enough for this purpose to see which meter reading is closer.


Working backaward from 51 kwhrs, the pump was on for 12 hrs/day x 14 days = 168 hrs. 51 kwhrs/ 168 hrs = 0.3 kw. 0.3 kw x 1000 w/kw = 300 watts.

P = IV. 300 watts/ 120 volts = 2.5 Amps

So, if your pump is 2.5 Amps, the measurement is correct. If you want to believe 17 kwhrs, your pump is only 2.5/3 = 0.8 Amps

Judging from the sizeable plume, I'd say your pump is 2.5 Amps, your present 51 kwhr reading is correct and you were previously getting a free ride.

That is what I am thinking.. I was doubting the motor was under 100w.

My air filter uses 155w(on high).. let alone a water pump with that size plume.