Volvo ACEA A5/B5 vs. VW 504.00/ 507.00

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Hi guys,

Just bought a 2014 Volvo V70 D2 (8-valve 1.6 DV6 PSA/Ford diesel).

The only specification specified from Volvo for this engine is ACEA A5/B5.
The same engine in a PSA vehicle calls for ACEA C2 / PSA B71 2290 / PSA B71 2312 while Ford prescribes WSS-M2C 913-C / WSS-M2C 913-D.
From my previous car I have a lot of ACEA C3/A3/B4 VW504.00/507.00 oil left (Pemco iDrive 350 5W/30).
Would it be OK to use this oil in this car?
As far as I know ACEA C3 & C2 are the same specification except for C2 having lower HTHS Viscosity for fuel economy.
I do not care about fuel economy, my only concern is the DPF.

The car has 114000 km and served by Volvo all the time (5 times).
The Volvo garage is only using Castrol EDGE 0W-30 A5/B5 in this engine.
However, the last 2 times there is 25000km between oil changes. Would an internal engine cleaner additive be advisable with the next oil change?

Thx.
 
A3/B4 and C3 are totally exclusive and should be on the same bottle.

I personally would use a C3 oil in that engine. I've had a number of them and they destroy A5/B5 oil in 5k.
 
Originally Posted by kakraemer
The pemco label says:
SAE 5W-30
API SN/CF
ACEA C3/A3/B4
VW 504.00/507.00
MB 229.51
BMW LL-04

Pemco iDrive 350


I've never heard of this oil but I must admit, the fact it says C3 and A3/B4 would annoy me. You can't have both specifications.
 
Reviewing the specifications, I don't see why an oil can't be both C3 and A3/B4. They both require the same high HT/HS viscosity (3.5cP min) and the C3 is regarded as a mid-SAPS product with a sulphated ash maximum limit of 800 ppm. The A3/B4 can have up to 1600 ppm of SA but there is no lower limit. There's also no lower limit in phosphorous or sulfur so it appears that they could overlap.

I don't see any reason why the OP could not use his current stash of Pemco oil. That's what I'd use.
 
Here are a couple bottles of Motul. One C3 and one A3/B4.
Notice the other corresponding approvals to see what travels with each AECA approval.



121D05EA-F2F8-4C37-9D98-438FE7EB8754.jpeg


730E31D2-B45A-4C7C-9D24-94E56A5DBD75.jpeg
 
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Originally Posted by kakraemer
The pemco label says:
SAE 5W-30
API SN/CF
ACEA C3/A3/B4
VW 504.00/507.00
MB 229.51
BMW LL-04

Pemco iDrive 350

A search of the various approval websites shows that as far as I can determine, it has none of those listed - not even API SN. The product labeling indicates it is not SAE 5W-30 either. So if everything is "recommended for" (or in this case "corresponds with requirements") then they can claim whatever they like without regards to competing approvals.

It looks like yet another of the faceless oils with deceptive PDS trying to look like something they are not.
 
Originally Posted by FowVay
Reviewing the specifications, I don't see why an oil can't be both C3 and A3/B4. They both require the same high HT/HS viscosity (3.5cP min) and the C3 is regarded as a mid-SAPS product with a sulphated ash maximum limit of 800 ppm. The A3/B4 can have up to 1600 ppm of SA but there is no lower limit. There's also no lower limit in phosphorous or sulfur so it appears that they could overlap.

I don't see any reason why the OP could not use his current stash of Pemco oil. That's what I'd use.

A3B4 has a SA lower limit of 1.0 , hence C3 and A3B4 is mutually exclusive.
However, you're right on P and S.
 
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Zeng, you must have a newer version of the ACEA specifications. Can you either send me a copy of your newer version or tell me where to view it? Thanks,

Zeng, never mind. I downloaded directly from the ACEA. Thanks for the info!!
 
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Originally Posted by FowVay
Zeng, you must have a newer version of the ACEA specifications. Can you either send me a copy of your newer version or tell me where to view it? Thanks,

Zeng, never mind. I downloaded directly from the ACEA. Thanks for the info!!


A1.0 Capture.PNG


A1.8 SA.PNG
 
Just run what you have. Both A3/B4 and C3 oils are very good, must pass the same test sequences. I wouldn't worry about them being labeled as both. Not correct, but it's just a manufacturer trying to cast a wide net (I.e. marketing).
 
Guys,

Car has DPF. With that no ACEA A3/B3 B4 should be used under any circumstances.
OP, I personally would use C3 oil, preferably one that meets all these specifications as each brings something to the table: VW 504.00/507.00, MB 229.51 and BMW LL-04.

On other note: what in the world is Pemco? cst of 11.22? What is HTHS of that oil?
A. They claim it is both C3 and A3. That cannot be!
B. They DO NOT have approvals. Their claim is that it corresponds to those requirements. Thay can claim anything, but that oil does not have approvals.
OP I would stay away from whatever Pemco is.
 
Originally Posted by edyvw
Guys,

Car has DPF. With that no ACEA A3/B3 B4 should be used under any circumstances.
OP, I personally would use C3 oil, preferably one that meets all these specifications as each brings something to the table: VW 504.00/507.00, MB 229.51 and BMW LL-04.

On other note: what in the world is Pemco? cst of 11.22? What is HTHS of that oil?
A. They claim it is both C3 and A3. That cannot be!
B. They DO NOT have approvals. Their claim is that it corresponds to those requirements. Thay can claim anything, but that oil does not have approvals.
OP I would stay away from whatever Pemco is.


While I agree with your 2nd paragraph I don't agree with the 1st.

Although I used mid SAPS oil in my DV6 engined cars (the engine in the Volvo discussed here), both Ford and Volvo spec high SAPS oils in them and it seems to have no I'll effects.
 
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Originally Posted by Bailes1992
Originally Posted by edyvw
Guys,

Car has DPF. With that no ACEA A3/B3 B4 should be used under any circumstances.
OP, I personally would use C3 oil, preferably one that meets all these specifications as each brings something to the table: VW 504.00/507.00, MB 229.51 and BMW LL-04.

On other note: what in the world is Pemco? cst of 11.22? What is HTHS of that oil?
A. They claim it is both C3 and A3. That cannot be!
B. They DO NOT have approvals. Their claim is that it corresponds to those requirements. Thay can claim anything, but that oil does not have approvals.
OP I would stay away from whatever Pemco is.


While I agree with your 2nd paragraph I don't agree with the 1st.

Although I used mid SAPS oil in my DV6 engined cars (the engine in the Volvo discussed here), both Ford and Volvo spec high SAPS oils in them and it seems to have no I'll effects.

IDK, I would try my best to avoid High-SAPS oil with DPF. Question is what is projected life of DPF that Ford and Volvo are specifying? ACEA A3/B3 will not kill DPF instantly, but it will shorten life of DPF compared to C3. Maybe Volvo and Ford are fine with that projected life of DPF.
 
If I recording well, PSA (Peugeot/Citroen) states 180,000 km for the life of DPF

The real problem (with this engine 1,6 HDi/TDCi + DPF) could be repeated active regeneration of DPF, when dpf is allready clogged, hence possible significant oil/fuel dilution in combination with thin oil like ACEA C2, PSA B71 2290 (or ACEA C1, PSA B71 2312).
Away from this, ACEA C2 would be perfect (as it is for the PSA/Ford DV6 engine), especially in Norway.

My personal advice for this engine - use Total Ineo Efficiency 0W-30 or Mobil1 ESP Formula 5W-30,

https://catalog.lubricants.total.com/en/products/8lb/QUARTZ-INEO-EFFICIENCY-0W-30
https://www.mobil.com/english-us/passenger-vehicle-lube/pds/glxxmobil-1-esp-formula-5w30

but if I have had a lot of pemco ACEA C3/A3/B4 VW504.00/507.00 oil left - Id probably use it anyway, but with shorten OCI, like 12000 km, no more. Btw, Pemco lubricants is subsidiary of SCT lubricants, the other is more known Mannol https://mannol.de/en/
 
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Originally Posted by DS9
If I recording well, PSA (Peugeot/Citroen) states 180,000 km for the life of DPF

The real problem (with this engine 1,6 HDi/TDCi + DPF) could be repeated active regeneration of DPF, when dpf is allready clogged, hence possible significant oil/fuel dilution in combination with thin oil like ACEA C2, PSA B71 2290 (or ACEA C1, PSA B71 2312).
Away from this, ACEA C2 would be perfect (as it is for the PSA/Ford DV6 engine), especially in Norway.

My personal advice for this engine - use Total Ineo Efficiency 0W-30 or Mobil1 ESP Formula 5W-30,

https://catalog.lubricants.total.com/en/products/8lb/QUARTZ-INEO-EFFICIENCY-0W-30
https://www.mobil.com/english-us/passenger-vehicle-lube/pds/glxxmobil-1-esp-formula-5w30

but if I have had a lot of pemco ACEA C3/A3/B4 VW504.00/507.00 oil left - Id probably use it anyway, but with shorten OCI, like 12000 km, no more. Btw, Pemco lubricants is subsidiary of SCT lubricants, the other is more known Mannol https://mannol.de/en/


180,000km is not a lot, and High-SAPS might be culprit. On my X5 35d projected life was 250,000km.
 
+1

I think that 180,000 km is defined for arduous conditions of use. For normal conditions of use something like 240,000 km.

PSA definition:
*Arduous conditions of use:
If you meet one or more of the arduous use conditions, special servicing will be necessary :
• Permanent door to door use.
• Urban use (such as taxi, ambulance, average speed below 12 mph, driving school).
• Repeated short journeys (less than 6 miles) with a cold engine (following a stop of more than 1 hour).
• Prolonged period of use in :
countries with a dusty atmosphere,
countries with fuels that do not meet the manufacturer's recommendations.
• Use, even occasional, of B20 or B30 fuel (Diesel vehicles) or petrol containing more than 3 % methanol
 
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