Mobil 1 5W30-HM 5,011 mi, 1999 Ford Escort

[WA1DH]

Blackstone Labs UOA on my 1999 Ford Escort running Mobil 1 5W30 High Mileage. Blackstone noted iron was a bit high and could be due to steel parts wear. I believe high iron under Mobil 1 has been noted as a non issue in the past. See UOA below:

Code:


MI/HR ON OIL 5,011

MI/HR ON UNIT 234,063

SAMPLE DATE 05/28/2018

MAKE UP OIL ADDED 0 QTS





VALUE UNIVERSAL AVG.

ALUMINUM 4 3

CHROMIUM 1 1

IRON 28 11

COPPER 6 4

LEAD 2 1

TIN 1 1

MOLYBDENUM 96 66

NICKEL 1 0

MANGANESE 1 0

SILVER 0 0

TITANIUM 0 1

POTASSIUM 3 2

BORON 60 64

SILICON 18 13

SODIUM 117 37

CALCIUM 1288 2185

MAGNESIUM 872 128

PHOSPHORUS 772 702

ZINC 962 833

BARIUM 0 1





SHOULD BE

SUS VISCOSITY @ 210F 60.5 56-63

CST VISCOSITY @ 100C 10.37 9.1-11.3

FLASHPOINT F 435 >365

FUEL %
ANTIFREEZE % 0.0 0.0

WATER % 0.0
INSOLUBLES % 0.2
TBN N/A

TAN N/A

ISO CODE N/A

 

[CarbonSteel]

Iron that is more than 2x higher than universal average would not be caused by M1. I have ran M1 in various types and never had iron higher than the average...YMMV.

 

[4WD]

234k … this the only sample ever tested?

 

[daves87rs]

Lots of miles for an escort...impressed!

Don't see many anymore...

 

[WA1DH]

Originally Posted By: 4WD
234k … this the only sample ever tested?


Yes that is the only sample I've done. I have owned it since around 120k miles. It's a 5 speed manual and I run it through the full RPM range and hit the red line at least once a week to keep things clean. It was around 1 qt low at that UOA.

 

[CT8]

Sodium , what oil was used before.

 

[JoelB]

Is this the single or double overhead cam engine?

 

[John_Dude]

Flat tappet cams on that engine, id suggest trying magnatec. It has quieted my zx2 valve train on startup, from the esters coating the surfaces. This should lower iron shedding

 

[WA1DH]

I should mention the head was replaced with a rebuilt unit somewhere around 130k miles. I installed one with improved hardened valve seats as these engines are known to drop seats. It also blew a head gasket somewhere in the 180k area with a 2-3 cylinder compression leak. It's a single overhead cam. I've always ran Mobil 1 oils, previously the regular formula and more recently the high mileage.

 

[Gokhan]

Originally Posted By: WA1DH
I believe high iron under Mobil 1 has been noted as a non issue in the past.

High iron = high valvetrain wear -- period. There are no ifs and buts.

If you consider high valvetrain wear a nonissue, it's a nonissue. I don't.

I've explained that higher valvetrain wear in Mobil 1 is caused by the ester base stocks that fight the AW/EP/FM additives. The high-mileage formula probably has a higher concentration of esters than the vanilla formula and that's probably why you're seeing higher valvetrain wear.

High sodium could indicate antifreeze leak though, which could increase the wear. Silicon is a tad-bit high too.

 

[PimTac]

But, how do we know the high iron numbers are related to the use of M1? We don’t.


A twenty year old car with well over 200k miles. Likely starting to show its age.

 

[Gokhan]

Originally Posted By: PimTac
But, how do we know the high iron numbers are related to the use of M1? We don’t.


A twenty year old car with well over 200k miles. Likely starting to show its age.

True. The only way to find out is to switch to a different oil and do a UOA.

 

[JAG]

Iron comes from cylinder walls in engines with iron cylinders as well as valvetrain, and some other parts, usually to a lesser extent. We can’t say how much the iron is from cylinder walls and how much is from valvetrain.

UOAs are not good at determining which oil allows the least wear of various engine parts. They are great when used to monitor trends in wear metals, viscosity, fuel dilution, TBN, TAN, which are a function of the oil, engine, duty cycles, OCIs, air filtration efficiency, coolant leaks, opening up the engine for repairs, etc.

I haven’t seen anything that even tells us that M1 5W-30 HM has esters, let alone whether it is more than just a dash of an ester. It is speculation that “higher valvetrain wear in Mobil 1 is caused by the ester base stocks that fight the AW/EP/FM additives”. The iron being largely or solely from valvetrain is speculation. The existence of the ester is speculation. The ester being the cause of increased wear is speculation. Speculations are fine to have and make as long as they are explicitly stated to be that.

 

[4WD]

Originally Posted By: JAG
Iron comes from cylinder walls in engines with iron cylinders as well as valvetrain, and some other parts, usually to a lesser extent. We can’t say how much the iron is from cylinder walls and how much is from valvetrain.

UOAs are not good at determining which oil allows the least wear of various engine parts. They are great when used to monitor trends in wear metals, viscosity, fuel dilution, TBN, TAN, which are a function of the oil, engine, duty cycles, OCIs, air filtration efficiency, coolant leaks, opening up the engine for repairs, etc.

I haven’t seen anything that even tells us that M1 5W-30 HM has esters, let alone whether it is more than just a dash of an ester. It is speculation that “higher valvetrain wear in Mobil 1 is caused by the ester base stocks that fight the AW/EP/FM additives”. The iron being largely or solely from valvetrain is speculation. The existence of the ester is speculation. The ester being the cause of increased wear is speculation. Speculations are fine to have and make as long as they are explicitly stated to be that.


Think that’s right ~ if you look at a recommended formula chart from EMCC ~ they don’t employ much Esterex in motor oils even when selling it to another company:

 

[addyguy]

Not to contradict you on purpose, but....would Esters not be what is used as the 'seal treatment additive' that makes a HM oil do what it claims?!?

 

[JAG]

Yes, some esters are used for seal swelling. They aren’t the only good choice to achieve the desired effect.
https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1751276

 

[SatinSilver]

Maybe try some Valvoline Maxlife red bottle 5w30. M1 for 5k miles seems like overkill.

 

[FCD]

Is this the SOHC 8v engine? they are notorious for cam / tappet wear, not only because they have flat tappets but also the oiling system to the camshaft is not well thought out.
The one in my 1988 Escort sounds very rattly but runs great, been doing short oci's with a HDEO to clean the engine up and also because of the high Zinc as it's flat tappet engine.