Dowsing Rods?

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Originally Posted By: Critical thinkers of BITOG
If dowsing worked, it would be easy to replicate and study.

Originally Posted By: The others
Yeah, but my anecdotes!
 
Prior to his retirement in 2015, skeptic James Randi was offering a million dollar prize to anyone who would exhibit their paranormal or supernatural skills. Nobody was ever able to show off their dowsing, telekinesis, psychic abilities, etc. when basic controls were required.
 
Originally Posted By: Bandito440
Originally Posted By: Critical thinkers of BITOG
If dowsing worked, it would be easy to replicate and study.

Originally Posted By: The others
Yeah, but my anecdotes!

^ This.
 
an·ec·dote
ˈanəkˌdōt/Submit
noun
a short and amusing or interesting story about a real incident or person.
"told anecdotes about his job"
synonyms: story, tale, narrative, incident; More
an account regarded as unreliable or hearsay.

What's anecdotal about a repeatable first person experience? Kinda reminds me of people saying they don't believe in acupuncture.
 
Originally Posted By: AZjeff


What's anecdotal about a repeatable first person experience? Kinda reminds me of people saying they don't believe in acupuncture.


A person skilled in acupuncture is worth a pound of opiates. First hand experience with chronic back pain. Everyone calls it quackery but there is too much proof for me that it works. Luckily it's covered by insurance too.
thumbsup2.gif
 
It looks like several of you missed out on a million dollar prize and a chance to become internationally famous as the first person with proven supernatural powers! Think of all the oil that would buy!

Personal experiences are anecdotal unless they’re repeatable under controlled conditions.
 
It is commonly used in the rugged, rocky, and dry areas of lower west TX near the Mexican border. The companies that dig the wells have a witcher on staff or or call. Without the witcher they would just be digging dry holes. Those that think it's bunk have obviously never witnessed it.
 
Ive witnessed it, and done it myself - its bunk. It seemed like bunk when my grandad showed it to me and seems like it now.

Randi has debunked dowsing several times - all highly amusing. Nobody can demonstrate they can do it under controlled conditions.

The vast majority of underground water sits in tables - not rivers flowing from here to there.


UD
 
Originally Posted By: Bandito440
It looks like several of you missed out on a million dollar prize and a chance to become internationally famous as the first person with proven supernatural powers! Think of all the oil that would buy!

AZjeff in particular. Not worth his effort to be the first person on the planet that "can" do it.

Originally Posted By: RTexasF
I Those that think it's bunk have obviously never witnessed it.

I "know" its bunk and "have" witnessed it (being unsuccessful)[as a well driller's helper]. So don't generalize.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Al
Originally Posted By: Bandito440
It looks like several of you missed out on a million dollar prize and a chance to become internationally famous as the first person with proven supernatural powers! Think of all the oil that would buy!

AZjeff in particular. Not worth his effort to be the first person on the planet that "can" do it.

Originally Posted By: RTexasF
I Those that think it's bunk have obviously never witnessed it.

I "know" its bunk and "have" witnessed it (being unsuccessful)[as a well driller's helper]. So don't generalize.


Not sure if you're calling me out or what? I can locate pipes and wires underground. 100% of the time? Probably not. Of course the expensive locating instruments my wife uses at the gas company can't find pipes and wires 100% of the time either. Never spent any time researching it and couldn't care less if people prove it bunk. Tried it and it worked and thought cool! Guess I look at it as some kind of "gift" like being able to sing or have extreme math skills or good mechanical ability or talented race car driver or whatever. You can tell me it doesn't work all day long if it makes you happy.
 
Singing, calculating, wrenching, and driving are skills that can be repeated under controlled circumstances.

Dowsing is supernatural, and can not be repeated in a double blind situation. It’s like mediums that talk to the dead.

You think that it works because of confirmation bias. Try it double-blinded sometime, like in Dawkins’ video.
 
Originally Posted By: AZjeff
You're right. I can't do it and won't even try again. Glad to be set straight.


Good. And don't do it again. It just sets a bad precedent.

You need repeated, blind studies. What's the ratio of success? I doubt it's 100%. People tend to remember the hits more than the misses. There's the bell curve. There are lottery winners who have won multiple times and there are those that never win.
 
I have witnessed them work over trenches to a decent degree as a construction engineer.

Not all people have what it takes but watched a gas guy actually mark lines out that were very accurate based off that instead of looking at his plans on gravel roads.
 
Originally Posted By: madRiver
I have witnessed them work over trenches to a decent degree as a construction engineer.

Not all people have what it takes but watched a gas guy actually mark lines out that were very accurate based off that instead of looking at his plans on gravel roads.


What was their success rate?

I'd like to see how well they do in the desert.

The placebo effect is about 30% for medical studies. You'd be right about 47.4% of the time with roulette picking red or black.

Let's see some large controlled double blind studies.
 
For years, scientists have said that technically, the bumble bee should not be able to fly. I guess someone forgot to tell the bumble bee. If scientists can not explain something, they shrug their shoulders and say "that's just bunk". I personally think that it has something to do with the earth's magnetic field as well as with the human body's magnetic field. I have held a forked willow branch in my own hands and felt the branch pull downward very firmly. There is something to it, I don't know what.
 
Originally Posted By: otis24
For years, scientists have said that technically, the bumble bee should not be able to fly. I guess someone forgot to tell the bumble bee. If scientists can not explain something, they shrug their shoulders and say "that's just bunk". I personally think that it has something to do with the earth's magnetic field as well as with the human body's magnetic field. I have held a forked willow branch in my own hands and felt the branch pull downward very firmly. There is something to it, I don't know what.


Been a while since I read snopes (too many popups) but the saying about "bumble bee's can't fly" goes back to something like 1930. The math back then couldn't be used to show how a bumble bee could fly. Well, that was then and this is now. Our understanding of flight has come a long ways since then.

Quick look finds
https://www.sciencenews.org/article/flight-bumblebee
which says it's a modeling issue. Pick a simple mathematical model, and it's no surprise that it may fail to properly predict when used beyond the limits of the model.
 
Originally Posted By: otis24
I have held a forked willow branch in my own hands and felt the branch pull downward very firmly. There is something to it, I don't know what.

Yes, there absolutely is.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ideomotor_phenomenon

You think there's water, you think that water should make your body respond in a certain way, and your body responds.

In other words, you have:

1. A human brain;
2. A human body;
3. Knowledge and experience that give you an intuitive sense of where water might be, AND/OR the blind luck to only be trying it where there's water everywhere; and
4. A belief that dowsing works.

It might not be a talent for dowsing per se, but yes, it's very real.
 
Originally Posted By: supton
Originally Posted By: otis24
For years, scientists have said that technically, the bumble bee should not be able to fly. I guess someone forgot to tell the bumble bee. If scientists can not explain something, they shrug their shoulders and say "that's just bunk". I personally think that it has something to do with the earth's magnetic field as well as with the human body's magnetic field. I have held a forked willow branch in my own hands and felt the branch pull downward very firmly. There is something to it, I don't know what.


Been a while since I read snopes (too many popups) but the saying about "bumble bee's can't fly" goes back to something like 1930. The math back then couldn't be used to show how a bumble bee could fly. Well, that was then and this is now. Our understanding of flight has come a long ways since then.

Quick look finds
https://www.sciencenews.org/article/flight-bumblebee
which says it's a modeling issue. Pick a simple mathematical model, and it's no surprise that it may fail to properly predict when used beyond the limits of the model.


Perhaps in a generation or two our understanding of dowsing will have come a long way. Perhaps the science does not exist now to explain how it works just as the math did not exist to explain the flight of the bumble bee in the 1930's.
 
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