Recent Topics
Making new springs?
by JHZR2
12/10/17 09:15 PM
Drill press belt deflection and speed
by JHZR2
12/10/17 08:55 PM
WM Super Tech ST10955 Cartridge Filters $1.55
by KD0AXS
12/10/17 07:09 PM
'03 Hyundai Santa Fe 2.7L V6 - 3300mi - Penn Ultra
by boom10ful
12/10/17 06:45 PM
Oil recommendation for old garden tractor on plow
by PrimitiveJunk
12/10/17 06:16 PM
Recommend me a 38 Special Ammo FMJ and HP
by FirstNissan
12/10/17 04:28 PM
Monroe shocks are on rebate again, until 1/31/18
by slacktide_bitog
12/10/17 03:54 PM
Telsa Model X - Towing a trailer?
by OVERKILL
12/10/17 03:39 PM
California
by OVERKILL
12/10/17 03:29 PM
Using anti-seize on spark plugs or not
by Electromotive
12/10/17 02:59 PM
WOT Driving and Engine Wear
by Emanuel
12/10/17 02:52 PM
UOA Lexus LX570
by Pitbull
12/10/17 02:42 PM
First long trip for the Mazda
by PimTac
12/10/17 02:36 PM
Lexus LX570 oil analyst
by Pitbull
12/10/17 01:56 PM
Parking for green vehicles
by 02SE
12/10/17 01:46 PM
Battery Maintainer: Prologix vs Norco Genius
by ymc226
12/10/17 01:32 PM
2009 ford fusion very dangerous car to own
by Dylan1303
12/10/17 10:57 AM
4 MIMAS Rims w/ Firestone Winterforce 205/55R16
by Sam_Julier
12/10/17 10:17 AM
Volvo Eliminating Turbo Lag - Interesting
by StevieC
12/10/17 09:43 AM
You Want To See Tight Formation ?
by billt460
12/10/17 08:59 AM
Newest Members
CostaCaptain, zaphod_b, ravedaber, PJins, Melectric
63648 Registered Users
Who's Online
82 registered (2015_PSD, Alex_V, andyd, AZjeff, 14Accent, 9 invisible), 1635 Guests and 12 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
63648 Members
66 Forums
275025 Topics
4575289 Posts

Max Online: 3590 @ 01/24/17 08:07 PM
Donate to BITOG
Page 2 of 2 < 1 2
Topic Options
#4576910 - 11/17/17 09:43 AM Re: Take a poorly paid promotion? [Re: SeaJay]
Smokescreen Offline


Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 3138
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Originally Posted By: SeaJay
I made my peace many years ago by deciding to stay at a level with less responsibility and much less stress with pay levels acceptable for that work. Couldn't be happier.


+1. ... added my comment.
_________________________
09 Corolla 1.8L-355Kkms(222Kmi)-PP,Denso
05 LeSabre 3.8L-200Kkms(125Kmi)-Sopus,Delco
03 Sierra 2500 6.0L-201Kkms(125Kmi)-Sopus,Delco

All with mpg > EPA

Top
#4576912 - 11/17/17 09:44 AM Re: Take a poorly paid promotion? [Re: bowlofturtle]
Reddy45 Offline


Registered: 08/15/08
Posts: 2006
Loc: USA
If you like your current job because of the manager, but your manager soon won't be your manager, then it would be wiser for you to become that position than to have to suffer under an outside hire who may not jive with you.
_________________________
2015 Toyota Tacoma V6 4X4

Top
#4576927 - 11/17/17 09:55 AM Re: Take a poorly paid promotion? [Re: bowlofturtle]
Indydriver Offline


Registered: 03/20/11
Posts: 1988
Loc: Indiana
My last three “promotions” were laterals within the second from the top management “band”. Base pay increase was modest, bonus opportunity expanded slightly but as noted by several here, the responsibility expanded greatly. Sometimes you just have no choice. Remember one thing....HR is not your friend in any of this. They are the CEO’s #1 overhead reduction agent.

You can always try for alternative comp....increased bonus, stock options, increased PTO, or one of my company’s Favorites: a one-time signing bonus.
_________________________
2017 Mazda CX3 1000 FF
2014 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 Vert 13,000 M1
2012 Sienna 71,000 M1
2011 Accord VCMV6 68,000 M1
2007 Tahoe 120,000 M1 HM


Top
#4576971 - 11/17/17 10:27 AM Re: Take a poorly paid promotion? [Re: bowlofturtle]
555 Offline


Registered: 06/08/09
Posts: 286
Loc: New England
"Poorly paid promotion" think about those three words together and you will have your answer.
Good luck with your decision.
_________________________
84 XJ6 39k miles M1
92 Mustang 5.0 Redline
99 Tahoe 2 door Castrol Edge
99 MX5 Miata Anniversary Edition M1
04 Subaru STi Motul

Top
#4576991 - 11/17/17 10:47 AM Re: Take a poorly paid promotion? [Re: bugeye]
69GTX Offline


Registered: 09/23/15
Posts: 3566
Loc: Connecticut
Originally Posted By: bugeye
Listen to Char Baby. I've been there. You get squeezed from above and below. It's called responsibility without authority. Those above you make decisions which you may not agree, but you are held accountable. No thanks. The effect on my health and family life was never worth the aggravation. I welcomed the "down sizing" of my management position and moved into early retirement.


I made such a leap too....twice. From Plant Maintenance Superintendent (50 hr weeks), to Chief Engineer (60-70), to Plant Manager (60-90). I really didn't want any of those promotions. I refused the 1st one to Chief because I knew I'd work myself to death and stress out to the max. Well, when it came up a 2nd time a year later, I was sort of "pushed" into it as no one else was available. I "killed" myself for 3 years and started a health decline that didn't end until 6 years later....putting in 60-70 hr weeks while being paid for 40.

When the plant manager job came open in 3 years, I initially refused it. I knew I wasn't mentally cut out to be that type of manager. Well, the regional VP pushed me hard to take it....I was their guy. I told them it wasn't me. He wanted me bad. So, I took the job and the next 6-9 months I filled all 3 positions (chief, maint, plant mgr)....saving the company over $100K in salaries alone. I didn't take a day off for 9 months. I was doing 80-90 hour weeks. Finally, I got the approval to fill the other 2 positions. But within 2 years, I was dragged down by the performance of my underlings and the plant itself aging and needing more money than it was truly worth. My initial concerns of not being the right type of "guy" did come to fruition. Now the regional VP wanted me out...lol. In the end, I'd have been much better off staying in one of those 2 lower positions...and I'd have earned plenty of money into retirement. As it was I burnt out early, left the business 10 yrs before I should have (after 20 yrs). My health for those 6 years really took a downturn as I rarely had time to exercise, spent most of the weekends catching up on sleep, never getting out in the sun, and adding 50 lbs of added weight. My diet went to heck. I finally got it all under control in 2009 and got my health back after leaving the business. I was a good fit for those first 2 jobs...but not a good one for the higher one, despite the big jump in pay. If I had to do it again, I'd have never taken it...though I have a feeling that might have also led to an early demise.

Sometimes "advancing up" is not the right move for everyone. I constantly told my senior mechanics and instrument techs (pulling down $90K-$110K with Overtime) that they had it made with skills that would fly anywhere at any time. They should be quite happy with the deal they had. Ironically, 9 years after I left the facility, they closed down the power plant side due to it being too costly to keep up with environment regs, and nearly all of the workers and managers had to be reassigned. The ones that had the best parachutes were the middle and senior grade techs.
_________________________
----------------

2002 Lincoln Cont 4.6L DOHC/ 78K mi /PPlat 5w30/FUG XG2
1999 Camaro SS M6 /19K /Mobil 1 0w40 /Fram UG /GM MTL-ATF
1969 Ply GTX/RRs

Top
#4577077 - 11/17/17 12:38 PM Re: Take a poorly paid promotion? [Re: bowlofturtle]
CincyDavid Offline


Registered: 03/03/16
Posts: 482
Loc: Cincinnati, OH USA
I'm perfectly content to just be in sales...make my own schedule, responsible only for my performance...if I need to make more money I just prospect more , sell more, and I made my own raise.

I watch my managers getting hammered from above and below, making less than the top-selling sales people, with 4x the stress and headaches.

I tried management with a previous employer and vowed to NEVER make the same mistake again. My monthly gross income varies widely, with a range in excess of $10,000 between my best and worst month in any given year, but as long as I can make my budget work with that variable, I'm not going to make any moves into management. In my experience, only 20% of new sales people make it for a year in the department, and the record with managers isn't much better...the company is just slower to remove a bad manager than a non-productive sales person so everyone in the department suffers for months.
_________________________
06 Kia Sportage EX greenish gold(ugliest color ever)
14 Honda Accord LX metallic black
16 Honda CR-V EX silver
17 VW Jetta SE black

Top
#4577254 - 11/17/17 04:28 PM Re: Take a poorly paid promotion? [Re: bowlofturtle]
Indydriver Offline


Registered: 03/20/11
Posts: 1988
Loc: Indiana
Universal truths:

American business management is generally poor with shortsighted objectives.

Corporate will abuse you as much as YOU let it.
_________________________
2017 Mazda CX3 1000 FF
2014 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 Vert 13,000 M1
2012 Sienna 71,000 M1
2011 Accord VCMV6 68,000 M1
2007 Tahoe 120,000 M1 HM


Top
#4577287 - 11/17/17 05:13 PM Re: Take a poorly paid promotion? [Re: Indydriver]
DBMaster Offline


Registered: 09/18/12
Posts: 5129
Loc: DFW
Originally Posted By: Indydriver
Universal truths:

American business management is generally poor with shortsighted objectives.

Corporate will abuse you as much as YOU let it.


Pretty much. Unfortunately, in my experience, when you push back against said abuse you end up MORE abused or out the door.

Top
#4577312 - 11/17/17 05:32 PM Re: Take a poorly paid promotion? [Re: bowlofturtle]
bigj_16 Online   content


Registered: 07/03/17
Posts: 853
Loc: CO
I could add a lot to this but I am going to provide two quotes:

"Stress will kill you."

"When on their deathbed, no one has ever said, 'I wish I would have spent more time at the office'."


Edited by bigj_16 (11/17/17 05:37 PM)

Top
#4577327 - 11/17/17 05:53 PM Re: Take a poorly paid promotion? [Re: Char Baby]
bowlofturtle Offline


Registered: 06/25/09
Posts: 725
Loc: Chicago
Originally Posted By: Char Baby
Best of luck to you

~7 years prior to my retirement, I took a poorly paid promotion. The annual pay increases were better over those years than what I had been receiving in the past however, they money, responsibility & stress ratio was never worth the difference.

Many of my co-workers wanted me to take this promotion for similar reasons that you want to take the promotion...so that someone less qualified didn't get the job.

The stress increase put my health at risk and those same co-workers turned against me, originally thinking that, "he's(me) one of us in this position"! But, instead over that period of time, I became one of them(upper mgt) and I had to perform the job in the name of the company & my superiors, and not the employees.

Although by the time I had retired, I was making more money than I had ever made, once it was over, I feel that it was never worth it. I would rather have stayed where I was and not taken the promotion. The extra money and short period of time that I was in this position didn't help much(too small to calculate) in my retirement anyway unless I could have had this position for 30 years.

Maybe I wasn't cut out for the position as it does take a special person that can handle criticism and stress when performing a job in the name of the company and not your friends.


Yea, i could see that happening to me, i really hope that it doesn't but one can never really know. The small amount money here isn't going to cover my stress levels but i might use the title to get me something better a few years down the road. I'm early 30's so i still have a lot of paths and offers to consider. If i was in my 50's i'm pretty sure i would have easily stayed in the middle and just wait it out.



Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
What does "poorly paid" mean ?
$5K raise, $10K raise, ....???

Sometimes the added stress and aggravation is not worth the small salary increase.



Its about 5% bump each step.

Originally Posted By: Alfred_B
You can go into upper management and if it doesn't work, can always change the employer now with a better looking resume.

If the pay raise is the issue, remember that when promoted from within, the salary is not as high as when someone is brought from the outside. The reason for that is that they weren't able to find someone from the inside so they are upping the offer to attract someone from the outside. Plus, the outsiders start with a clean slate and are able to negotiate better.


This is one of thought processes. I hate to be the guy the bouncing around jobs every few years but i'm not at the level where i want to be yet.

Originally Posted By: bcossa2001
What an outstanding thread. Real life advice from experienced people.


100% agreed, a lot more then i honestly expected. Everyone here rocks!
_________________________
My toys
-05 Infiniti G35x 121k
-03 Suzuki SV650N 8.5k
Maintaining
-16 Jetta 1.4T 7k
-98 Nissan Maxima 145k
-09 Toyota Camry V6 86k


Top
#4577348 - 11/17/17 06:31 PM Re: Take a poorly paid promotion? [Re: DBMaster]
eljefino Offline


Registered: 06/15/03
Posts: 31803
Loc: ME
Originally Posted By: DBMaster
Originally Posted By: Indydriver
Universal truths:

American business management is generally poor with shortsighted objectives.

Corporate will abuse you as much as YOU let it.


Pretty much. Unfortunately, in my experience, when you push back against said abuse you end up MORE abused or out the door.


Detach yourself if you go for it. He who has nothing to lose has the most to gain. Troll those above you if they give you contradictory or impossible orders. Give them a list of what you need to make X happen, via email, with a personal copy of said email. When they bust you for missing a target, flip it right around and say under your plan of which they already have a copy this wouldn't have happened and they should invest more in Y.

I had a "fun" last couple years at my former employer doing exactly this. Lampooning the stupid to their faces. Demanding tools I didn't get. (Sadly I still was able to provide the product anyway...) Saving emails off-site. It helped that I was underpaid and knew I could have done better. I do better now. smile

If you're getting pushed into this promotion, it could be they're sick of you on a lower level and would let you go. I say go for it but emotionally uninvolve yourself. Delegate your work so you get out after 40 hours like you morally should.

Top
#4577357 - 11/17/17 06:44 PM Re: Take a poorly paid promotion? [Re: bowlofturtle]
Mr Nice Offline


Registered: 09/12/04
Posts: 19825
Loc: Orlando, FL
A 5% pay raise is a slap in the face for all that extra responsibilities and stress.

Sounds like they'll use and abuse you for peanuts.

Top
#4577450 - 11/17/17 07:51 PM Re: Take a poorly paid promotion? [Re: bowlofturtle]
ATex7239 Offline


Registered: 01/19/17
Posts: 304
Loc: Texas,USA
If it don’t make dollars, it don’t make sense.
_________________________
'12 Buick Enclave 130,xxx
Valvoline ML SynBlend 5w30
ACDelco PF63E

'17 Ford Fusion (Company Lease) 27,xxx
Oil – Don't know
Filter – Don't care

Top
#4577498 - 11/17/17 08:30 PM Re: Take a poorly paid promotion? [Re: bigj_16]
surfstar Offline


Registered: 09/16/04
Posts: 5968
Loc: Santa Barbara, CA
Originally Posted By: bigj_16
"When on their deathbed, no one has ever said, 'I wish I would have spent more time at the office'."


THIS

There is some crazy talk in this thread. Life is more than work.
_________________________
2016 Golf Sportwagen 5MT M1 0w40 LC20 RLI BioPlus
my other vehicle is a Roth IRA

Top
#4577877 - 11/18/17 09:46 AM Re: Take a poorly paid promotion? [Re: bowlofturtle]
fdcg27 Offline


Registered: 09/25/09
Posts: 14786
Loc: OH
From what you've written, taking the promotion might be a good defensive move.
More responsibility for a minimal pay increase seems troubling, but you may have no better choice.
You could otherwise end up working for an unqualified fool who might then badmouth you to his organizational peers for everything that goes wrong.
I find myself in this position at the moment, but it is fun to do as eljefino suggests and throw past emails back at 'em and I'm near enough to planned retirement now that I don't need to care too much.
Personally, I'd be perfectly happy doing my own thing at work without anyone reporting to me.
It isn't all that enjoyable to me to rely upon others to get the work done and you do get squeezed from both above and below.
You also get hit with the really difficult stuff that neither your subordinates nor your superiors can quite seem to do, although it is fun to be the go-to guy when nobody else has a clue.
_________________________
17 Forester 6K M1 AFE 0W20
12 Accord LX 78K M1 AFE 0W-20
09 Forester 95K M1HM 10W-30
01 Focus ZX3 118K PP 5W-20
96 Accord LX 104K T5 10W-30
95 318i

Top
Page 2 of 2 < 1 2