F1 - 2017 United States Grand Prix

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Selectively enforcing them at all is not how it works. You can't reasonably say that it's justifiable early in the race but it's the letter of the law at the end. With how difficult it is to pass and split second-decisions on what lap to pit, no one can say that a move made on lap 26 wouldn't have influenced the finish.
In order of least to most important for its existence, one cannot not forget that F1 is part sport, part show, and part business. They may exist disproportionately to each other at times but they can work together; however, both fans and sponsors have punished it when they don't.
 
As many of you can tell from my past posts, I'm not a Charlie Whiting fan. And you can lay this whole Verstappen incident right at his doorstep. He is, after all, The Race Director. He needs to get off his decrepit old rear and DIRECT. And do so in a timely, decisive, and responsible fashion. He's far too lackadaisical in these matters. And horribly inconsistent. It was complete nonsense to wait until Verstappen was about ready to walk out on to the podium before being told. He should have known before he unbuckled to get out of the car. Remember the whole Vettel incident? If he wasted any more time on that one, he might have died of old age.

It's bad enough the way he waits so many laps before engaging the DRS. But stuff like this is inexcusable. There have been a lot of other tracks where going too far off the racing line has either been selectively enforced, or else not enforced at all. They've got multiple cameras, not to mention helicopter footage at every corner. So this isn't a Moon shot to get it right. And get it right for everyone all the time.

This is far too big and expensive of a sport, with millions riding on every outcome, to have so much responsibility placed on a guy that just always seems to be out to lunch, when ever a big decision has to be made. And then when he makes it, there always seems to be a cloud of controversy surrounding it. I'd hate to see this guy call a Major League Baseball game behind the plate. He would have a bat shoved up his rear by the second out. He really needs to be watching these races at home, smoking a pipe and sipping Brandy.
 
That's kinda harsh, isn't it? I'm sure he needs to put it past the stewards first and make sure everyone's on the same page before he drops the gavel. That takes time. I think your expectations are a little high.

And I think enabling DRS is only after two laps of green racing. I don't think he's doing it whenever he feels like it.
 
Originally Posted By: Bottom_Feeder
That's kinda harsh, isn't it? I'm sure he needs to put it past the stewards first and make sure everyone's on the same page before he drops the gavel. That takes time. I think your expectations are a little high.

And I think enabling DRS is only after two laps of green racing. I don't think he's doing it whenever he feels like it.


If it's questionable or argumentative then yes, the stewards may or may not have to get involved. But this was cut and dried. Verstappen had all 4 wheels over the line. Anyone could see it in a second. He also clearly gained an advantage by doing so. There was absolutely no reason for it to have taken so long to inform him. Nor was it acceptable for Bottas to have gotten away with doing much the same thing early on in the race. This kind of thing is happening far too often in Formula 1. And as far as DRS there is no set rule. But their should be. I've seen races go 3 and 4 laps before he engages the system. You're either going to have DRS, or you're not. They have it, and it should be engaged at the same time every race. It's just more of the same old thing. Whatever and whenever he feels like it. Total inconsistency. It's getting old fast.... As is he.
 
Originally Posted By: gofast182
Merc. simply has a few more HP that they can seemingly deploy at will.


Someone should tell Bottas that secret.
 
Originally Posted By: billt460
[ And as far as DRS there is no set rule. But their should be. I've seen races go 3 and 4 laps before he engages the system.


There is a documented rule. It's a minimum of 2 green laps *and* then the discretion of the Race Director. It's documented in the sporting regulations.

Verstappen didn't run wide. He cut the corner (by a Metre - not a few centimeters). That's taking a short-cut. It's not Charlies call. He delegates to the Stewards (who are the guys with the racing experience) and they make the call.

Bottas made several wide corners, but they didn't grant him a lasting advantage so they were "No further action".

I know you love to second guess the FIA and get stuck into Charlie, but they have far more information available than you do, and they have the life of 20 drivers in their hands.
 
Originally Posted By: Brad_C
There is a documented rule. It's a minimum of 2 green laps *and* then the discretion of the Race Director.


And that's nonsense. Why should it be up to "his discretion"? There is no reason it cannot be deployed automatically as the leader passes the start / finish line beginning the second lap..... AT EVERY RACE. That's consistency. Something this sport totally lacks. Why wait until the cars are strung out to the point DRS is no longer effective before allowing it to kick in? How many times have we watched Mercedes and Hamilton ride off into the sunset in the first 2 or 3 laps, without DRS being engaged? And for no reason at all. The result is always the same. We end up watching 20 cars play follow the leader for a hour and a half. And if there is a "battle", it's back for the last available point, with 2 cars and drivers no one remotely cares about.

They design and create an expensive system, that is supposedly designed to keep the racing closer and more competitive. And that will allow more overtaking. Something most everyone who watches Formula 1 complains there isn't enough of. Then they give the switch to a guy who has the habit of waiting to turn it on, until it is no longer effective for the lead cars. Thereby defeating the whole purpose of it. And the inconsistent application of rules and penalties that we constantly see in race after race, doesn't make any driver on that track "safer".
 
Originally Posted By: CharlieBauer
Originally Posted By: gofast182
Merc. simply has a few more HP that they can seemingly deploy at will.


Someone should tell Bottas that secret.

I would love to see all the driver telemetry on what the difference is between HAM and BOT. I'd assume Bottas gets to see all of Lewis's inputs and that must be frustrating to see exactly what you have to do, but can't come close to Hamilton.
 
Originally Posted By: Bottom_Feeder
What has you so wound up about DRS activation? Was it a problem this race? I don't ever pay any attention to it.


Then perhaps you should start. You'll then see the same thing I am. It all plays into the inconsistency and politics that Formula 1 is constantly and continually plagued with. That has gotten all so out of control. Sometimes discretion is necessary. But in Formula 1 we see far too much proof that, "rules are not necessarily made for everyone". DRS is a very good example of this. Because with the exception of a racing incident, or possibly a dangerously wet track, there is absolutely no reason for any of it's application to be regulated differently on a race to race basis. Yet it is. All the time. And for what purpose? It's the same with penalties, along with this whole Verstappen deal. One guy get the rules applied properly to his incident, while others do not.

How many times do we see controversy in a Formula 1 season, due to positions being selectively decided by "discretion". Far too many. Right down to the last second before the drivers step out on to the podium. It's ridiculous. Let's face it, when you have experienced Formula 1 announcers who had careers as drivers and mechanics, agreeing that this is happening far too frequently. It has then gone beyond my, or anyone else's opinion. It's a genuine problem. I'm simply agreeing with them. And they have all forgotten more about Formula 1, than any of us will ever know.
 
Do away with the DRS. Less topside aero. At COTA glue Astro Turf outside the track line limits for 10-20 yards or so, then let the asphalt continue, to slow the cars that have spun. Or in Max's case glue it at the apex. Or make it a "real" track with physical barriers. Then, someone may get hurt, and we can't have that in today's F1 climate.
In any case, from what I saw from the stewards, exceeding the track limits at corner exit was ok, cutting the corner at the apex on the last lap, not so much. Program transponders so if the car exceeds the track limit, it reduces the speed. Nothing like an electronic big brother looking after the drivers. That would never fly, for lots of reasons.
I would like to see them, (current F1 drivers, throw in a couple of FE, Indy, Nascar, Rallycross, IMSA, etc., dirvers) line up in stadium trucks at COTA and let them have at it. Passing through electronic checkpoints, or something. I bet Max would win going away.
 
I agree billt460. You other post earlier in this was outstandingly well stated by the way. Always good to see you on here.
 
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Max robbed himself. While there certainly was tolerance with respect to exceeding track limits in order to take an advantage over the weekend, there is simply no more obvious way to gain an advantage by exceeding track limits than by blasting by someone ahead of you while leaving the track. If Max didn't think that leaving the track to pass someone would go unnoticed in race control, he's dreaming.
 
Originally Posted By: Bottom_Feeder
What has you so wound up about DRS activation? Was it a problem this race? I don't ever pay any attention to it.

I would agree with Bill, assuming there actually is an ongoing problem with late DRS activation. I can't say I've paid enough attention to it. It should be automatic after the two laps, assuming that it's a dry race and everyone's on slicks and all sectors are green flagged.
 
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