Originally Posted By: alarmguy
Originally Posted By: Mik
Originally Posted By: alarmguy
Originally Posted By: 02SE
The number of gears in the transmission, does not determine what the overall gear ratio (primary, transmission, final drive, tire diameter) is in a given bikes top gear. A bike with a three speed transmission could be designed with a taller overall gear ratio in it's top gear, than a "6-speed transmission". Of course that would make a for a very wide-ratio transmission.
We all know that, lets be real though. Less gears = cost savings and less satisfied customers. I knew I would get a response like this from someone. I had 2 - 5 speed bikes and its not enough for someone who rides primarily at GPS speeds of 80 MPH.
I had two criteria for a new bike, 6 speeds and ABS.
MANY people with a 5 speed bike will confirm this with you. Including countless Goldwing riders
5 speeds are cost saving measure OR its on a bike not designed for interstate cruising.
here we go with the 6-speed obsession again... lol
While an additional gear (ie. going from 5 speed to 6 speed) cannot generally be a bad thing (unless they are compromising strength and size to fit the extra gear in what is essentially a space previously designed to hold a five-speed), any engine with a powerband as broad as the Wing can surely do without a sixth gear, especially for relaxed street use. Bikes with narrow powerbands (large V-twins and peaky racebikes) need the close ratios as they are disadvantaged when trying to pull the gaps between gears but on a bike like the Wing (or FJR) with a mile-wide powerband and torque curve, it's as much a marketing gimmick as anything else...
case in point: have a look at the attached dyno (torque curves) and ask yourself if adding or subtracting @ 200 rpm in shift gap will really make a significant difference
Now have a look here at a 2018 Milwaukee 8 and see why a 6-speed is critical (noticed how quickly teh torque drops off):
Pretty obvious why one engine NEEDS a six-speed whereas it is clearly optional on the other (two above)...
Your post is comical (ill refrain from posting any further no matter what you say)
Bottom line is the new Goldwing has stepped up up its game, just like Yamaha and updated their old outdated transmissions and engine drive trains. Imagine that, Harley beat them by a full decade!
ANY vehicle is designed with the transmission and engine to work as a unit, doesnt matter if a car, truck, bike, RV or boat.
Your dyno curves are something out of space comparing an engine with a 5 speed against an engine with a 6 speed.
Its not marketing, its upgrading vastly older design with new.
Love to see someone plunk down hard cash for a 4 or 5 speed Corvette, yeah, right.
For some people, all they do is ride in the 75 to 85 MPH range and I dont care what brand it is, you will ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS see people wishing for that extra gear if they have a 5 speed bike. Just because you dont care for it, doesnt make the whole world wrong, my gosh, google is your friend go look at the Goldwing owners comments themselves wishing for the 6th speed.
Oh and by the way? Lets talk GPS speed, chances are your 5 speed bike speedometer is lying to you by up to 9% so if as was the case with my Yamaha 5 speed, when the speedo showed 75 my ACTUAL GPS speed was 68/69 MPH.
Anyway, before some people con-volute my comments as pro Harley let me say, I think that the new GOLDWING looks AWESOME and I cant wait to check one out in the showroom now that it has a 6 speed.
I REALLY liked the FJ6 when it came out but was not impressed at all with fit, finish, paint and and materials, yet I could have bought new for a song and a dance, dealer had them so discounted, the real killer for me was also only 5 speeds and the reason was sound as I read all the negative comments by wing owners who ride at my speeds. (and please dont bother quoting speeds unless they are GPS speeds as most 5 speed brands lie to you on the speedometer)
Anyway, if they addressed the above issues and the 6 speed is a big plus I think they will have a great product and competition is good for all of us.
logic is often perceived as comical by the misinformed and those brainwashed with marketing hype... shame you can't understand the whole principle of gear ratios from a mathematical instead of a marketing sense, but insight like yours keeps people employed in marketing depts....
anyhow, carry on, those with an open mind and powers of reason and observation know your shallow and ill-founded obsession with 6-speeds to be misguided... if you ever get around to buying/riding a bike whose powerband doesn't fall off a cliff at 2500 rpm, you will see what I mean....
P.S. I suspect you likely think the Milwaukee 8 is a giant leap forward in engine design too, lol
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