Subaru STi race engine, RP XPR 5W/30, 3hrs

[mightymousetech]

Originally Posted By: KL31
Not sure how long to leave oil in a race engine. Out of my depth there.


On my own racecars, and every team I have worked with, we change the oil every weekend. On our Chump teams, which can see 12 hours of racing per day, we change it every day.

 

[Scargo]

Thanks very much for that explanation. I knew I was missing something about how to read the numbers.
As to frequency of an oil change, wouldn't it also matter how much oil you have in circulation?
I have nine quarts...
Here is the full report with last two oil changes on previous engine. You can see that I went 13 and 18 hours between changes with higher viscosity numbers and higher flash points. I'm puzzled and guess I'll run this three hour oil a while longer. Just found note where, previously, Blackstone suggested I stay under 15 hours.

 

[Loi]

As I fellow Subaru owner my advice to you is to ditch that Royal Purple. If you are looking for an oil with high zinc, phosphorous, and molybdenum I would highly recommend Motul 300V or Redline. I personally use 300V 5w40 on my 435whp STI.

 

[Scargo]

I am puzzled by your comment. It is my impression that Royal Purple is a well-respected manufacturer of oils. I've not had one oil related failure with the XPR. Not one spun bearing. Show me why I should ditch it.

 

[1JZ_E46]

Originally Posted By: Scargo
I am puzzled by your comment. It is my impression that Royal Purple is a well-respected manufacturer of oils. I've not had one oil related failure with the XPR. Not one spun bearing. Show me why I should ditch it.


RP XPR, along with 300V and RL are all fine oils for your application and I doubt you'd notice a difference between the three.

 

[KL31]

Originally Posted By: Scargo
I am puzzled by your comment. It is my impression that Royal Purple is a well-respected manufacturer of oils. I've not had one oil related failure with the XPR. Not one spun bearing. Show me why I should ditch it.


Due to being over priced for what it is. If you can find Castrol edge or Mobil1 both in 0w40 for much cheaper, they'd be far better value.

 

[SR5]

I think the Torco octane booster probably contains TEL the source of your high lead. Notice the Cu and Tin is low so unlikely to be bearing material.

 

[danielLD]

Originally Posted By: bluesubie

FYI, ACL's web site shows their EJ bearings are Copper Lead

Originally Posted By: SubLGT
Consider contacting this company: http://www.dysonanalysis.com/about-us

Best advice in the thread! I'd definitely have Terry monitor and make recommendations for this beast!

Terry's just far too expensive. He's good but at $150/pop you can get that same service for $50-60.

 

[Scargo]

Thanks to everyone for the comments.
Blackstone did suggest that Torco might be playing a part in the high lead content yet I've used Torco before (yet I've more than doubled, and maxed out, the Torco octane contribution this time @ 32 ounces per five gallons of 93 octane gasoline. I guess I'm saying I've not had lead levels like this in the past analyses.
Mine is a conservative tune... so a fair amount of Torco may be finding its way into the oil.

Who provides a more sophisticated analysis (than my Blackstone for $28-38) for the 50-60 dollar range?
Tomorrow another track day! I had to replace a leaky Fumoto drain valve so I put in six quarts of new oil and am going to get a UOA (from someone) on what I took out and see if it's OK to put back in and re-check lead levels.

 

[danielLD]

I sent you a PM, as noted, you might be interested in doing a Blackstone and another UOA so we can see the differences as a forum. Just PM if you want the UOA.

 

[Scargo]

Here is the latest UOA from Blackstone. At first it freaked me out but there is the fact that it covers over three times the hours of the last sample.
I have not bothered to verify whether Blackstone is transposing my information accurately or (from their comments) whether they are paying attention to the fact that I am consistently reporting using the max recommended amount of Torco with my gasoline. That's a 20:1 ratio. Incidentally, I try and use the same brand of gas (usually Sunoco 93) when I race. I am surprised that Blackstone cannot be definitive about the effects of Torco dilution of the oil.
Perhaps someone has a useful comment? There is an omission on my part about the 5/24 sample. There was a quart of make-up oil added. This may slightly affect how samples compare.
My gut reaction was to tear-down the engine. However, I see metal content decreasing, except for manganese!
If lead were from bearing wear wouldn't this latest sample have around 300 PPM?
The engine runs and sounds great. Very good, consistent oil pressure. Still, not sure what to make of the UOA.

 

[1JZ_E46]

Manganese is also used in octane boosters I believe. Lead an manganese went up by about the same multiple, which is consistent with the increased hours on the engine. If it runs and sounds strong I wouldn't worry.

 

[MParr]

I take it you’ve deleted the catalyst. Valvoline VR1 comes in synthetic and conventional 10w30 or 20w50. They’ve been doing it a long time.

 

[jeff78]

Yeah, I find a lot of Blackstone's UOA comments to be a bit dubious at best...

They suspect bearing wear and say 'Some of this is undoubtedly from hard use' then in the next sentence 'the thin viscosity and fuel are fine'. But maybe you'd get less bearing wear with hard use if the viscosity weren't as low.

A 9.11 cst viscosity at 100C makes it a 20, down from its nominal 40 viscosity grade. Some of the thinning will be from the fuel but the rest is the VII's shearing.

If this were my car, I'd try a different oil (e.g. Red Line) and see how it goes.

 

[bluesubie]

Originally Posted By: Scargo

I have not bothered to verify whether Blackstone is transposing my information accurately or (from their comments) whether they are paying attention to the fact that I am consistently reporting using the max recommended amount of Torco with my gasoline. That's a 20:1 ratio. Incidentally, I try and use the same brand of gas (usually Sunoco 93) when I race. I am surprised that Blackstone cannot be definitive about the effects of Torco dilution of the oil.
Perhaps someone has a useful comment? There is an omission on my part about the 5/24 sample. There was a quart of make-up oil added. This may slightly affect how samples compare.


Adding make-up oil improves the viscosity and TBN and lowers the wear numbers. At a minimum, you should send a virgin sample of the oil that you're running along with a sample of Torco.

This is why some of us have recommended Terry Dyson. You can continue to do Blackstone uoa's but you may never get answers as to why your results look the way that they do.

 

[Scargo]

All good feedback and helpful except for one strange comment.
I have changed the oil and will continue to monitor it. I have never run anything but Royal Purple XPR. Four Subaru race engines later, none have had an oil related failure: no bearing failures. That's not to say that there aren't better or equal oils out there.
I am seriously considering Terry's services. I will continue to monitor the oil, but damb, I've never had a bigger grin on my face (for as long) from an engine before.

 

[John_Dude]

I'd try amsoil signature series, it's group 4 pao. Shouldn't shear down as bad, unless it's all from fuel dilution. I've read some opinions here that some believe blackstones fuel dilution numbers aren't accurate.

Should 1.3% fuel cause this much of a viscosity loss?