More road rage idiots

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Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
The cowardly biker fled the scene of an accident he caused. Looks like he could be charged with felony hit and run.

http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/consequences-hit-run-accident.html

http://blogs.findlaw.com/blotter/2013/05/leaving-the-scene-of-an-accident-what-can-happen.html


There was an accident, and it involved a car and a truck ... which was solely caused by the car making an extreme swerve and losing control. The guy on the bike didn't cause the accident, the guy driving the car did. If he didn't go nuts and swerve he wouldn't have crashed.

If they catch the biker I'll bet he's not charged with "hit and run". He might be charged with incurring property damage to a now totaled car ...
lol.gif



BUT,he was one of the perpetrators and fled the scene. That is where he screwed up and dug his own grave.
 
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
The cowardly biker fled the scene of an accident he caused. Looks like he could be charged with felony hit and run.

http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/consequences-hit-run-accident.html

http://blogs.findlaw.com/blotter/2013/05/leaving-the-scene-of-an-accident-what-can-happen.html


There was an accident, and it involved a car and a truck ... which was solely caused by the car making an extreme swerve and losing control. The guy on the bike didn't cause the accident, the guy driving the car did. If he didn't go nuts and swerve he wouldn't have crashed.

If they catch the biker I'll bet he's not charged with "hit and run". He might be charged with incurring property damage to a now totaled car ...
lol.gif


+1 to ZeeOSix
I've noticed the words "cowardly" and "felony" being used in association with the man on the motorcycle. Well, a person trying to use his car to kill a motorcyclist is cowardly and a felony. The innocent person in the truck is the true victim in this situation.
 
Originally Posted By: 02SE
aquariuscsm said:
Getting away from a lunatic that has tried to kill you, is very prudent when you are completely exposed on a bike. Especially on a Road Glide (which it appeared to be) that is not particularly fast or maneuverable.


100% correct. A smart rider takes advantage of their superior maneuverability and acceleration and removes himself from the situation. A motorcyclist will rarely, if ever win a blunt force trauma contest with a 4 or more wheeled vehicle...
Click to expand...
 
Originally Posted By: Al
Originally Posted By: Rand
whats next the guy on the motorcycle pulling out a gun.. There are plenty of bad drivers out there. Doesnt deserve some guy on a motorcycle road raging him/her on both sides of the car.

Huh?? Where did you dream this up?
The guy on the MC was an idior..but the other guy (after he cut him off) tried to kill him. He deserves most of the blame. He is the one that let his rage cause the accident by tryingj to actially kill the cyclist. . Hope he gets sued within an inch of his life...which he probably will.


Agree with this assessment and Astro14's as well. You can't win against a car on a bike, but what you can do about moving violations blatantly done by cars/trucks is keep a GoPro or similar mounted on your helmet and if you get a driver's aggressive violations on camera, film also their plate and later go to the county prosecutor office in that county and fill out an affidavit, turn over copy of the video with it. The driver will get a summons to traffic court and answer to a judge about their aggressive driving, and you can be there to testify about them putting your life in danger.

As a long time rider (currently still recovering from being busted up in a bike wreck) I just don't get the kicking thing. It is an invitation for the Laws of Physics to punish you severely and permanently.

If you genuinely feel the driver intentionally tried to hurt you or throw their weight around like "screw that bike, I'm bigger I'll cut him off he can just bounce off...", if that is actually the case which is probably isn't, THEN you have to use your head and not give in to the natural sense of anger, and instead concentrate on their plate and memorizing what you can see of the driver's physical description, then follow the legal process available to you. You could pull off and call 911, advise local law enforcement of the vehicle and operator description, last seen direction of travel, and what they did. Depending on the run volume and how busy the agencies in the area are they may send a car to look around or they may only be able to put out a BOL (be on lookout) over the air for the described vehicle. It actually happens a lot-- "BOL for ______________, authority: cell caller" have to admit that usually the offending vehicle isn't located, but these are the legal and sensible options.

Second point, above I said if it was intentional. It usually is not. Motorists just don't see us. Heck, I myself have occasionally almost not seen a bike when I'm driving and I ride (or rode). I think what happens sometimes is a driver doesn't see a bike and inadvertently cuts them off or pulls out or whatever and then gets defensive because they realize their mistake and are flustered and the fluster can turn into bluster. Who knows. Stay calm out there folks !!
 
Thanks for the cool-headed response, LoneRanger. Since becoming a parent, especially, I try to drive in a way that won't get me home dead or on Youtube. And while I'm a lot easier on myself when I make stupid mistakes on the road, I do my best to cut others some slack so we can all get where we're going.

Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Watching the video full screen,it looks to me when the [rider] on the motorcycle kicked the car,it startled the car causing him to swerve. The swerve of the car looked too sloppy to be intentional.


I wouldn't be surprised if this is the driver's version of the story, true or not. From my keyboard quarterback perspective, the only aggressive intention the video proves is on the part of the motorcyclist. He appears to be driving in the left shoulder as he kicks the car. All we can say for sure about the car is that it swerved, not why. I doubt we'll hear the motorcyclist's side, but maybe witness accounts will clarify some to the rest.

No matter who "started it," the cyclist is lucky that his escalation didn't get him or someone else killed. If the car driver was road raging, the same goes for him.

About lane splitting--I'm curious about the evidence supporting its safety. I don't ride a motorcycle and don't live in a lane-splitting state, but the practice seems really foolish. Car and truck drivers are watching for vehicles in the other lanes (if they're watching at all), but not necessarily on the lane line. With mirrors adjusted properly to see the adjacent lanes, I wonder if I would even be able to see a motorcycle on the lane line next to me until it's too late. There's also the increasingly poor visibility from vehicles, and the speed difference. When I see motorcyclists (illegally) splitting lanes, they're usually going a lot faster than the vehicles around them.
 
Originally Posted By: Rhymingmechanic

Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Watching the video full screen,it looks to me when the [rider] on the motorcycle kicked the car,it startled the car causing him to swerve. The swerve of the car looked too sloppy to be intentional.


I wouldn't be surprised if this is the driver's version of the story, true or not. From my keyboard quarterback perspective, the only aggressive intention the video proves is on the part of the motorcyclist. He appears to be driving in the left shoulder as he kicks the car.


The cyclist is in the carpool lane, not on the shoulder until after the car almost takes him out and he had to make an evasive maneuver. Agreed, I'm betting the car driver embellished his story to make it sound like he was an "innocent victim". What's missing in a lot of these videos on the 'net is the first 3~5 seconds where you see the car coming over into the bike's lane and playing squeeze off with him. Per eye witnesses, the road rage games started way before the video was shot. I'd like to hear the car driver's lame excuse for trying to kill somebody. Little did he know he was on camera.
 
Originally Posted By: Tony10s
I've noticed the words "cowardly" and "felony" being used in association with the man on the motorcycle. Well, a person trying to use his car to kill a motorcyclist is cowardly and a felony. The innocent person in the truck is the true victim in this situation.


Exactly ... and even if they don't locate the biker the guy driving the car will probably be charged with the accident. I'm sure after watching the video and talking to witnesses the cops are smart enough to know he purposely swerved at the bike in rage, which caused him to lose control and take out an innocent old guy in the white truck. Their insurance companies will have fun with this one. His insurance company might not even cover it based on his actions.
 
You've got it all figured out. If they find the biker they'll probably give him a medal. Do you approve of the biker running off and hiding? Are you doing fist pumps?

Both parties will be charged with whatever the evidence shows is appropriate, if they find the biker of course. The insurance companies might work out a percentage of fault deal, again if the biker is found.
 
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Originally Posted By: zo6
I'd like to hear the car driver's lame excuse for trying to kill somebody. Little did he know he was on camera.


I already gave that to you. Self defense. He's in the drivers space acting in a threatening manor. You can't hear what's being said you can't see if he's shown a gun or has one strapped on. Its like someone banging on the front door of your house saying they're going to kill you. You fire some shots thru the door. You gun people seem to be able to wrap your head around that.

The car can't out accelerate or out brake the bike. If I'm in the car I'm certainly not going to stop and give him a better chance to beat me up or kill me. I can't out accelerate him to get away. Running at high speed would also cause the driver to kill himself or somebody else.

A jury is going to be full of drivers that can see themselves in that awlful situation. Like it or not a lot of bikers are thugs. The guy was acting like a thug. He could be a hells angel. They all carry guns and kill people for amusement.
 
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A house is your castle, car is your castle or an extension of your home type argument.

Especially if the biker is picking on a woman. I have no sympathy for that scum.
 
Originally Posted By: turtlevette
Originally Posted By: zo6
I'd like to hear the car driver's lame excuse for trying to kill somebody. Little did he know he was on camera.


I already gave that to you. Self defense. He's in the drivers space acting in a threatening manor. You can't hear what's being said you can't see if he's shown a gun or has one strapped on. Its like someone banging on the front door of your house saying they're going to kill you. You fire some shots thru the door. You gun people seem to be able to wrap your head around that.

The car can't out accelerate or out brake the bike. If I'm in the car I'm certainly not going to stop and give him a better chance to beat me up or kill me. I can't out accelerate him to get away. Running at high speed would also cause the driver to kill himself or somebody else.

A jury is going to be full of drivers that can see themselves in that awlful situation. Like it or not a lot of bikers are thugs. The guy was acting like a thug. He could be a hells angel. They all carry guns and kill people for amusement.







No bike follows a decently setup car through the bends. That's why I don't like driving on a circuit or mountain road mixed with bikes, They hold me up.
 
Originally Posted By: turtlevette
Originally Posted By: zo6
I'd like to hear the car driver's lame excuse for trying to kill somebody. Little did he know he was on camera.


I already gave that to you. Self defense. He's in the drivers space acting in a threatening manor. You can't hear what's being said you can't see if he's shown a gun or has one strapped on. Its like someone banging on the front door of your house saying they're going to kill you. You fire some shots thru the door. You gun people seem to be able to wrap your head around that.

The car can't out accelerate or out brake the bike. If I'm in the car I'm certainly not going to stop and give him a better chance to beat me up or kill me. I can't out accelerate him to get away. Running at high speed would also cause the driver to kill himself or somebody else.

A jury is going to be full of drivers that can see themselves in that awlful situation. Like it or not a lot of bikers are thugs. The guy was acting like a thug. He could be a hells angel. They all carry guns and kill people for amusement.


It really ISN'T an act with you, is it?
 
Originally Posted By: Astro14
Originally Posted By: IndyIan


I don't think the police will charge someone based on helmet cam footage unless some gets injured or killed?
If its clear that the driver intended to put the bike rider at risk of getting hit or crashing, I'm good with the rider vandalizing the car, as the driver deserves it. If its an unintentional near miss from a senior or a Mom trying to deal with her kids, then vandalizing their car isn't justified.
The guy on the motor bike in this case, wasn't thinking things through and was lucky not to end up dead, as he found someone crazier than him. If you ever feel the need to snap off someone mirror, make sure you have a good plan to do it unscathed!


Fascinating display of self-righteous justification for criminal behavior!

How would our hypothetical vandal (he's no longer a bike rider, just a criminal now) determine intent? You're OK with breaking off mirrors, based on his interpretation of events? Judge, Jury, and Executioner?

Wow...but a biker has no advantage other than the ability to leave...a car is a 4000# weapon, wrapped in steel, while your motorcycle is a 600# weapon wrapped in your fragile pink body...Like a Chihuahua deciding to bite a Rottweiler, a motorcyclist has everything to lose in a physical conflict.

And if the car driver decides that the person engaging in the unprovoked mirror breakage (vandalism, and on my car, several hundred $$ worth) "deserves" to be side-swiped? You're picking a fight, making things physical, when you can only lose...

If you think a driver, the Rottweiler in this case, wrapped in steel, has it in for you, then - like the Chihuahua - biting the bigger dog isn't your best bet. He might bite back, and you might not like how that works out for you.

The wisest choice is to simply leave. Your advantage is the performance of the motorcycle. No car can keep up. Conflict over, and you're safe.

You ever feel the "need to snap off someone's mirror" - let us hope that person doesn't feel the need to respond in kind: you hit my vehicle, I hit yours.

Only difference is: you broke off the mirror. He crushed you.

But in the meantime, if I don't like how you park, and feel the need to "correct" you, you'll be OK coming back to a dangling mirror, or a keyed finish? Vandalism, property damage, is OK as long as the other guy "deserved it"...right?

Well, you can do the experiment if you want. Drive like a dangerous jerk on the road, and see what happens...
I tend to drive and park politely and no one gets mad at me, and if for some reason I decide to be an ashhole while driving and a cyclist kicks off my mirror I'm not going going to try to kill the guy... Its just a car... Probably I would've deserved it, as not many cyclists are out there trying to start fights with people in cars.

I just ride my pedal bike on the road and have never had someone put me at risk on purpose. I have had to dodge a few doors, but I pay attention and just tell whoever to watch it next time, as no one has looked in their mirror and saw me and then opened the door... But I guess if they did, I might take it out on their parked car if the situation was favorable for it.
 
Originally Posted By: IndyIan
I decide to be an ashhole while driving and a cyclist kicks off my mirror I'm not going going to try to kill the guy... Its just a car... Probably I would've deserved it, as not many cyclists are out there trying to start fights with people in cars.



The problem is a lot of people wouldn't view it as "just a car", it would be an expensive fix. Others also seem to have issue with admitting guilt to wrongdoing, such as those people who cut you off and give you the finger when you honk.
 
Motorcyclists splitting lanes are taking a good size risk. Cars in traffic moving slowly can oftentimes drift close enough to cars on either side where a motorcyclist will end up getting squeezed and ending up on the road. Some of these splitters are moving very, very fast.
 
Originally Posted By: IndyIan

Well, you can do the experiment if you want. Drive like a dangerous jerk on the road, and see what happens...
I tend to drive and park politely and no one gets mad at me, and if for some reason I decide to be an ashhole while driving and a cyclist kicks off my mirror I'm not going going to try to kill the guy... Its just a car... Probably I would've deserved it, as not many cyclists are out there trying to start fights with people in cars.

I just ride my pedal bike on the road and have never had someone put me at risk on purpose. I have had to dodge a few doors, but I pay attention and just tell whoever to watch it next time, as no one has looked in their mirror and saw me and then opened the door... But I guess if they did, I might take it out on their parked car if the situation was favorable for it.


I don't drive like a dangerous jerk. I use my signals, keep right except to pass, let people merge, that sort of thing...so, no, no one has ever tried to kick my car or bash a mirror.

But if you continue to think that bashing mirrors, or attempting to cause damage to someone's car, because they "deserve it" is justified...

Then, dude, YOU'RE THE ROAD RAGER.

You're the one who justifies escalating in response to the actions of the other driver. You're the one that takes discourtesy, or a mistake, and turns it into criminal action. You don't ever have the right to damage other people's property just because you're angry, no matter what bizarre rationalization you present here.

What's next for you? Don't like the neighbor's porch light, so you shoot it out? I mean, it's only property damage, and they deserved it for being such a jerk. Don't like your wife's cooking? Smash her phone, she'll learn. She deserved it, right? Her new iphone 7 costs about what car mirro does these days, and you have to correct her, don't you?

It's clear that you believe that you were put on this earth to correct people. To judge them.

You're advocating criminal behaviour that escalates road rage, and will get a lot more people killed.

Please give it up.

If you think turning a traffic mistake (and you really are in no position to prove it is otherwise in most cases, well, most of us are in no position to judge others' intentions when they're in a car, but it's clear that you think you are) into criminal property damage is justified, then why not agree that turning criminal property damage into personal injury is OK? You go one rung up the ladder, and the guy whose car you damaged goes one rung up. He's just going to correct your behaviour, that's all. You go around "correcting" other people by smashing their stuff and other people might choose to act like you and smash your stuff to correct you. Except that, in traffic, your stuff is surrounded by a fragile pink body.

It takes the bigger person to shrug of the inconsiderate, rude, or inattentive actions of others. Your advocacy of escalation and criminal action shows that you're definitely not the bigger person, and you're a menace to others on the road.

Keep it up, keep kicking cars, keep bashing mirrors, keep taking your childish anger out on other people's property, and one day, soon, you may get a retaliatory response. But you'll be on a motorcycle, with no chance of winning the conflict, and a competent driver will wield the weapon that is his car, and kill you.

And on BITOG, we will all discuss who was at fault, while you'll be dead.

Please be the bigger person. Someone offends you, disengage. Leave. Don't escalate.
 
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Originally Posted By: turtlevette
A house is your castle, car is your castle or an extension of your home type argument.

Especially if the biker is picking on a woman. I have no sympathy for that scum.



Turtle is correct. You purposely damage someone's vehicle while it's unoccupied,it's proper damage. You attack someone's vehicle while it's occupied,it's assault. In Texas the castle doctrine applies to occupants while they're in their vehicle.
 
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Originally Posted By: turtlevette
A house is your castle, car is your castle or an extension of your home type argument.

Especially if the biker is picking on a woman. I have no sympathy for that scum.



Turtle is correct. You purposely damage someone's vehicle while it's unoccupied,it's proper damage. You attack someone's vehicle while it's occupied,it's assault. In Texas the castle doctrine applies to occupants while they're in their vehicle.


And if you try to unjustifiably kill someone with your vehicle, it's attempted murder.
 
Originally Posted By: turtlevette
Originally Posted By: zo6
I'd like to hear the car driver's lame excuse for trying to kill somebody. Little did he know he was on camera.


I already gave that to you. Self defense. He's in the drivers space acting in a threatening manor. You can't hear what's being said you can't see if he's shown a gun or has one strapped on. Its like someone banging on the front door of your house saying they're going to kill you. You fire some shots thru the door. You gun people seem to be able to wrap your head around that.


You can't legally just shoot someone through the door because you think they're a threat - been watching too many Death Wish movies? You'd be going to jail over that. Sure hope you don't own a gun and think you can go shooting anyone who you feel threatened by. Same also goes with driving your car around and using it as a deadly weapon.

Originally Posted By: turtlevette

The car can't out accelerate or out brake the bike. If I'm in the car I'm certainly not going to stop and give him a better chance to beat me up or kill me. I can't out accelerate him to get away. Running at high speed would also cause the driver to kill himself or somebody else.


If you do some research, you'd find out that most bikes will not out brake a modern car. Especially in this case since the guy is riding a big heavy Harley.

Originally Posted By: turtlevette
A jury is going to be full of drivers that can see themselves in that awlful situation. Like it or not a lot of bikers are thugs. The guy was acting like a thug. He could be a hells angel. They all carry guns and kill people for amusement.


If the guy on the bike was so crazy then why didn't he stop and go drag the guy out of the car and finish the job? Actually, the guy in the car is probably lucky the biker keep going.

How do you know the car driver isn't acting like a "thug". What if the car driver is the one who started it all and the biker was just trying to defend himself from a lunatic. Would you still have the same viewpoint and feelings about the biker?

BTW, the guy in the car committed a felony by trying to use his car as a deadly weapon to cause harm to the biker - regardless of how this all started and unfolded. It's caught on video, and if the police do their job they will charge him for it.

http://criminal-law.freeadvice.com/criminal-law/violent_crimes/assault-with-deadly-weapon.htm
 
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