Supertech ELC & NAPA Cool for 7.3 powerstroke

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I recently changed my radiator hoses in my 2002 7.3 Powerstroke. I was planning on taking a longer trip and noticed this hose was starting to degrade with surface cracks. Not wanting to take a chance I replaced it and then the top hose as well. Was thinking about using a true diesel red ELC but didn't have the time to do a complete flush. The truck had green coolant when I bought it a few years ago and I have maintained it with green and NAPA Cool. My system looked very clean from what I could see when I changed it and I don't have a coolant filter on it. I did not see any sand in the system so the previous owner must have regularly changed the coolant also.

So I refilled the system with Supertech all makes/models/colors 50/50 premix extended life coolant because its silicate free. It took 4 gallons and I added a bottle of NAPA COOL for the SCAs. After driving and circulating I tested it with strips and it showed perfect colors. Since then I did some checking to see if all makes/models extended life "green" can be used in a diesel. Well most say its not recommended.

I'm wondering why if its silicate free and if it shows good on the test strips?

Should I change out the coolant to another true green ethylene glycol coolant or do you think is this OK to run for 2 years or so?
 
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Leave it. If you're good about proactive maintenance then you won't run the ST coolant long enough for it to become a problem.
 
Originally Posted By: Chris142
I would be concerned about the orings in the oil cooler. Are they compatable with the addative in dexclones that eats plastic and rubber parts?


Dexcool eats plastic and rubber??
 
That's a new one for me - eating plastic and rubber. I've never had problems with Dexcool either--just kept the system full and maintained.
 
Quote:
Dexcool eats plastic and rubber??

Put a slightly different way, 2eha major inhibitor in DexCool and dexclone universals like ST ELC is a known plasticicizer.

Been many articles on it. The best short summary I've seen from the link regarding Chrysler FCA switching to a 2eha free OAT AF. Under extra sealing protection it says: "They reportedly are cocktails of three organic acids, featuring sebacate, but no 2-ethylhexanoate (2-EHA). The latter is a cost-effective but controversial additive that softens plastics, particularly silicone, leading to leaks from affected sealing materials, which means that silicone cannot be used in gaskets, O-rings, and hoses if the antifreeze contains 2-EHA." http://articles.sae.org/11284/

To the topic. According to the Motorcraft AF chart linked below, looks like the spec AF for the 02 Powerstroke could be an "Original/Conventional" IAT Green AF, an old time true Green AF. That would be a silicate AF. Based on the chart also indicates that G05, Motorcraft Gold can be used (or is spec depending on manufacture date and plant) to get a longer service interval with a complete exchange/flush. It too would contain silicates, just at a lower level than a standard old time original green.

So it looks like either original/conventional green or G05 MC Gold/Zerex is the spec AF. Neither would contain 2eha found in ST ELC Dexclone.

That said, while ST ELC (or any dexclone) wouldn't be my first choice, for two years 'may' work just fine and cause no issues. So it's your call. Do look at the linked Motorcraft AF chart linked below including the accompanying information of the bottom, page 3. For reference, orange in the chart is MC DexCool used on later models but not back spec'd.

http://www.motorcraft.com/servlet/BlobSe...&blobkey=id
 
Originally Posted By: dlundblad
Originally Posted By: Chris142
I would be concerned about the orings in the oil cooler. Are they compatable with the addative in dexclones that eats plastic and rubber parts?


Dexcool eats plastic and rubber??
gm used gaskets that are not compatable with dexcool. Thats why so many intake gaskets leak with it but not with green.
 
Originally Posted By: Sayjac
Quote:
Dexcool eats plastic and rubber??

Put a slightly different way, 2eha major inhibitor in DexCool and dexclone universals like ST ELC is a known plasticicizer.

Been many articles on it. The best short summary I've seen from the link regarding Chrysler FCA switching to a 2eha free OAT AF. Under extra sealing protection it says: "They reportedly are cocktails of three organic acids, featuring sebacate, but no 2-ethylhexanoate (2-EHA). The latter is a cost-effective but controversial additive that softens plastics, particularly silicone, leading to leaks from affected sealing materials, which means that silicone cannot be used in gaskets, O-rings, and hoses if the antifreeze contains 2-EHA." http://articles.sae.org/11284/

To the topic. According to the Motorcraft AF chart linked below, looks like the spec AF for the 02 Powerstroke could be an "Original/Conventional" IAT Green AF, an old time true Green AF. That would be a silicate AF. Based on the chart also indicates that G05, Motorcraft Gold can be used (or is spec depending on manufacture date and plant) to get a longer service interval with a complete exchange/flush. It too would contain silicates, just at a lower level than a standard old time original green.

So it looks like either original/conventional green or G05 MC Gold/Zerex is the spec AF. Neither would contain 2eha found in ST ELC Dexclone.

That said, while ST ELC (or any dexclone) wouldn't be my first choice, for two years 'may' work just fine and cause no issues. So it's your call. Do look at the linked Motorcraft AF chart linked below including the accompanying information of the bottom, page 3. For reference, orange in the chart is MC DexCool used on later models but not back spec'd.

http://www.motorcraft.com/servlet/BlobSe...&blobkey=id


I see that yellow or green may be acceptable. I'm still wondering if the Supertech is silicate free if this is not a benefit for cleanliness and the SCA additive addresses the cavitation. I guess the only issue is whether the Supertech would attack the seals.
 
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OK let me ask this ... Looking at the heavy duty Shell ELC red it says I must flush the system with distilled water etc. to make the changeover. I'm thinking of making a change by a series of drains and refills over a period of time. I realize the HD ELC coolant life is shortened by the Supertech but a few drains and refills will eventually switch it all over to red. Some people are saying the mixture will cause a gel or chemical reaction and some are saying it wont. Supertech says it's compatible with all coolants and the Shell does not say if it is. Or I can use any other brand of HD ELC as long as it won't gel and eventually I get all the high quality red in it.

The red does not cost that much so I'd rather do it this way than trying to flush everything out for red.
 
Originally Posted By: T-Stick
...I see that yellow or green may be acceptable. I'm still wondering if the Supertech is silicate free if this is not a benefit for cleanliness and the SCA additive addresses the cavitation. I guess the only issue is whether the Supertech would attack the seals.

Yes ST ELC is silicate free, as are the OAT AFs. One advantage to OAT AFs is they do have a longer service interval as compared to IAT conventional greens AFs.

I wouldn't get too caught up though in the tint/color of the AF, but rather the type. Color very unreliable indicator of chemistry, AF type. The AF you call 'yellow' as Motorcraft Gold is G-05. It too has a longer service interval like the LL/EL OAT AF's, but has some silicates. However Chrysler spec'd the same type AF G-05, but it's MOPAR tint was a reddish/pink type tint. Same stuff though.

I would agree with the one issue you note. See my last comment in the quote for my opinion on using it.
 
I couldn't tell you if it will "gel" or not if you gradually change over to the Shell. Not familiar specifically with Shell ELC, but I tend to doubt it especially if you do it on a regular interval you note. That said, my preference would be to get the all the old out with distilled flushes, then add the Shell full strength to ~50%AF capacity and top with distilled. Again your call there.
 
Yea I understand that yellow or green only means something within the same brand and does not work across brands. I'm going to check around and see if I can find a HD ELC that is compatible with other coolants to have the option of the drain/refill thing. I don't want to go back to a silicate antifreeze that wears out pumps and I'm hoping to avoid needing a complete flush.
 
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I might note the coolant is certainly working well as the truck runs cool like it always does.
 
Originally Posted By: Chris142
gm used gaskets that are not compatable with dexcool. Thats why so many intake gaskets leak with it but not with green.


Wow, I had no idea..... I have found it obviously eats the water pump seals in a 5.9 Cummins!
mad.gif
 
Chris142 - I normally have no argument with your advice but you seem to be flat out scare mongering in this thread. The information you have presented is fine, but I see no reason to give T-Stick the impression that his cooling system is now a ticking time bomb.

One thing we all need to keep in mind is that the Dexcool clones (any OAT type coolant that uses 2EHA) sell by the HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS of gallons each year. Prestone, Peak, etc.. are the top selling brands in any wal-mart, autozone, oreillys, etc.

If 2EHA was still eating gaskets like the old GM days, then we'd be hearing about it by now because I'd bet at least 40% of the cars on the road are running on some sort of 2EHA type coolant.

Even now, I don't recall if there was ever a definitive answer about the old GM days of dexcool sludge, but I have seen a lot of people claim the gaskets themselves were poorly sourced/spec'd. The coolant itself is mostly water and ethylene glycol and then a very minimal amount of 2EHA added to protect/clean.

Not trying to attack you on this, but BITOG should be a place where we use solid rational thinking and not scaremongering to inform other members.
 
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