Snow Belt - how fast is your car oxidizing?
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*groan*
Now that Ohio has gotten on the liquid brine concoction wagon I think I prefer rock salt.
I got stuck behind one of those trucks one day, turned my grey car mostly white.
Went straight to a car wash!
Now that Ohio has gotten on the liquid brine concoction wagon I think I prefer rock salt.
I got stuck behind one of those trucks one day, turned my grey car mostly white.
Went straight to a car wash!
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With modern two- and three-coat paints (incorporating clearcoat) it seems to be a non-issue. I would say my personal experience is any vehicle made in the 21st century seems to have solved the problem. Before that, well, paint is expensive, so maybe only premium vehicles slayed that dragon. Basecoat/Clearcoat formulas were introduced by Sikkens in the 80's, now everybody makes it.
Unprotected steel surfaces are going to oxidize (rust), but iron oxide is actually a protectant. If the panel thickness is high enough it won't penetrate (such as a frame member on a body-on-frame truck). With thin metals, combined with water (and can be simple humidity) and any corrosion accelerant (say, road salt) you will have a problem eventually.
Unprotected steel surfaces are going to oxidize (rust), but iron oxide is actually a protectant. If the panel thickness is high enough it won't penetrate (such as a frame member on a body-on-frame truck). With thin metals, combined with water (and can be simple humidity) and any corrosion accelerant (say, road salt) you will have a problem eventually.
Originally Posted By: Johnny2Bad
If the panel thickness is high enough it won't penetrate (such as a frame member on a body-on-frame truck).
I was thinking that was only if you used a certain type of steel designed to do this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weathering_steel
Disclosure: I used to work at a steel mill, where it was referred to as Mayari-R steel.
If the panel thickness is high enough it won't penetrate (such as a frame member on a body-on-frame truck).
I was thinking that was only if you used a certain type of steel designed to do this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weathering_steel
Disclosure: I used to work at a steel mill, where it was referred to as Mayari-R steel.
Originally Posted By: Johnny2Bad
With modern two- and three-coat paints (incorporating clearcoat) it seems to be a non-issue. I would say my personal experience is any vehicle made in the 21st century seems to have solved the problem. Before that, well, paint is expensive, so maybe only premium vehicles slayed that dragon. Basecoat/Clearcoat formulas were introduced by Sikkens in the 80's, now everybody makes it.
Unprotected steel surfaces are going to oxidize (rust), but iron oxide is actually a protectant. If the panel thickness is high enough it won't penetrate (such as a frame member on a body-on-frame truck). With thin metals, combined with water (and can be simple humidity) and any corrosion accelerant (say, road salt) you will have a problem eventually.
I have seen a ton of 2000 and newer cars with rust in Minnesota.
With modern two- and three-coat paints (incorporating clearcoat) it seems to be a non-issue. I would say my personal experience is any vehicle made in the 21st century seems to have solved the problem. Before that, well, paint is expensive, so maybe only premium vehicles slayed that dragon. Basecoat/Clearcoat formulas were introduced by Sikkens in the 80's, now everybody makes it.
Unprotected steel surfaces are going to oxidize (rust), but iron oxide is actually a protectant. If the panel thickness is high enough it won't penetrate (such as a frame member on a body-on-frame truck). With thin metals, combined with water (and can be simple humidity) and any corrosion accelerant (say, road salt) you will have a problem eventually.
I have seen a ton of 2000 and newer cars with rust in Minnesota.
South Western Ontario uses rock salt, brine, sand, fingers-crossed for keeping roads free of ice. Don't follow the plow too close! This last winter was so mild compared to past, our cars will now last 1 year longer! -whoo Hoo!
The underside pinch welds on my 2009 Flex had some paint peeling, and surface rust. More of a problem on the passengers side than drivers. Applied POR15 - will wait and see. Flex has had DIY spraying with Rust Check every 6 months on the critical areas. The subframes for engine and rear suspension are looking crummy - surface rust despite spraying frequently with treatments. Ho hum
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My 2004 VW Passat (made in Germany) is fully galvanized and has not had any treatments other than rinsing occasionally to remove winter salt. Steel subframes for engine and rear suspension are rusty, but have lots of meat remaining. No body rust, but the hemmed seams on door skins show a bit of rust along their trailing edges - I treated with rust paint 5 years ago and this is still working okay.
2013 Maxima has rust on the engine subframe, treated with RustCheck, but it still shows. DIY oil spraying on this car so far.
Certain brands show rust much faster than others, Mazda's show trunk lid or hatch rust very quickly, Kia and Hyundai next IMHO.
The underside pinch welds on my 2009 Flex had some paint peeling, and surface rust. More of a problem on the passengers side than drivers. Applied POR15 - will wait and see. Flex has had DIY spraying with Rust Check every 6 months on the critical areas. The subframes for engine and rear suspension are looking crummy - surface rust despite spraying frequently with treatments. Ho hum
(My 2004 VW Passat (made in Germany) is fully galvanized and has not had any treatments other than rinsing occasionally to remove winter salt. Steel subframes for engine and rear suspension are rusty, but have lots of meat remaining. No body rust, but the hemmed seams on door skins show a bit of rust along their trailing edges - I treated with rust paint 5 years ago and this is still working okay.
2013 Maxima has rust on the engine subframe, treated with RustCheck, but it still shows. DIY oil spraying on this car so far.
Certain brands show rust much faster than others, Mazda's show trunk lid or hatch rust very quickly, Kia and Hyundai next IMHO.
Originally Posted By: Johnny2Bad
With modern two- and three-coat paints (incorporating clearcoat) it seems to be a non-issue. I would say my personal experience is any vehicle made in the 21st century seems to have solved the problem. Before that, well, paint is expensive, so maybe only premium vehicles slayed that dragon. Basecoat/Clearcoat formulas were introduced by Sikkens in the 80's, now everybody makes it.
Unprotected steel surfaces are going to oxidize (rust), but iron oxide is actually a protectant. If the panel thickness is high enough it won't penetrate (such as a frame member on a body-on-frame truck). With thin metals, combined with water (and can be simple humidity) and any corrosion accelerant (say, road salt) you will have a problem eventually.
In the salt belt, LOTS of vehicles are still rusting from the inside out regardless of the excellent paint on the outside.
With modern two- and three-coat paints (incorporating clearcoat) it seems to be a non-issue. I would say my personal experience is any vehicle made in the 21st century seems to have solved the problem. Before that, well, paint is expensive, so maybe only premium vehicles slayed that dragon. Basecoat/Clearcoat formulas were introduced by Sikkens in the 80's, now everybody makes it.
Unprotected steel surfaces are going to oxidize (rust), but iron oxide is actually a protectant. If the panel thickness is high enough it won't penetrate (such as a frame member on a body-on-frame truck). With thin metals, combined with water (and can be simple humidity) and any corrosion accelerant (say, road salt) you will have a problem eventually.
In the salt belt, LOTS of vehicles are still rusting from the inside out regardless of the excellent paint on the outside.
Here in NY State...for ged aboud it!
our vehicles rust fast.
our vehicles rust fast.
after five years in Texas, we finally got rid of our last NY vehicle.
Bought a north Texas owned vehicle, and a San Antonio vehicle, and both are totally spotless underneath and a joy to work on.
Bought a north Texas owned vehicle, and a San Antonio vehicle, and both are totally spotless underneath and a joy to work on.
My 2007 mdx has a bit of rust starting. It spent its first 4 years of life parked no garage onshore in Manchester(by th Sea) , MA.
Not fast at all, despite years and miles driven in Wisconsin and Michigan winters. I take all of my cars to a Krown rustproofing shop in Sarnia, ON, once a year for their oil spray treatment. They spray a light oil into the doors, rockers, trunk lid, and hood, and then completely spray the bottom side of the car. The vehicle will drip light oil for a week or so afterward, but all four of my vehicles are essentially rust-free. My '95 Dakota has 215K miles; my '02 Camry has 257K on it. I'm completely sold on Krown's process---the engines or transmissions will probably fail well before the bodies rot---something unheard of for most here in the Salt & Rust Belt.
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khittner,
I'm glad to hear that the Krown is working for you and hope mine does as well. I was taking mine to Windsor, but now take it to the dealer in Monroe.
There is also one in Lexington that "seems" like a good place based on their facebook reviews. https://www.google.com/search?q=lexington+krown&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8
Take care.
I'm glad to hear that the Krown is working for you and hope mine does as well. I was taking mine to Windsor, but now take it to the dealer in Monroe.
There is also one in Lexington that "seems" like a good place based on their facebook reviews. https://www.google.com/search?q=lexington+krown&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8
Take care.
Originally Posted By: doitmyself
Originally Posted By: Johnny2Bad
With modern two- and three-coat paints (incorporating clearcoat) it seems to be a non-issue. I would say my personal experience is any vehicle made in the 21st century seems to have solved the problem. Before that, well, paint is expensive, so maybe only premium vehicles slayed that dragon. Basecoat/Clearcoat formulas were introduced by Sikkens in the 80's, now everybody makes it.
Unprotected steel surfaces are going to oxidize (rust), but iron oxide is actually a protectant. If the panel thickness is high enough it won't penetrate (such as a frame member on a body-on-frame truck). With thin metals, combined with water (and can be simple humidity) and any corrosion accelerant (say, road salt) you will have a problem eventually.
In the salt belt, LOTS of vehicles are still rusting from the inside out regardless of the excellent paint on the outside.
I do find this type of rust annoying as it must be just a poor prep or paint process at the factory.
Originally Posted By: Johnny2Bad
With modern two- and three-coat paints (incorporating clearcoat) it seems to be a non-issue. I would say my personal experience is any vehicle made in the 21st century seems to have solved the problem. Before that, well, paint is expensive, so maybe only premium vehicles slayed that dragon. Basecoat/Clearcoat formulas were introduced by Sikkens in the 80's, now everybody makes it.
Unprotected steel surfaces are going to oxidize (rust), but iron oxide is actually a protectant. If the panel thickness is high enough it won't penetrate (such as a frame member on a body-on-frame truck). With thin metals, combined with water (and can be simple humidity) and any corrosion accelerant (say, road salt) you will have a problem eventually.
In the salt belt, LOTS of vehicles are still rusting from the inside out regardless of the excellent paint on the outside.
I do find this type of rust annoying as it must be just a poor prep or paint process at the factory.
You don't drive nice cars in the rust belt if you have half a brain, any old beater that runs and has heat will do. Once rust starts it gets going like fire in a cardboard house.
Kestas
Staff member
I remember a friend of mine telling a story of driving a car from the 60s during the winter. He opened the door and found the aluminum door sill actively foaming.
My dad told me stories of needing to replace the rocker panels every 18 months on his 55 Ford.
My dad told me stories of needing to replace the rocker panels every 18 months on his 55 Ford.
Originally Posted By: WillsYoda
My corolla uses cheaper steel, and rusted much faster than my avalon, which uses much better steel.
I hear comments about cheaper and better steel quite often. Old Volvos were said to be rust resistant because they were made of "good Swedish steel". At one point Japanese cars were said to rust because they were made of poor quality steel (with the second assertion that the steel was of poor quality because it was made from scrap steel - as if that would make a difference).
Calling any steel experts. Is rust resistance because of differences in steel quality or because of better coatings and more attention to design?
And if "better quality steel" is more rust resistant, what makes some steel better than others?
My corolla uses cheaper steel, and rusted much faster than my avalon, which uses much better steel.
I hear comments about cheaper and better steel quite often. Old Volvos were said to be rust resistant because they were made of "good Swedish steel". At one point Japanese cars were said to rust because they were made of poor quality steel (with the second assertion that the steel was of poor quality because it was made from scrap steel - as if that would make a difference).
Calling any steel experts. Is rust resistance because of differences in steel quality or because of better coatings and more attention to design?
And if "better quality steel" is more rust resistant, what makes some steel better than others?
Originally Posted By: khittner
Not fast at all, despite years and miles driven in Wisconsin and Michigan winters. I take all of my cars to a Krown rustproofing shop in Sarnia, ON, once a year for their oil spray treatment. They spray a light oil into the doors, rockers, trunk lid, and hood, and then completely spray the bottom side of the car. The vehicle will drip light oil for a week or so afterward, but all four of my vehicles are essentially rust-free. My '95 Dakota has 215K miles; my '02 Camry has 257K on it. I'm completely sold on Krown's process---the engines or transmissions will probably fail well before the bodies rot---something unheard of for most here in the Salt & Rust Belt.
Wow thanks for the information; I was unaware of this service, having lived in the non rusting South and West since before 2000. Now since I've moved to the Cleveland OH area I'll have to look them up.
Not fast at all, despite years and miles driven in Wisconsin and Michigan winters. I take all of my cars to a Krown rustproofing shop in Sarnia, ON, once a year for their oil spray treatment. They spray a light oil into the doors, rockers, trunk lid, and hood, and then completely spray the bottom side of the car. The vehicle will drip light oil for a week or so afterward, but all four of my vehicles are essentially rust-free. My '95 Dakota has 215K miles; my '02 Camry has 257K on it. I'm completely sold on Krown's process---the engines or transmissions will probably fail well before the bodies rot---something unheard of for most here in the Salt & Rust Belt.
Wow thanks for the information; I was unaware of this service, having lived in the non rusting South and West since before 2000. Now since I've moved to the Cleveland OH area I'll have to look them up.
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