My Fram Ultra XG3600 (oversized) has been on my 1998 avalon 1mzfe toyota for 18 months and 5k miles. I'm planning on running it another 5k and 18 months, for 3 years and 10k miles total. It has about double the filtering area of the standard filter size. Does this sound like a good plan?
Run Fram Ultra XG3600 for 3 years, 10k?
- Thread starter WillsYoda
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Nope, follow fram shelf life policy
Do they have a "xxxx miles or xxxx months" rating on them?
Maybe I haven't seen it, but I only recall them having mileage based change intervals.
Maybe I haven't seen it, but I only recall them having mileage based change intervals.
I ran one for 2 years & 20K, it looked like it could have gone another 20K-Motorking/Jay Buckley has stated that Fram is going to raise the Ultra's mileage rating to 1 year/20,000 miles; but, like with all extended OCIs (etc.), ONLY on a clean engine with no sludge or coolant intrusion or any other major issues.
I have a hard time not changing the filter when I change the oil, but that is just me.
In your case it should be just fine. Like you said, you are running a larger that stock filter that has been shown to easily handle 20,000 miles (in a clean engine).
In your case it should be just fine. Like you said, you are running a larger that stock filter that has been shown to easily handle 20,000 miles (in a clean engine).
There is nothing in a Fram Ultra that degrades much. Metal wire backing, check. Silicone ADBV, check. Glass fiber media, check. The rest is metal. ... Run for up to 10k miles and 3 years. Many people driving plug-in hybrids kind of have the same issue, low engine miles and a long time, and they run Fram Ultras long in Chevy Volts, Fusion Plug-in Hybrids, etc.
I run a Mobil 1 M1-209 oversize oil filter 20K with oil changes at 10K. The attached UOA shows that the oil looks good and the filter is at least doing its job.
The larger filter gives more area to trap stuff and because of the increased surface area for the same flow gets you oil across the media at just a bit slower rate. What's not to like about that. Oh, and the relief valve setting and base dimensions and thread are an exact match.
Link
The larger filter gives more area to trap stuff and because of the increased surface area for the same flow gets you oil across the media at just a bit slower rate. What's not to like about that. Oh, and the relief valve setting and base dimensions and thread are an exact match.
Link
I just checked FRAMS website.
On the Fram Ultra page, you have the following:
Overview section
Engineered for full Synthetic Motor Oil
Ultimate dual-layer synthetic media provides up to 20,000 miles of engine protection1
99%+ filtration efficiency2
On the Fram Ultra page, there are four notes at the very bottom:
1 Follow recommended change intervals as noted in your vehicle owner's manual
2 FRAM Group testing of average filter efficiency and dirt holding capacity using FRAM XG3387A, XG8A, and XG4967 and their leading economy filter model equivalents under ISO 4548-12 for particles > 20 microns.
3 Versus Nitrile Anti-drainback valve
4 Where applicable
So, this reference gives them the escape hatch on the warranty claims.
On the Fram Ultra page, you have the following:
Overview section
Engineered for full Synthetic Motor Oil
Ultimate dual-layer synthetic media provides up to 20,000 miles of engine protection1
99%+ filtration efficiency2
On the Fram Ultra page, there are four notes at the very bottom:
1 Follow recommended change intervals as noted in your vehicle owner's manual
2 FRAM Group testing of average filter efficiency and dirt holding capacity using FRAM XG3387A, XG8A, and XG4967 and their leading economy filter model equivalents under ISO 4548-12 for particles > 20 microns.
3 Versus Nitrile Anti-drainback valve
4 Where applicable
So, this reference gives them the escape hatch on the warranty claims.
Face it, if they were junk, we would be all over it-and I would be at the FRONT of the line! Some of the ones I've been running (on the XJ for example) would probably rust out before they really needed to be changed. Maybe we can talk Fram into making a stainless steel one!
There is no time limit on microglass, it doesn't break down like cellulose. You can run the Ultras for 3 years. The shelf life is 8 years iirc which is conservative too
I researched this issue last year and am running a (standard sized) XG3614 on our 1MZFE-equipped 02 Lexus for 1 year/15k (2x 7,500 OCIs in 1 year). I would do 3 year/10k based on what I learned. I am just at the end of one OCI now. I have an XG3600 on the shelf to try the next round. The 1MZFE has it's own issues, though...
I would caution you to pay periodic attention to the start-up noise on that engine with an over-sized filter, or really any filter. Every time I have tried to run an oversized filter (FL400S and one other I can't recall right now, not an XG) on this engine, I ended up with drain-back and dry starts after a few thousand miles. The filter location on this engine is really problematic with the horizontal orientation and proximity to the front header AND cat. My theory is the heat affects some ADBVs badly (and those that drained had silicone ADBVs). The extra oil in the filter may contribute to it, may not - not enough data to tell. I also run a large oversized filter on my SUV and it never has issues like this - but the mounting is at a down angle and low where there is lots of fresh air flow compared to the 1MZFE. Filters that last fine on this vehicle do not last on the 1MZFE.
So far I am having no drainback with the XG3614. But as it ages I listen more carefully. This engine is harder on filters than any I have ever had. But the engine iteself is great and runs like new (with necessary maintenance of course). It has 270+k on it now and runs wonderfully, and uses 1/2 to 3/4 qt of oil each 7,500k OCI.
I would caution you to pay periodic attention to the start-up noise on that engine with an over-sized filter, or really any filter. Every time I have tried to run an oversized filter (FL400S and one other I can't recall right now, not an XG) on this engine, I ended up with drain-back and dry starts after a few thousand miles. The filter location on this engine is really problematic with the horizontal orientation and proximity to the front header AND cat. My theory is the heat affects some ADBVs badly (and those that drained had silicone ADBVs). The extra oil in the filter may contribute to it, may not - not enough data to tell. I also run a large oversized filter on my SUV and it never has issues like this - but the mounting is at a down angle and low where there is lots of fresh air flow compared to the 1MZFE. Filters that last fine on this vehicle do not last on the 1MZFE.
So far I am having no drainback with the XG3614. But as it ages I listen more carefully. This engine is harder on filters than any I have ever had. But the engine iteself is great and runs like new (with necessary maintenance of course). It has 270+k on it now and runs wonderfully, and uses 1/2 to 3/4 qt of oil each 7,500k OCI.
Originally Posted By: WillsYoda
I only see mileage noted on the package. Has anyone seen a time limit on these?
Hyped up. I have run Motorcrafts for up to 3 years in two infrequently used vehicles. I have cut them up and saw no breakdown wharsoever.
I only see mileage noted on the package. Has anyone seen a time limit on these?
Hyped up. I have run Motorcrafts for up to 3 years in two infrequently used vehicles. I have cut them up and saw no breakdown wharsoever.
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Originally Posted By: Or
I researched this issue last year and am running a (standard sized) XG3614 on our 1MZFE-equipped 02 Lexus for 1 year/15k (2x 7,500 OCIs in 1 year). I would do 3 year/10k based on what I learned. I am just at the end of one OCI now. I have an XG3600 on the shelf to try the next round. The 1MZFE has it's own issues, though...
I would caution you to pay periodic attention to the start-up noise on that engine with an over-sized filter, or really any filter. Every time I have tried to run an oversized filter (FL400S and one other I can't recall right now, not an XG) on this engine, I ended up with drain-back and dry starts after a few thousand miles. The filter location on this engine is really problematic with the horizontal orientation and proximity to the front header AND cat. My theory is the heat affects some ADBVs badly (and those that drained had silicone ADBVs). The extra oil in the filter may contribute to it, may not - not enough data to tell. I also run a large oversized filter on my SUV and it never has issues like this - but the mounting is at a down angle and low where there is lots of fresh air flow compared to the 1MZFE. Filters that last fine on this vehicle do not last on the 1MZFE.
So far I am having no drainback with the XG3614. But as it ages I listen more carefully. This engine is harder on filters than any I have ever had. But the engine iteself is great and runs like new (with necessary maintenance of course). It has 270+k on it now and runs wonderfully, and uses 1/2 to 3/4 qt of oil each 7,500k OCI.
So far so good in start ups. I've had no issues. The main problem with this engine is that it is hard to work on certain things. My rear exhaust manifold has a small fissure in it, and the 6 manifold bolts are rusted on badly. Multiple mechanics have told me that there is a near 100% chance that one of the six bolts with snap off in the head, and the head will need to be pulled just to replace the manifold.
Other than that, at 210k it runs great and uses no oil.
I researched this issue last year and am running a (standard sized) XG3614 on our 1MZFE-equipped 02 Lexus for 1 year/15k (2x 7,500 OCIs in 1 year). I would do 3 year/10k based on what I learned. I am just at the end of one OCI now. I have an XG3600 on the shelf to try the next round. The 1MZFE has it's own issues, though...
I would caution you to pay periodic attention to the start-up noise on that engine with an over-sized filter, or really any filter. Every time I have tried to run an oversized filter (FL400S and one other I can't recall right now, not an XG) on this engine, I ended up with drain-back and dry starts after a few thousand miles. The filter location on this engine is really problematic with the horizontal orientation and proximity to the front header AND cat. My theory is the heat affects some ADBVs badly (and those that drained had silicone ADBVs). The extra oil in the filter may contribute to it, may not - not enough data to tell. I also run a large oversized filter on my SUV and it never has issues like this - but the mounting is at a down angle and low where there is lots of fresh air flow compared to the 1MZFE. Filters that last fine on this vehicle do not last on the 1MZFE.
So far I am having no drainback with the XG3614. But as it ages I listen more carefully. This engine is harder on filters than any I have ever had. But the engine iteself is great and runs like new (with necessary maintenance of course). It has 270+k on it now and runs wonderfully, and uses 1/2 to 3/4 qt of oil each 7,500k OCI.
So far so good in start ups. I've had no issues. The main problem with this engine is that it is hard to work on certain things. My rear exhaust manifold has a small fissure in it, and the 6 manifold bolts are rusted on badly. Multiple mechanics have told me that there is a near 100% chance that one of the six bolts with snap off in the head, and the head will need to be pulled just to replace the manifold.
Other than that, at 210k it runs great and uses no oil.
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