Amsoil SS 5w-20, 50,000 miles, '11 Ford Expedition

[Artem]

Amazing results considering the original oil is technically still in there for 50k miles.

It would be interesting if you could carefully collect the oil from the oil filter change and pour it back in to decrease the top off oil amount.

I'm willing to bet that there's no way this would have lasted this far without top off oil adding loads on additives constantly.

Still epic to see a 50k UOA. Keep it up.

 

[KL31]

Originally Posted By: Crusher
KL31
I looked at that link. The TBN is 1.8 vs my TBN of 5.3, it's basically spent. No Comparison. But I appreciate your Input


I think your oil choice may be just a smidgen better than the wallmart stuff

Will be nice to see next results. Also, are your miles mostly highway?

 

[Crusher]

Artem
I appreciate your insight. I think that trying to collect oil from a filter would prove to be challenging. Given the present properties of my filters, I change my Full Flow Filter every 25k miles, and my Bypass every 60k miles. When I replace the filters and top off it gives more life to the oil additive package. Based on this information I believe that I can extend this process many more miles. The next test will be at 60k miles and should be as good or better. I'm upping my Bypass Filter from a EaBP-90 to a EaBP 100 which holds 1.5 quarts of oil vs 1 quart of oil. We shall see.

 

[Crusher]

KL31
I agree the next test results will be interesting. I'll include a particle count on the test results.
Yes, I do quite a bit of highway driving.

 

[A310]

Thanks for the great report. With your system and filter change intervals I think you might be able to run your sump indefinitely. Great work.

 

[A310]

P.S. A longest oci would be great, if you don't start one, then maybe I will. I only have 22000 miles on my oil, so I better do some more road trips

 

[Crusher]

A310
Thanks for your comments.
I agree with you that with my system and Oil Filter change Intervals I may be able to run my sump indefinitely. Next stop is 60k miles!

 

[KL31]

Crusher, so your sump was 8qt but the bypass adds one extra quart? Or is it 9 quart plus one added with the bypass?

I think you may be able to go on almost forever like this! I suppose instead of draining the sump, it's just filters when required. Less work the better. Your oil sump bolt will be so tight when/if you ever crack it open! When's the eta on next uoa report?

 

[Crusher]

KL31
My sump is actually 6 quarts, and 1 quart for a normal spin on filter (FL-820s). When I added my bypass it's still a 6 quart sump, The 2 Filters in Bypass System (1 Full Flow + 1 Bypass) with oil lines add approx 3 quarts. I started with a Eao-15 full flow filter and went to a larger Eao-26. When I replace the Bypass Filter @60k miles I'm going up replace the EaBP-90 with a EaBP-100 filter. Those are the filters that normally go on a Powerstroke or Duramax Diesel. That setup will easily give me 9 quarts total capacity. The ETA on the next UOA will be sometime in June.

 

[Kuato]

Crusher, nice job! I've considered a bypass setup on the F150 but haven't gotten there just yet. I see you have "BMK 23-EA Dual Bypass Filter" posted in your sig; BMK the brand name? What filters are you using in the setup?


Originally Posted By: KL31
Well, I think my math is fine since I am going by total quarts used.

Here's a Honda civic using wallmart oil https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthr...201#Post4373587

12k miles on wallmart oil with a 3.9 quart sump. 3.9 goes into 14 approx 3.5 times. That's 3.5 oil changes. 12 x 3.5 is 42000 miles. That's close and again that's Wallmart oil not amsoil....

Sure he hasn't changed oil but adding oil is adding oil. Everything gets refreshed when adding oil.

I'm not trying to take anything away from the excellent result. But we have to keep in mind:

It's amsoil, 14 quarts have been used and maybe all highway. Dont get me wrong, I wish my car could go that far on 14 quarts!

Apples to Oranges sir. The Honda has a 3.9 quart sump. The Expedition has a 9 quart sump(including the modifications) - which is why someone said your math is off - it's skewed due to sump size.

Add to that, OP has added only 1 quart of makeup oil every 10000 miles.

 

[Crusher]

Cuato
I see you run a 5.0 motor, I run the 5.4 motor. That is a perfect candidate for dual bypass system The BMK 23-EA is Amsoil. I'm running the biggest possible filters. The Eao-26 for the Full Flow, and the EaBP 100 for the Bypass . To see pics of my setup go over to the Bypass thread, or I can PM them to you.

 

[KL31]

Originally Posted By: Crusher
KL31
My sump is actually 6 quarts, and 1 quart for a normal spin on filter (FL-820s). When I added my bypass it's still a 6 quart sump, The 2 Filters in Bypass System (1 Full Flow + 1 Bypass) with oil lines add approx 3 quarts. I started with a Eao-15 full flow filter and went to a larger Eao-26. When I replace the Bypass Filter @60k miles I'm going up replace the EaBP-90 with a EaBP-100 filter. Those are the filters that normally go on a Powerstroke or Duramax Diesel. That setup will easily give me 9 quarts total capacity. The ETA on the next UOA will be sometime in June.


I see. That's quite the worthwhile mod it seems. Adds oil and extra filtration for a win win situation.

 

[KL31]

Originally Posted By: Kuato
Apples to Oranges sir. The Honda has a 3.9 quart sump. The Expedition has a 9 quart sump(including the modifications) - which is why someone said your math is off - it's skewed due to sump size.

Add to that, OP has added only 1 quart of makeup oil every 10000 miles.


That's the issue though. It's apples to apples and a couple of you guys keep saying orange!

I'm looking at it like this: I give that honda civic 14 quarts to use. That gives him 3.5 oci. I have absolutely zero doubt that the civic owner would get 50k miles using amsoil ss with that many quarts and mostly highway driving AND with a little makeup oil to use here and there with that 0.5 of an oci remaining. No doubt at all. And some of you guys are like a bunch of lawyers jumping at the fine print and picking tiny specifics out to cling to!

The OP has done well in not actually having to drain the oil and getting great wear results and mileage.

But once again, with 14 quarts to use and that specific oil, many could squeeze 50k miles or close to!

And again I'm not taking anything away from crusher. This is a highly interested thread and I like what he has achieved!

 

[Artem]

I think bringing up a Civic with 3.9qt capacity is like adding a banana to the mix. Lol. Doesn't make sense and here's why...

If you're going to compare how much oil the OP has gone thru in 50k of use, then at least compare an identical car / engine doing your average intervals or even extended 10-15k or longer IF YOU DARE. This is how Amsoil comes up with their argument for extended drains and how it's technically cheaper in the long run.

Then it becomes obvious that the OP's maintenance plans comes out on top, given no excess wear and tear on the engine internals during the process.

Dealing with a quart of used oil and a spin on filter is much easier then dealing with 6 quarts of used oil to recycle, but that's besides the point in this case.

 

[Crusher]

Artem
Thank you for stating the obvious. It makes about as much sense to compare a Honda Civic with a 3.9 quart capacity to my Ford Expedition with a 9 quarts capacity, as it would to compare a Ford F-250 6.7L Powerstroke with a 15 quart capacity(with a bypass). It is not a Apples to Apples comparison.

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

Crusher, I think it's awesome regardless of whatever the naysayers think. The whole thing about sump size having any relevance is ridiculous... let's think about this since we're trying to draw silly conclusions.

You use your Expedition to tow a car trailer loaded with that Civic for your 50k oci - probably nothing changes to your UOA.
You use the Civic to pull your Expedition using the 14 quarts of Amsoil in question - you'd be buying a new car long before you ran out of new oil.

The point being, you went 50k in a big, heavy, CAPABLE vehicle that can do so many things more than just transporting two adults and luggage. Sure, just about ANY new passenger car can make it to around 50k miles on 14 quarts under the right conditions... but those will also involve at least one FULL oil change... and looking at your sample, around 78% of the Amsoil was in your engine for the full 50k miles.

To me, that's just awesome on many levels- the oil did awesome and your commitment to this test was awesome. It takes some nads to do a test like this on what was surely a $60k vehicle new!

 

[Shannow]

I agree that it's an awesome UOA, and that you can definitely run the oil longer.

But also would like to draw in some of the information that Doug Hillary brings to the forum that UOA is an oil condemnation tool not in and of itself an indicator of wear.

So with the bypass filtration, your oil is stellar...no question, and fit for much longer service (with regular filter changes and top-ups, I'm guessing near infinite).

But, and particularly with the bypass filter removing anything and everything that once WAS wear, to claim that the "wear results" match the UOA is a connection that can't be made IMO.

 

[KL31]

Sump size has no relevance? Wow now that's a new one. Serious about that?

Too many getting hung up on the civic example I found. Point of my argument was that 14 quarts have been cracked open and poured in.

Not sure why anyone would use a civic for towing. And I get told I'm throwing a banana into the mix. Mate, using a civic to tow an expedition is comparing a watermelon to an apple.

 

[Artem]

Dude, what does the word Civic have to do with the fact that a majority of the 14 quarts have been in the engine for 50,000 MILES!

Let's start saying how he could have been driving a Tesla this whole time and not used a single quart while we're at it.

 

[KL31]

Was just using a smaller sump comparison of an engine to make the point about 14 quarts. I have a 2.5L 200hp V6 with a 4L sump. Not all small sump engines have tiny displacement.

Many of the old fords here had 5L sumps in their 4L straight six engines.

But that's fine, throw a potato into the salad bowl with the tesla.

Just to reiterate, 14 quarts and all highway and oil that claims it can do 25k miles per oci. Jump on me for not being amazed. I am very impressed, amazed, no way.