I'm in the change it early camp. I want the break in metals out sooner rather than later. OP do whatever makes you happy, after all it's your investment.
My first new car. When to change the factory fill?
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Originally Posted By: SilverFusion2010
I'm in the change it early camp. After lots of reading I came to several conclusions.
#1 Whether you change it early or not, it's gonna work fine. The majority of vehicles on the road had absolutely nothing special done to them. Oil was changed at factory intervals, mom hauled the kids to practice, dad took the boat fishing etc etc. If you dump the oil at 5k and use a decent oil and filter after that the engine should last as long as the car will.
#2 How you drive the first few hundred miles matters way more than any other factor during the break in period. This is the only chance you get to make the piston rings seal as perfectly as possible. How do you do this? You have to make the rings wear against the cylinder walls so the two surfaces "marry". The compression rings in particular are important, better compression seal means more efficient combustion, less blow by and overall a better running engine. What forces the rings against the cylinder wall in the first place? Cylinder pressure gets behind the ring and forces it against the cylinder wall. More pressure = more friction between ring and cylinder wall (honing pattern). What controls cylinder pressure? Throttle!!!
IMO an ideal break in would go something like this:
drive normally varying speeds as much as possible, keep your foot to 1/2 max throttle, for about 20 min. This is what I think of as the "initial" wear period
once the engine is at operating temp and you've got the oil warmed up, start gradually increasing your acceleration cycles until you're making WOT runs. Downshift to slow down rather than cook your brakes. The vacuum generated with the engine braking helps the little bits and pieces move on out. Obviously you want to obey traffic laws, so think carefully about where you will go to run the engine hard. That's the core of it. a nice country road with some good twisties is a great place to work in an engine.... mountain pass type stuff. A nice lightly traveled piece of interstate where you can bounce between 40 and 80 in 3rd gear.
You can do this several times. ALWAYS LET THE ENGINE WARM UP COMPLETELY!!!!
somewhere between 750-1000 miles change the factory fill, and proceed to drive however you want. If you worked the rings in properly you should have an engine with very low oil consumption, and minimal blow-by.
I shall now retire to my baked-potato flame proof tent
OR maybe he should follow what the manual says
No special break-in period is needed. By following a few simple precautions for the first 600 miles (1,000 km) you may add to the performance, economy and life of your vehicle.
Do not race the engine.
While driving, keep your engine speed (rpm, or revolutions per minute) between 2,000 rpm and 4,000 rpm.
Do not maintain a single speed for long periods of time, either fast or slow. Varying engine speed is needed to properly break-in the engine.
Avoid hard stops, except in emergencies, to allow the brakes to seat properly.
Don't let the engine idle longer than 3 minutes at one time.
Don't tow a trailer during the first 1,200 miles (2,000 km) of operation.
I'm in the change it early camp. After lots of reading I came to several conclusions.
#1 Whether you change it early or not, it's gonna work fine. The majority of vehicles on the road had absolutely nothing special done to them. Oil was changed at factory intervals, mom hauled the kids to practice, dad took the boat fishing etc etc. If you dump the oil at 5k and use a decent oil and filter after that the engine should last as long as the car will.
#2 How you drive the first few hundred miles matters way more than any other factor during the break in period. This is the only chance you get to make the piston rings seal as perfectly as possible. How do you do this? You have to make the rings wear against the cylinder walls so the two surfaces "marry". The compression rings in particular are important, better compression seal means more efficient combustion, less blow by and overall a better running engine. What forces the rings against the cylinder wall in the first place? Cylinder pressure gets behind the ring and forces it against the cylinder wall. More pressure = more friction between ring and cylinder wall (honing pattern). What controls cylinder pressure? Throttle!!!
IMO an ideal break in would go something like this:
drive normally varying speeds as much as possible, keep your foot to 1/2 max throttle, for about 20 min. This is what I think of as the "initial" wear period
once the engine is at operating temp and you've got the oil warmed up, start gradually increasing your acceleration cycles until you're making WOT runs. Downshift to slow down rather than cook your brakes. The vacuum generated with the engine braking helps the little bits and pieces move on out. Obviously you want to obey traffic laws, so think carefully about where you will go to run the engine hard. That's the core of it. a nice country road with some good twisties is a great place to work in an engine.... mountain pass type stuff. A nice lightly traveled piece of interstate where you can bounce between 40 and 80 in 3rd gear.
You can do this several times. ALWAYS LET THE ENGINE WARM UP COMPLETELY!!!!
somewhere between 750-1000 miles change the factory fill, and proceed to drive however you want. If you worked the rings in properly you should have an engine with very low oil consumption, and minimal blow-by.
I shall now retire to my baked-potato flame proof tent
OR maybe he should follow what the manual says
No special break-in period is needed. By following a few simple precautions for the first 600 miles (1,000 km) you may add to the performance, economy and life of your vehicle.
Do not race the engine.
While driving, keep your engine speed (rpm, or revolutions per minute) between 2,000 rpm and 4,000 rpm.
Do not maintain a single speed for long periods of time, either fast or slow. Varying engine speed is needed to properly break-in the engine.
Avoid hard stops, except in emergencies, to allow the brakes to seat properly.
Don't let the engine idle longer than 3 minutes at one time.
Don't tow a trailer during the first 1,200 miles (2,000 km) of operation.
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: 2003f7
I picked up my first NEW car! a 2017 Kia Forte with a 2.0 DOHC 4. What are the thoughts on when to dump the factory fill?
The dealer said to do the first change at 5000 miles. I don't think I can wait that long. The manual calls for 3750 for severe and 7500 for normal.
What are your thoughts?
The manual gives you the answer.
I picked up my first NEW car! a 2017 Kia Forte with a 2.0 DOHC 4. What are the thoughts on when to dump the factory fill?
The dealer said to do the first change at 5000 miles. I don't think I can wait that long. The manual calls for 3750 for severe and 7500 for normal.
What are your thoughts?
The manual gives you the answer.
Originally Posted By: FowVay
This wear metal was in my filter at 600 miles. I changed this filter and will do my initial fluid change at 1200 miles. I'll run that out to 5,000 miles and then get on a 5,000 mile interval.
Timing chains and components dump a lot of debris into the oil on break-in. An early first change wouldn't be a bad idea, in my opinion.
The filter did it's job, but that's a lot of metal for 600 miles. What kind of car was it?
This wear metal was in my filter at 600 miles. I changed this filter and will do my initial fluid change at 1200 miles. I'll run that out to 5,000 miles and then get on a 5,000 mile interval.
Timing chains and components dump a lot of debris into the oil on break-in. An early first change wouldn't be a bad idea, in my opinion.
The filter did it's job, but that's a lot of metal for 600 miles. What kind of car was it?
Originally Posted By: tojo1968
Originally Posted By: SilverFusion2010
I'm in the change it early camp. After lots of reading I came to several conclusions.
#1 Whether you change it early or not, it's gonna work fine. The majority of vehicles on the road had absolutely nothing special done to them. Oil was changed at factory intervals, mom hauled the kids to practice, dad took the boat fishing etc etc. If you dump the oil at 5k and use a decent oil and filter after that the engine should last as long as the car will.
#2 How you drive the first few hundred miles matters way more than any other factor during the break in period. This is the only chance you get to make the piston rings seal as perfectly as possible. How do you do this? You have to make the rings wear against the cylinder walls so the two surfaces "marry". The compression rings in particular are important, better compression seal means more efficient combustion, less blow by and overall a better running engine. What forces the rings against the cylinder wall in the first place? Cylinder pressure gets behind the ring and forces it against the cylinder wall. More pressure = more friction between ring and cylinder wall (honing pattern). What controls cylinder pressure? Throttle!!!
IMO an ideal break in would go something like this:
drive normally varying speeds as much as possible, keep your foot to 1/2 max throttle, for about 20 min. This is what I think of as the "initial" wear period
once the engine is at operating temp and you've got the oil warmed up, start gradually increasing your acceleration cycles until you're making WOT runs. Downshift to slow down rather than cook your brakes. The vacuum generated with the engine braking helps the little bits and pieces move on out. Obviously you want to obey traffic laws, so think carefully about where you will go to run the engine hard. That's the core of it. a nice country road with some good twisties is a great place to work in an engine.... mountain pass type stuff. A nice lightly traveled piece of interstate where you can bounce between 40 and 80 in 3rd gear.
You can do this several times. ALWAYS LET THE ENGINE WARM UP COMPLETELY!!!!
somewhere between 750-1000 miles change the factory fill, and proceed to drive however you want. If you worked the rings in properly you should have an engine with very low oil consumption, and minimal blow-by.
I shall now retire to my baked-potato flame proof tent
OR maybe he should follow what the manual says
No special break-in period is needed. By following a few simple precautions for the first 600 miles (1,000 km) you may add to the performance, economy and life of your vehicle.
Do not race the engine.
While driving, keep your engine speed (rpm, or revolutions per minute) between 2,000 rpm and 4,000 rpm.
Do not maintain a single speed for long periods of time, either fast or slow. Varying engine speed is needed to properly break-in the engine.
Avoid hard stops, except in emergencies, to allow the brakes to seat properly.
Don't let the engine idle longer than 3 minutes at one time.
Don't tow a trailer during the first 1,200 miles (2,000 km) of operation.
I did specify that this was my opinion.
Since the manual quotes the first 600 miles that's when I'd do my first change OP. I'd also point out that varying engine speed will inherently require acceleration, loading the rings and accomplishing much the same thing as the procedure I outlined earlier.
one other point I'd like to clarify... don't race the engine, ie rev it up with no load. Thats bad. however WOT up to 4500 RPM or so not bad. You gotta load the rings.
Originally Posted By: SilverFusion2010
I'm in the change it early camp. After lots of reading I came to several conclusions.
#1 Whether you change it early or not, it's gonna work fine. The majority of vehicles on the road had absolutely nothing special done to them. Oil was changed at factory intervals, mom hauled the kids to practice, dad took the boat fishing etc etc. If you dump the oil at 5k and use a decent oil and filter after that the engine should last as long as the car will.
#2 How you drive the first few hundred miles matters way more than any other factor during the break in period. This is the only chance you get to make the piston rings seal as perfectly as possible. How do you do this? You have to make the rings wear against the cylinder walls so the two surfaces "marry". The compression rings in particular are important, better compression seal means more efficient combustion, less blow by and overall a better running engine. What forces the rings against the cylinder wall in the first place? Cylinder pressure gets behind the ring and forces it against the cylinder wall. More pressure = more friction between ring and cylinder wall (honing pattern). What controls cylinder pressure? Throttle!!!
IMO an ideal break in would go something like this:
drive normally varying speeds as much as possible, keep your foot to 1/2 max throttle, for about 20 min. This is what I think of as the "initial" wear period
once the engine is at operating temp and you've got the oil warmed up, start gradually increasing your acceleration cycles until you're making WOT runs. Downshift to slow down rather than cook your brakes. The vacuum generated with the engine braking helps the little bits and pieces move on out. Obviously you want to obey traffic laws, so think carefully about where you will go to run the engine hard. That's the core of it. a nice country road with some good twisties is a great place to work in an engine.... mountain pass type stuff. A nice lightly traveled piece of interstate where you can bounce between 40 and 80 in 3rd gear.
You can do this several times. ALWAYS LET THE ENGINE WARM UP COMPLETELY!!!!
somewhere between 750-1000 miles change the factory fill, and proceed to drive however you want. If you worked the rings in properly you should have an engine with very low oil consumption, and minimal blow-by.
I shall now retire to my baked-potato flame proof tent
OR maybe he should follow what the manual says
No special break-in period is needed. By following a few simple precautions for the first 600 miles (1,000 km) you may add to the performance, economy and life of your vehicle.
Do not race the engine.
While driving, keep your engine speed (rpm, or revolutions per minute) between 2,000 rpm and 4,000 rpm.
Do not maintain a single speed for long periods of time, either fast or slow. Varying engine speed is needed to properly break-in the engine.
Avoid hard stops, except in emergencies, to allow the brakes to seat properly.
Don't let the engine idle longer than 3 minutes at one time.
Don't tow a trailer during the first 1,200 miles (2,000 km) of operation.
I did specify that this was my opinion.
Since the manual quotes the first 600 miles that's when I'd do my first change OP. I'd also point out that varying engine speed will inherently require acceleration, loading the rings and accomplishing much the same thing as the procedure I outlined earlier.
one other point I'd like to clarify... don't race the engine, ie rev it up with no load. Thats bad. however WOT up to 4500 RPM or so not bad. You gotta load the rings.
Originally Posted By: FowVay
BigT, it is a 2017 Nissan Frontier, 2.5 liter.
Keep an eye on that one and document your oil changes. Possibly even a UOA down the road a little bit. Maybe it's normal for that engine during break-in and will level off.
BigT, it is a 2017 Nissan Frontier, 2.5 liter.
Keep an eye on that one and document your oil changes. Possibly even a UOA down the road a little bit. Maybe it's normal for that engine during break-in and will level off.
Originally Posted By: Bamaro
Originally Posted By: 2003f7
I picked up my first NEW car! a 2017 Kia Forte with a 2.0 DOHC 4. What are the thoughts on when to dump the factory fill?
The dealer said to do the first change at 5000 miles. I don't think I can wait that long. The manual calls for 3750 for severe and 7500 for normal.
What are your thoughts?
The manual gives you the answer.
Of course it does. The manufacturer has no interest in selling him another car in the future....
Just in case my point was missed in my above post, cam chains (and balancer chains) are subject to accelerated wear due to particulates. GM, Nissan and other manufacturers specified long oil change intervals and, unfortunately, had to replace chains under warranty. The reasons for the rapid wear included both particulates and low viscosity possibly coupled with high summer temperatures. Strangely, a switch to a more viscous oil and/or more frequent oil change interval solved the problems.
Long term Kia (and Hyundai) owners have had more than their share of chain wear issues. The best insurance against rapid chain wear is, of course, frequent oil changes.
Oil changes are cheap.
Originally Posted By: 2003f7
I picked up my first NEW car! a 2017 Kia Forte with a 2.0 DOHC 4. What are the thoughts on when to dump the factory fill?
The dealer said to do the first change at 5000 miles. I don't think I can wait that long. The manual calls for 3750 for severe and 7500 for normal.
What are your thoughts?
The manual gives you the answer.
Of course it does. The manufacturer has no interest in selling him another car in the future....
Just in case my point was missed in my above post, cam chains (and balancer chains) are subject to accelerated wear due to particulates. GM, Nissan and other manufacturers specified long oil change intervals and, unfortunately, had to replace chains under warranty. The reasons for the rapid wear included both particulates and low viscosity possibly coupled with high summer temperatures. Strangely, a switch to a more viscous oil and/or more frequent oil change interval solved the problems.
Long term Kia (and Hyundai) owners have had more than their share of chain wear issues. The best insurance against rapid chain wear is, of course, frequent oil changes.
Oil changes are cheap.
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The majority of cars I've purchased over the last 30 years have been in December. Given my climate I've always changed my oil and filter the same day as pick up after an hour or two of proper run in before shut down. To me this gives your engine a greater chance of removing stray contaminates prior to restart.
Not sure about the Honda break in oil thing but as far as I'm concerned unless they're using metals obtained from the United Federation of Planets my Spockian eyebrow is raised to a dubious tilt.
Not sure about the Honda break in oil thing but as far as I'm concerned unless they're using metals obtained from the United Federation of Planets my Spockian eyebrow is raised to a dubious tilt.
AND thank you MR. atetochange oil---you made me go look up e-peen
Steve
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