2015 WRX FA20DIT Mobil 1 ESP 5W30
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Originally Posted By: radu
I'm using ESP now in diesel bmw. Could the ethanol be the cause for the high TBN? C3 oils don't get along very well with high sulfur fuels. I don't know much about ethanol, it's just a thought.
Good point. Not sure whether or not higher ethanol and our elevated sulfur levels would be responsible for wonky UOA results, but most manufacturers probably would not recommend a lower SAPS oil when running higher ethanol. Penrite doesn't*.
syeo, might be worth asking XOM for a specific recommendation for your application.
*
Quote:
It is important to use engine oils that are compatible with E85 fuel. Oils meeting API SN/ILSAC GF-5 are best
able to handle E85 fuel as a specific test was introduced for oils meeting this specification for corrosion
protection when used with E85 as the fuel. The reason for this is oil that mixes readily with ethanol fuel
blends can appear to go milky and may appear to be contaminated with water where fuel dilution occurs.
E85, in general, poses issues with corrosion protection as water is soluble in ethanol and even trace
amounts can increase the likelihood of rust occurring inside the engine and fuel delivery system.
http://www.penriteoil.com.au/tech_pdfs/E85 COMPATIBLE OILS NOV 2014.pdf
I'm using ESP now in diesel bmw. Could the ethanol be the cause for the high TBN? C3 oils don't get along very well with high sulfur fuels. I don't know much about ethanol, it's just a thought.
Good point. Not sure whether or not higher ethanol and our elevated sulfur levels would be responsible for wonky UOA results, but most manufacturers probably would not recommend a lower SAPS oil when running higher ethanol. Penrite doesn't*.
syeo, might be worth asking XOM for a specific recommendation for your application.
*
Quote:
It is important to use engine oils that are compatible with E85 fuel. Oils meeting API SN/ILSAC GF-5 are best
able to handle E85 fuel as a specific test was introduced for oils meeting this specification for corrosion
protection when used with E85 as the fuel. The reason for this is oil that mixes readily with ethanol fuel
blends can appear to go milky and may appear to be contaminated with water where fuel dilution occurs.
E85, in general, poses issues with corrosion protection as water is soluble in ethanol and even trace
amounts can increase the likelihood of rust occurring inside the engine and fuel delivery system.
http://www.penriteoil.com.au/tech_pdfs/E85 COMPATIBLE OILS NOV 2014.pdf
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New test results.
I thought about the sulfur theory when I got the UOA back. From what I can tell, there is higher sulfur in E85 in California when compared to our 91. That should have forced the TBN to drop further, not raise it. Now the viscosity going up could be a result of the E85.
I can confirm the oil did not look milky when pulled, although it did smell like booze.
I thought that maybe ethanol has less sulfur
.
ILSAC GF5 oils are ACEA A5/B5 I believe. Usually very thin to improve fuel economy. I don't think that's what you want in your car
.
I would try a full saps oil like Mobil 1 0w40 or Motul Xcess 5w40, at least here in Europe. The new Mobil 1 'FS' 0w40 is not here yet.
ILSAC GF5 oils are ACEA A5/B5 I believe. Usually very thin to improve fuel economy. I don't think that's what you want in your car
I would try a full saps oil like Mobil 1 0w40 or Motul Xcess 5w40, at least here in Europe. The new Mobil 1 'FS' 0w40 is not here yet.
The sad part is I have nearly 2 cases of Mobil 1 ESP 5W30 sitting in my cabinet. That should last 1.5 years.
I'd love to switch to Mobil 0W40 Euro, because it makes life so much easier. My Porsche uses it, and its much cheaper too!
I was trying to avoid LSPI with the ESP... gotta choose my battles I suppose.
I'd love to switch to Mobil 0W40 Euro, because it makes life so much easier. My Porsche uses it, and its much cheaper too!
I was trying to avoid LSPI with the ESP... gotta choose my battles I suppose.
Originally Posted By: syeo86
The sad part is I have nearly 2 cases of Mobil 1 ESP 5W30 sitting in my cabinet. That should last 1.5 years.
I'd love to switch to Mobil 0W40 Euro, because it makes life so much easier. My Porsche uses it, and its much cheaper too!
I was trying to avoid LSPI with the ESP... gotta choose my battles I suppose.
I also have a case of M1 5W30 ESP waiting in the garage for my FA20DIT (Forester)...did you buy yours on special sale from Amazon, like I did? I'm seriously wondering if there is any chance the oil was adulterated by the seller somehow...I just cannot get over the high viscosity measurement from your UOA, and a bunch of the additive levels seem a bit off.
I share your concern about LSPI...Rotella T6 5W40 is another oil on the thick end with low calcium, but you're probably getting almost double the NOACK % there, too (~12.5% compared to maybe 6.6% with the ESP).
I'm assuming your 2015 WRX would have been subject to the Subaru LSPI recall, did you do well on the leakdown tests? Mine looked good there (think all 4 were 3-4%) and the plugs were not damaged, but I paid for new plugs with no labor charge since they looked fairly dirty at ~40kmiles.
The sad part is I have nearly 2 cases of Mobil 1 ESP 5W30 sitting in my cabinet. That should last 1.5 years.
I'd love to switch to Mobil 0W40 Euro, because it makes life so much easier. My Porsche uses it, and its much cheaper too!
I was trying to avoid LSPI with the ESP... gotta choose my battles I suppose.
I also have a case of M1 5W30 ESP waiting in the garage for my FA20DIT (Forester)...did you buy yours on special sale from Amazon, like I did? I'm seriously wondering if there is any chance the oil was adulterated by the seller somehow...I just cannot get over the high viscosity measurement from your UOA, and a bunch of the additive levels seem a bit off.
I share your concern about LSPI...Rotella T6 5W40 is another oil on the thick end with low calcium, but you're probably getting almost double the NOACK % there, too (~12.5% compared to maybe 6.6% with the ESP).
I'm assuming your 2015 WRX would have been subject to the Subaru LSPI recall, did you do well on the leakdown tests? Mine looked good there (think all 4 were 3-4%) and the plugs were not damaged, but I paid for new plugs with no labor charge since they looked fairly dirty at ~40kmiles.
Originally Posted By: Virtus_Probi
Originally Posted By: syeo86
The sad part is I have nearly 2 cases of Mobil 1 ESP 5W30 sitting in my cabinet. That should last 1.5 years.
I'd love to switch to Mobil 0W40 Euro, because it makes life so much easier. My Porsche uses it, and its much cheaper too!
I was trying to avoid LSPI with the ESP... gotta choose my battles I suppose.
I also have a case of M1 5W30 ESP waiting in the garage for my FA20DIT (Forester)...did you buy yours on special sale from Amazon, like I did? I'm seriously wondering if there is any chance the oil was adulterated by the seller somehow...I just cannot get over the high viscosity measurement from your UOA, and a bunch of the additive levels seem a bit off.
I share your concern about LSPI...Rotella T6 5W40 is another oil on the thick end with low calcium, but you're probably getting almost double the NOACK % there, too (~12.5% compared to maybe 6.6% with the ESP).
I'm assuming your 2015 WRX would have been subject to the Subaru LSPI recall, did you do well on the leakdown tests? Mine looked good there (think all 4 were 3-4%) and the plugs were not damaged, but I paid for new plugs with no labor charge since they looked fairly dirty at ~40kmiles.
I think my most recent two cases were from Amazon. However, the previous oil was purchased from Ludeoil. I think I've bought 2 or 3 cases from them and was using them exclusively until Amazon started carrying the case at a relatively reasonable price. Come to think of it, I think Ludeoil might have been the seller for this oil on Amazon.
In any case, my UOAs are controlled in the strictest sense. This is the ONLY oil to have graced this engine since the factory fill. I also always use the OEM black filter. It is worth nothing that at one time I had some MMT fuel additives, and did recently use some upper cylinder lubricant.
Although the additive levels seem off, to me they just appear more depleted. Let's not forget, the car had nearly 3 hours of dyno tuning on this oil, a 800 mile road trip, and then my usual stop and go commute (75 miles round trip). I've stopped using the upper cylinder lubricant, at least for this oil interval. The goal is to see whether or not the difference in cst and Magnesium was a result of the upper cylinder lube. FYI, I think the manganese was from the MMT used previously. It took a few oil changes to completely wash out.
I can't jump to conclusions yet, I need to change one parameter then see what happens.
As for the recall, I had a Cobb tune on the engine at 800 miles. The result of the recall was a clean bill of health. Engine leakdown tested within 1% across all cylinders. I also took the opportunity to have the plugs swapped using the same OEM NGK plugs. The stock plugs looked just fine. The recall was done at around the mid 20K mark, and the car is just about to hit 40K.
Originally Posted By: syeo86
The sad part is I have nearly 2 cases of Mobil 1 ESP 5W30 sitting in my cabinet. That should last 1.5 years.
I'd love to switch to Mobil 0W40 Euro, because it makes life so much easier. My Porsche uses it, and its much cheaper too!
I was trying to avoid LSPI with the ESP... gotta choose my battles I suppose.
I also have a case of M1 5W30 ESP waiting in the garage for my FA20DIT (Forester)...did you buy yours on special sale from Amazon, like I did? I'm seriously wondering if there is any chance the oil was adulterated by the seller somehow...I just cannot get over the high viscosity measurement from your UOA, and a bunch of the additive levels seem a bit off.
I share your concern about LSPI...Rotella T6 5W40 is another oil on the thick end with low calcium, but you're probably getting almost double the NOACK % there, too (~12.5% compared to maybe 6.6% with the ESP).
I'm assuming your 2015 WRX would have been subject to the Subaru LSPI recall, did you do well on the leakdown tests? Mine looked good there (think all 4 were 3-4%) and the plugs were not damaged, but I paid for new plugs with no labor charge since they looked fairly dirty at ~40kmiles.
I think my most recent two cases were from Amazon. However, the previous oil was purchased from Ludeoil. I think I've bought 2 or 3 cases from them and was using them exclusively until Amazon started carrying the case at a relatively reasonable price. Come to think of it, I think Ludeoil might have been the seller for this oil on Amazon.
In any case, my UOAs are controlled in the strictest sense. This is the ONLY oil to have graced this engine since the factory fill. I also always use the OEM black filter. It is worth nothing that at one time I had some MMT fuel additives, and did recently use some upper cylinder lubricant.
Although the additive levels seem off, to me they just appear more depleted. Let's not forget, the car had nearly 3 hours of dyno tuning on this oil, a 800 mile road trip, and then my usual stop and go commute (75 miles round trip). I've stopped using the upper cylinder lubricant, at least for this oil interval. The goal is to see whether or not the difference in cst and Magnesium was a result of the upper cylinder lube. FYI, I think the manganese was from the MMT used previously. It took a few oil changes to completely wash out.
I can't jump to conclusions yet, I need to change one parameter then see what happens.
As for the recall, I had a Cobb tune on the engine at 800 miles. The result of the recall was a clean bill of health. Engine leakdown tested within 1% across all cylinders. I also took the opportunity to have the plugs swapped using the same OEM NGK plugs. The stock plugs looked just fine. The recall was done at around the mid 20K mark, and the car is just about to hit 40K.
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Forgot about LSPI, diesels don't have that
.
Now that I know what it is and it's connection to oil, I would actually stick with ESP.
Both M1 0w40 and Xcess have large amounts of calcium.
You said you have enough anyway, why not keep a 4000-4500 mile oci? I don't run it more than 5k miles and it's just a 2.0 turbodiesel.
Now that I know what it is and it's connection to oil, I would actually stick with ESP.
Both M1 0w40 and Xcess have large amounts of calcium.
You said you have enough anyway, why not keep a 4000-4500 mile oci? I don't run it more than 5k miles and it's just a 2.0 turbodiesel.
Originally Posted By: radu
Forgot about LSPI, diesels don't have that
.
Now that I know what it is and it's connection to oil, I would actually stick with ESP.
Both M1 0w40 and Xcess have large amounts of calcium.
You said you have enough anyway, why not keep a 4000-4500 mile oci? I don't run it more than 5k miles and it's just a 2.0 turbodiesel.
I try to keep it in the 4000 to 4500 range due to fuel dilution. Realistically the UOA looks decent, and the mileage seems to be OK for the oil. I'll test again in 4000 miles and see where it stand.
Oh and I did email XOM, I'll update accordingly.
Forgot about LSPI, diesels don't have that
Now that I know what it is and it's connection to oil, I would actually stick with ESP.
Both M1 0w40 and Xcess have large amounts of calcium.
You said you have enough anyway, why not keep a 4000-4500 mile oci? I don't run it more than 5k miles and it's just a 2.0 turbodiesel.
I try to keep it in the 4000 to 4500 range due to fuel dilution. Realistically the UOA looks decent, and the mileage seems to be OK for the oil. I'll test again in 4000 miles and see where it stand.
Oh and I did email XOM, I'll update accordingly.
Originally Posted By: syeo86
I try to keep it in the 4000 to 4500 range due to fuel dilution. Realistically the UOA looks decent, and the mileage seems to be OK for the oil. I'll test again in 4000 miles and see where it stand.
Oh and I did email XOM, I'll update accordingly.
I emailed a question about ESP to Mobil.com and they just told me I should not run ESP in my engine...
I try to keep it in the 4000 to 4500 range due to fuel dilution. Realistically the UOA looks decent, and the mileage seems to be OK for the oil. I'll test again in 4000 miles and see where it stand.
Oh and I did email XOM, I'll update accordingly.
I emailed a question about ESP to Mobil.com and they just told me I should not run ESP in my engine...
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