M1 0W-40 @ 4,341 miles; '12 Kia Optima SX (2.0T)

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So here is my latest BlackStone report showing my sampling since new. I need to do a better job of sampling after a 20 mile drive to get the oil good and hot as I've had issues in the past with too cold sampling which gets the fuel trace off. These was with non "FS" oil up to now.

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Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
Does the exhaust sometimes smell rich?
Any cel... Try scanning the obd2 just to be sure.


Nope, exhaust smells fine and no CELs or codes stored. When I pull the dipstick I don't smell fuel as well. I really believe that the ~1.5% fuel dilution figure is from cold sampling. Normally, I just take the car out around the block from being stone cold and I realize that for getting a good BlackStone sample, I really need to get the engine and oil fully up to operating temperature for like 15 minutes or so, hence the 20 miles at highway speed approach for me. I just need to do that and compare it to the last sample and then see what I get.
 
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Besides the 3 pt viscosity drop, the add pack has been significantly used up. Wouldn't even have guess it started off as M1 0w-40 based on that UOA.
 
Originally Posted By: 69GTX
Besides the 3 pt viscosity drop, the add pack has been significantly used up. Wouldn't even have guess it started off as M1 0w-40 based on that UOA.


Isn't the add pack part of the TBN value (see prior sampling)? What specifically do you look at to see if the add pack is mostly depleted? These KDM 2.0T GDI engines are known to sheer the oil down quickly. That's why I start with xW-40 oil and set my change interval to ~4K miles.
 
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Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
Aluminum is usually piston metal, not bearings ...


I'd rather see that value at something like 2 or 3 at most. I wonder if running the GC Edge 0W-40 oil would do better here. Thoughts?
 
Why not a 10w40 to avoid so much VII and see if that tolerates fuel invasion better ...
Perhaps there is more to fuel diluting than just viscosity impacts ...
 
Check your TBN and TAN next time. That is significant drop for M1. I did 5K UOA on older version of M1 0W40 (VISOM based) and had drop from 13.5cst to 13.3cst in 5K.
I am wondering if that Hyundai/KIA engine is fuel dilution monster like first VW/Audi's were.
 
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Check your TBN and TAN next time. That is significant drop for M1. I did 5K UOA on older version of M1 0W40 (VISOM based) and had drop from 13.5cst to 13.3cst in 5K.
I am wondering if that Hyundai/KIA engine is fuel dilution monster like first VW/Audi's were.


Will do and I'll post that up when I get the results. I sure hope the fuel dilution (which ranged from a trace to 1.5%) is more of a cold sampling issue than anything else. This car is my weekday DD and I have a 40 mile round trip (light highway), so driving up on the highway for ~20 miles or so to get everything up to normal operating temperature actually IS my normal, so hopefully I'll see what is going on. Perhaps the sheering down of the oil in these KDM GDI engines (maybe worse in the 2.0L turbo) is due to fuel dilution. That was one of the reasons why I went with M1 0W-40 (Euro) oil with a ~4K OCI.

I will also strongly consider trying Castrol Edge 0W-40 (Euro) at my next oil/filter change. I use this presently on my '07 Volvo S80 (3.2L NA) with good results.
 
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Originally Posted By: 4WD
Think the aluminum comes from fuel wash of oiil film in cylinder/cylinders ?


Might be and would be of a significant concern to me!

As previously mentioned, I'm considering switching to the Castrol Edge 0W-40 (Euro) oil at my next change over my M1 0W-40 (Euro) oil. One perhaps big difference between these two oils is that the Castrol Edge is GF-5 rated while the M1 is not (in my grade) along with the touted "Titanium" wear reduction additive package. Maybe that will help?
 
Sure can try - I just can't see how they've formulated any 0w40 without a heap of VII ...
Amsoil has a non high mileage 10w40 ... perhaps Pablo could speak to the XL formulation ...
 
The drop in flash point and viscosity both indicate that you have significant fuel dilution. Whether you manage to boil it off after long drives or not, it is having an impact on the oil. There is otherwise nothing abnormal about the report, remember, these numbers are parts per million, and switching to another lubricant that yields different numbers does not mean it is providing better protection.

That said, any of the similarly approved Euro 0w-40's are going provide comparable levels of performance. What I might watch for is to see if the drop in flash point and viscosity are consistent with another oil. That would at least provide some clarity on whether the loss is entirely fuel related or of there is some mechanical shear in there as well.

Regarding sources of aluminum, modern engines generally use bi-metal aluminum/silicon bearings. Other obvious sources are piston skirts, cam bearing caps (or cam bearings depending on the setup), timing chain guides that have worn down to the bracing, cylinder walls if alumasil...etc
 
In addition to pistons,high aluminum can also be from the turbo. Surprised that 40W oil sheered that much in the mileage period shown. Whats bothersome is that the oil is now a mid 30W and the 2.0T motor really needs a 40W oil.Overall, not a bad report,but,dilution is the devil here.
 
Originally Posted By: Toptierpao
In addition to pistons,high aluminum can also be from the turbo. Surprised that 40W oil sheered that much in the mileage period shown. Whats bothersome is that the oil is now a mid 30W and the 2.0T motor really needs a 40W oil.Overall, not a bad report,but,dilution is the devil here.


Yes it is fuel dilution not shearing, at least according to that report. Blackstone's method of determining fuel is based on flashpoint and not a direct measurement via GC or some other method. If it were me I'd have the oil retested via another lab that measures the fuel directly and make sure the viscosity deviation is due to that.
 
Either way the oil sheered. While not excessive,in 2 of three of his reports,there is fuel in the oil. The Hyundai/Kia GDI engines are noted for this.
 
Originally Posted By: Toptierpao
Either way the oil sheered. While not excessive,in 2 of three of his reports,there is fuel in the oil. The Hyundai/Kia GDI engines are noted for this.


No, if it was fuel then the oil was diluted with a lower viscosity material that lowered the reading.

Blackstone fuel dilution measurements have not proven to be very accurate on here.
 
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: Toptierpao
Either way the oil sheered. While not excessive,in 2 of three of his reports,there is fuel in the oil. The Hyundai/Kia GDI engines are noted for this.


No, if it was fuel then the oil was diluted with a lower viscosity material that lowered the reading.

Blackstone fuel dilution measurements have not proven to be very accurate on here.


You are telling us that 1.5% fuel dilution will NOT sheer oil??? Ok,I respectfully disagree. Agree with you on the measurement accuracy.I have spoken to an extremely bright man with a physics degree in the oil industry who told me that those numbers can be off by 25-30% on either side.
 
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