ATs and mountain(downhill)
- Thread starter pandus13
- Start date
- Status
In my Tundra I will often force a downshift on hills. This will force the convertor to lockup and result in lower rpm, believe it or not, than it being unlocked in a higher gear. Win-win in my mind, although I wouldn't be surprised if I am making a bit more wear on the clutches as a result. [Not sure if this was designed in to make the vehicle more smooth in operation, or to save on clutch life at the expense of mpg.]
In my Camry I alternate. Some hills I let it do its thing, some hills I force a downshift. It seems less aggressive on locking up, and since it doesn't use a variable lockup convertor ,I don't worry as much about it wearing out the clutch. It also has a cheaper trans if something does go.
Both vehicles, sometimes I gear down to use engine braking, sometimes not. Lately I've been using the brakes more. As people say, brakes are cheaper than transmissions. Certainly easier to replace. No hills around me which could tax the brakes, so it's mostly OCD on my part. Comes more from a background of driving manuals, where it was a joy to put the engine rpm right where I wanted, and where I could take some pride in a smooth shift--really, it was all done without thought, selecting gears was done out of habit. So, in an automatic, I still have the habit & desire to shift.
Both vehicles, I will often lock out upper gears when in town. No sense shifting up if I know I'm going to slow and make a turn and then get on it.
In my Camry I alternate. Some hills I let it do its thing, some hills I force a downshift. It seems less aggressive on locking up, and since it doesn't use a variable lockup convertor ,I don't worry as much about it wearing out the clutch. It also has a cheaper trans if something does go.
Both vehicles, sometimes I gear down to use engine braking, sometimes not. Lately I've been using the brakes more. As people say, brakes are cheaper than transmissions. Certainly easier to replace. No hills around me which could tax the brakes, so it's mostly OCD on my part. Comes more from a background of driving manuals, where it was a joy to put the engine rpm right where I wanted, and where I could take some pride in a smooth shift--really, it was all done without thought, selecting gears was done out of habit. So, in an automatic, I still have the habit & desire to shift.
Both vehicles, I will often lock out upper gears when in town. No sense shifting up if I know I'm going to slow and make a turn and then get on it.
As I was taught as a kid when we used to live in BC and my folks regularly drove in the mountains: slow down and take your time. I lock out OD when towing anyway but I drive slower, drop gears in the auto and engine brake. I save my service brakes as much as I can. I dont really wish to have to use a runaway lane. I have never had issues with my trans overheating at all. My Ram has a decent cooler in it and I have to REALLY work it hard to get its temp over 200F.
When ascending I keep it geared down, have the revs up enough to be in the powerband and take my time. I dont see the point at racing up a grade going over highway speed.
When ascending I keep it geared down, have the revs up enough to be in the powerband and take my time. I dont see the point at racing up a grade going over highway speed.
Mountains are where grade logic comes out to play. And it's quite enjoyable to drive something that's really programmed well. Our vehicles have a lot of that logic onboard, and how it operates is a bit different depending on if you're using cruise control or not.
With cruise control uphill: do nothing. They'll downshift early on a hill and they'll hold that lower gear until it's pretty sure you're not on the hill anymore. Even if the throttle lets up if the grade flattens out, it'll continue to hold that lower gear and will not upshift. This is a dramatic departure from other automatic transmission programming I've experienced before (where it will get into a continual up/down shift routine unless you intervene).
With cruise control downhill: do nothing. If the speed floats up to about 2-3 mph higher than the set speed, it'll downshift to 4th or even to 3rd to maintain the speed. When you get to the bottom of the hill and it flattens out, it can be a bit clumsy as the throttle picks back up and it's at 3,500 rpm in 3rd gear. It'll quicky settle back into 5th, though.
Without cruise control uphill: just roll into the throttle to maintain speed. It'll downshift early and maintain the gear. You can jump on and off the throttle and you simply can't confuse it. It'll hold that gear until you really are off the hill. It's pretty remarkable how it just seems to KNOW.
Without cruise control downhill: this is the only situation where you really need to do something different, but not much. Drag the brakes for about 3-5 seconds. The logic will sense that the brake is engaged, but that you're not slowing down, and it'll downshift for you, presuming you to be going down a hill. At that point, you can usually let off the brake and just ride the engine braking down the hill. If you use a lot of brake to slow the vehicle, downhill or flat, the transmission will reactively downshift rapidly to help you maintain control.
I've sometimes said that transmission programming is about as important to me as any powertrain metric anymore (because so many manufacturers get it wrong). Our Hondas nail it, and it's one reason why they're so satisfying to drive for us.
With cruise control uphill: do nothing. They'll downshift early on a hill and they'll hold that lower gear until it's pretty sure you're not on the hill anymore. Even if the throttle lets up if the grade flattens out, it'll continue to hold that lower gear and will not upshift. This is a dramatic departure from other automatic transmission programming I've experienced before (where it will get into a continual up/down shift routine unless you intervene).
With cruise control downhill: do nothing. If the speed floats up to about 2-3 mph higher than the set speed, it'll downshift to 4th or even to 3rd to maintain the speed. When you get to the bottom of the hill and it flattens out, it can be a bit clumsy as the throttle picks back up and it's at 3,500 rpm in 3rd gear. It'll quicky settle back into 5th, though.
Without cruise control uphill: just roll into the throttle to maintain speed. It'll downshift early and maintain the gear. You can jump on and off the throttle and you simply can't confuse it. It'll hold that gear until you really are off the hill. It's pretty remarkable how it just seems to KNOW.
Without cruise control downhill: this is the only situation where you really need to do something different, but not much. Drag the brakes for about 3-5 seconds. The logic will sense that the brake is engaged, but that you're not slowing down, and it'll downshift for you, presuming you to be going down a hill. At that point, you can usually let off the brake and just ride the engine braking down the hill. If you use a lot of brake to slow the vehicle, downhill or flat, the transmission will reactively downshift rapidly to help you maintain control.
I've sometimes said that transmission programming is about as important to me as any powertrain metric anymore (because so many manufacturers get it wrong). Our Hondas nail it, and it's one reason why they're so satisfying to drive for us.
My Ford Fusion did not have this lovely feature with its automatic transmission. It did not downshift automatically at all going down a grade. It's only options were D and D1. No D2. The bad thing was to downshift into gear 1 was not an option. Going 20 mph on a flat plane the rpms would be 4500. So going 40 mph would have not been doable. So it was all on the brakes. Which was not fun on the Blue Ridge Pkwy going from its highest elevation of 6,054 ft downhill to 3400 ft headed towards Rte 23 and 74 in western NC. The brakes and rotors got quite hot and the front end was chattering from the heat.
I was very pleased that my Altima 3.5 had a shift mode that allowed me to downshift. When using this on vacation in Vermont I barely had to touch the brakes going downhill form the Green mts. When I drove down a 9% grade east on Rte 58 from Lovers Leap 3300 ft down to 1500 ft I did hardly have to touch the brakes at all. Much improved from my experience with the 08 Ford Fusion. Now I really liked my Ford Fusion. On everywhere east of the mountains.
I was very pleased that my Altima 3.5 had a shift mode that allowed me to downshift. When using this on vacation in Vermont I barely had to touch the brakes going downhill form the Green mts. When I drove down a 9% grade east on Rte 58 from Lovers Leap 3300 ft down to 1500 ft I did hardly have to touch the brakes at all. Much improved from my experience with the 08 Ford Fusion. Now I really liked my Ford Fusion. On everywhere east of the mountains.
Last edited:
Here in the Rockies I always downshift. Like you said the ROckies are completely different game. Tiguan is good in going downhill in lower geas, but BMW since it is diesel is the beast going uphill or downhill. Going downhill due to compression you can really slow down using engine. If there is no traffic, sometime I would touch brake five times at most between Vail pass and Denver, I just downshift as much as possible.
Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
Mountains are where grade logic comes out to play. And it's quite enjoyable to drive something that's really programmed well. Our vehicles have a lot of that logic onboard, and how it operates is a bit different depending on if you're using cruise control or not.
With cruise control uphill: do nothing. They'll downshift early on a hill and they'll hold that lower gear until it's pretty sure you're not on the hill anymore. Even if the throttle lets up if the grade flattens out, it'll continue to hold that lower gear and will not upshift. This is a dramatic departure from other automatic transmission programming I've experienced before (where it will get into a continual up/down shift routine unless you intervene).
With cruise control downhill: do nothing. If the speed floats up to about 2-3 mph higher than the set speed, it'll downshift to 4th or even to 3rd to maintain the speed. When you get to the bottom of the hill and it flattens out, it can be a bit clumsy as the throttle picks back up and it's at 3,500 rpm in 3rd gear. It'll quicky settle back into 5th, though.
Without cruise control uphill: just roll into the throttle to maintain speed. It'll downshift early and maintain the gear. You can jump on and off the throttle and you simply can't confuse it. It'll hold that gear until you really are off the hill. It's pretty remarkable how it just seems to KNOW.
Without cruise control downhill: this is the only situation where you really need to do something different, but not much. Drag the brakes for about 3-5 seconds. The logic will sense that the brake is engaged, but that you're not slowing down, and it'll downshift for you, presuming you to be going down a hill. At that point, you can usually let off the brake and just ride the engine braking down the hill. If you use a lot of brake to slow the vehicle, downhill or flat, the transmission will reactively downshift rapidly to help you maintain control.
I've sometimes said that transmission programming is about as important to me as any powertrain metric anymore (because so many manufacturers get it wrong). Our Hondas nail it, and it's one reason why they're so satisfying to drive for us.
Pretty much how the Alfa does it aswell. Except you don't need to drag the brakes at all, just touch them and the downshift is immediate. I'm not entirely sure the transmission will downshift on cruise going downhill if you go over the set speed though.
And the transmission does KNOW you're going up/down. They have a pitch sensor also used for the hill holder (holding the brakes on a hill until you give enough throttle or enough time lapses)
Mountains are where grade logic comes out to play. And it's quite enjoyable to drive something that's really programmed well. Our vehicles have a lot of that logic onboard, and how it operates is a bit different depending on if you're using cruise control or not.
With cruise control uphill: do nothing. They'll downshift early on a hill and they'll hold that lower gear until it's pretty sure you're not on the hill anymore. Even if the throttle lets up if the grade flattens out, it'll continue to hold that lower gear and will not upshift. This is a dramatic departure from other automatic transmission programming I've experienced before (where it will get into a continual up/down shift routine unless you intervene).
With cruise control downhill: do nothing. If the speed floats up to about 2-3 mph higher than the set speed, it'll downshift to 4th or even to 3rd to maintain the speed. When you get to the bottom of the hill and it flattens out, it can be a bit clumsy as the throttle picks back up and it's at 3,500 rpm in 3rd gear. It'll quicky settle back into 5th, though.
Without cruise control uphill: just roll into the throttle to maintain speed. It'll downshift early and maintain the gear. You can jump on and off the throttle and you simply can't confuse it. It'll hold that gear until you really are off the hill. It's pretty remarkable how it just seems to KNOW.
Without cruise control downhill: this is the only situation where you really need to do something different, but not much. Drag the brakes for about 3-5 seconds. The logic will sense that the brake is engaged, but that you're not slowing down, and it'll downshift for you, presuming you to be going down a hill. At that point, you can usually let off the brake and just ride the engine braking down the hill. If you use a lot of brake to slow the vehicle, downhill or flat, the transmission will reactively downshift rapidly to help you maintain control.
I've sometimes said that transmission programming is about as important to me as any powertrain metric anymore (because so many manufacturers get it wrong). Our Hondas nail it, and it's one reason why they're so satisfying to drive for us.
Pretty much how the Alfa does it aswell. Except you don't need to drag the brakes at all, just touch them and the downshift is immediate. I'm not entirely sure the transmission will downshift on cruise going downhill if you go over the set speed though.
And the transmission does KNOW you're going up/down. They have a pitch sensor also used for the hill holder (holding the brakes on a hill until you give enough throttle or enough time lapses)
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Here in the Rockies I always downshift. Like you said the ROckies are completely different game. Tiguan is good in going downhill in lower geas, but BMW since it is diesel is the beast going uphill or downhill. Going downhill due to compression you can really slow down using engine. If there is no traffic, sometime I would touch brake five times at most between Vail pass and Denver, I just downshift as much as possible.
Similar with my diesel, Hence me not knowing if the transmission downshifts or not if you overspeed. I can choose any gear manually anyway, and that's what I usually do going down a steep grade. I hardly ever use the brakes, but the rpms do go up near redline. When I do touch the brakes, it's usually nothing more than a jab.
Here in the Rockies I always downshift. Like you said the ROckies are completely different game. Tiguan is good in going downhill in lower geas, but BMW since it is diesel is the beast going uphill or downhill. Going downhill due to compression you can really slow down using engine. If there is no traffic, sometime I would touch brake five times at most between Vail pass and Denver, I just downshift as much as possible.
Similar with my diesel, Hence me not knowing if the transmission downshifts or not if you overspeed. I can choose any gear manually anyway, and that's what I usually do going down a steep grade. I hardly ever use the brakes, but the rpms do go up near redline. When I do touch the brakes, it's usually nothing more than a jab.
- Status
