Pennzoil making huge changes across the lineup
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Looks cheap and is a serious marketing mistake.
These jugs will be on clearance by spring and will be replaced with the more accepted product differentiation by bottle color.
There are no doubt some savings in using the same bottle for everything with merely different spray-printed labels. The loss in market recognition of the perceived value of the more premium oils will utterly bury this small savings.
We don't buy oils for wholly rational reasons even here. I run and have run synthetics in engines that need them like I need another hole in my head, for example.
Why would we expect the great unwashed to believe that PP or Ultra are really better oils than what we used to call PYB when they all come in the same bottles?
This is an experiment destined to fail and whatever marketing consultant SOPUS hired to come up with this should have their invoices returned unpaid or at least challenged and reduced.
These jugs will be on clearance by spring and will be replaced with the more accepted product differentiation by bottle color.
There are no doubt some savings in using the same bottle for everything with merely different spray-printed labels. The loss in market recognition of the perceived value of the more premium oils will utterly bury this small savings.
We don't buy oils for wholly rational reasons even here. I run and have run synthetics in engines that need them like I need another hole in my head, for example.
Why would we expect the great unwashed to believe that PP or Ultra are really better oils than what we used to call PYB when they all come in the same bottles?
This is an experiment destined to fail and whatever marketing consultant SOPUS hired to come up with this should have their invoices returned unpaid or at least challenged and reduced.
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Looks cheap and is a serious marketing mistake.
These jugs will be on clearance by spring and will be replaced with the more accepted product differentiation by bottle color.
There are no doubt some savings in using the same bottle for everything with merely different spray-printed labels. The loss in market recognition of the perceived value of the more premium oils will utterly bury this small savings.
We don't buy oils for wholly rational reasons even here. I run and have run synthetics in engines that need them like I need another hole in my head, for example.
Why would we expect the great unwashed to believe that PP or Ultra are really better oils than what we used to call PYB when they all come in the same bottles?
This is an experiment destined to fail and whatever marketing consultant SOPUS hired to come up with this should have their invoices returned unpaid or at least challenged and reduced.
I just bookmarked this page so we can all come back and compare you "predictions" to real life 12 months from now.
Looks cheap and is a serious marketing mistake.
These jugs will be on clearance by spring and will be replaced with the more accepted product differentiation by bottle color.
There are no doubt some savings in using the same bottle for everything with merely different spray-printed labels. The loss in market recognition of the perceived value of the more premium oils will utterly bury this small savings.
We don't buy oils for wholly rational reasons even here. I run and have run synthetics in engines that need them like I need another hole in my head, for example.
Why would we expect the great unwashed to believe that PP or Ultra are really better oils than what we used to call PYB when they all come in the same bottles?
This is an experiment destined to fail and whatever marketing consultant SOPUS hired to come up with this should have their invoices returned unpaid or at least challenged and reduced.
I just bookmarked this page so we can all come back and compare you "predictions" to real life 12 months from now.
I agree with his prediction. However, I am going to go with 6 months (vs 12) that Shell will understand the error of their ways.
I personally could care less about packaging, as I am buying what's inside, not out.The American consumer is a peculiar beast. A large portion of the consumers that buy oil will feel that the $10 more per jug PP must not be very "special" since it is in the same color container. He will feel there is no "prestige" in the higher priced PP. Then he will look down the aisle and see a shiny gold jug of Castrol Edge E.P. and think to himself, "Now here is the good stuff".
Sad but true.
I personally could care less about packaging, as I am buying what's inside, not out.The American consumer is a peculiar beast. A large portion of the consumers that buy oil will feel that the $10 more per jug PP must not be very "special" since it is in the same color container. He will feel there is no "prestige" in the higher priced PP. Then he will look down the aisle and see a shiny gold jug of Castrol Edge E.P. and think to himself, "Now here is the good stuff".
Sad but true.
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Daniel_Plainview
I agree with his prediction. However, I am going to go with 6 months (vs 12) that Shell will understand the error of their ways.
I personally could care less about packaging, as I am buying what's inside, not out.The American consumer is a peculiar beast. A large portion of the consumers that buy oil will feel that the $10 more per jug PP must not be very "special" since it is in the same color container. He will feel there is no "prestige" in the higher priced PP. Then he will look down the aisle and see a shiny gold jug of Castrol Edge E.P. and think to himself, "Now here is the good stuff".
Sad but true.
Does 12,000plus posts all of a sudden make ones crystal ball more credible?
I agree with his prediction. However, I am going to go with 6 months (vs 12) that Shell will understand the error of their ways.
I personally could care less about packaging, as I am buying what's inside, not out.The American consumer is a peculiar beast. A large portion of the consumers that buy oil will feel that the $10 more per jug PP must not be very "special" since it is in the same color container. He will feel there is no "prestige" in the higher priced PP. Then he will look down the aisle and see a shiny gold jug of Castrol Edge E.P. and think to himself, "Now here is the good stuff".
Sad but true.
Does 12,000plus posts all of a sudden make ones crystal ball more credible?
I'm not sure if I understand the question,sir.
Originally Posted By: CKN
Does 12,000plus posts all of a sudden make ones crystal ball more credible?
It might not, but the fact that he makes sense is the issue here. My biggest beef with Pennzoil over their product tiers, and I have been posting about it for a long time and even hounding Gena Fishbeck about it, is that the product differentiation is not there. PYB, PP, and PUP in 5w-30 are SN/GF-5. My G37 has a 3750 mile severe service OCI, calling for ordinary SM/GF-4 or newer 5w-30. Pennzoil doesn't offer lengthier OCIs from one tier to the next, so, I'm "stuck" (at least if I didn't know any better) with a 3750 mile OCI on PYB, PP, or PUP, whereas M1, M1 EP, and black and gold bottle Edge provide something more, and differentiate between tiers.
Gold bottle Edge failed miserably up here until the mileage warranty was differentiated from black bottle Edge. M1 EP seemed to do okay, since it made a differentiation from the start. Now, the point isn't whether these warranties are worth squat, but the point is they seemed to work from a marketing perspective. Our Walmarts and Canadian Tires could justify the shelf space for the M1 tiers and the Castrol tiers, but not the top tier Pennzoil product.
I know that PUP is every bit as capable as M1 EP and gold bottle Edge. But, when you look on the back of PP or PUP and see they are both dexos1 and A5/B5 lubricants (in the appropriate grade of course), what differentiation do you see beyond price? What makes PUP worth more money to the average Joe out there?
Given the difficulties we've seen with availability of PUP in various parts of the States and most parts of Canada, I would say that any concern based upon even poorer product differentiation is very well grounded.
Does 12,000plus posts all of a sudden make ones crystal ball more credible?
It might not, but the fact that he makes sense is the issue here. My biggest beef with Pennzoil over their product tiers, and I have been posting about it for a long time and even hounding Gena Fishbeck about it, is that the product differentiation is not there. PYB, PP, and PUP in 5w-30 are SN/GF-5. My G37 has a 3750 mile severe service OCI, calling for ordinary SM/GF-4 or newer 5w-30. Pennzoil doesn't offer lengthier OCIs from one tier to the next, so, I'm "stuck" (at least if I didn't know any better) with a 3750 mile OCI on PYB, PP, or PUP, whereas M1, M1 EP, and black and gold bottle Edge provide something more, and differentiate between tiers.
Gold bottle Edge failed miserably up here until the mileage warranty was differentiated from black bottle Edge. M1 EP seemed to do okay, since it made a differentiation from the start. Now, the point isn't whether these warranties are worth squat, but the point is they seemed to work from a marketing perspective. Our Walmarts and Canadian Tires could justify the shelf space for the M1 tiers and the Castrol tiers, but not the top tier Pennzoil product.
I know that PUP is every bit as capable as M1 EP and gold bottle Edge. But, when you look on the back of PP or PUP and see they are both dexos1 and A5/B5 lubricants (in the appropriate grade of course), what differentiation do you see beyond price? What makes PUP worth more money to the average Joe out there?
Given the difficulties we've seen with availability of PUP in various parts of the States and most parts of Canada, I would say that any concern based upon even poorer product differentiation is very well grounded.
This is what has bothered me about SOPUS products for years.
If PP is so good, and it is, then why couldn't SOPUS sell it as a 10K oil, as XOM does with M1?
If Ultra is even better, then why isn't it marketed as a 15K oil like M1 EP?
It's hard for a lot of people to see the value proposition in these oils when no advantage is claimed for the higher price tiers.
What is the point of these new bottles?
Surely a consistent look and image for each product tier would be more conducive to effective marketing.
Also, why does SOPUS go to the trouble of licensing it's HDEOs as API SM oils and then tell everyone that these oils are not to be used in vehicles with catalytic converters?
If PP is so good, and it is, then why couldn't SOPUS sell it as a 10K oil, as XOM does with M1?
If Ultra is even better, then why isn't it marketed as a 15K oil like M1 EP?
It's hard for a lot of people to see the value proposition in these oils when no advantage is claimed for the higher price tiers.
What is the point of these new bottles?
Surely a consistent look and image for each product tier would be more conducive to effective marketing.
Also, why does SOPUS go to the trouble of licensing it's HDEOs as API SM oils and then tell everyone that these oils are not to be used in vehicles with catalytic converters?
Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: CKN
Does 12,000plus posts all of a sudden make ones crystal ball more credible?
It might not, but the fact that he makes sense is the issue here. My biggest beef with Pennzoil over their product tiers, and I have been posting about it for a long time and even hounding Gena Fishbeck about it, is that the product differentiation is not there. PYB, PP, and PUP in 5w-30 are SN/GF-5. My G37 has a 3750 mile severe service OCI, calling for ordinary SM/GF-4 or newer 5w-30. Pennzoil doesn't offer lengthier OCIs from one tier to the next, so, I'm "stuck" (at least if I didn't know any better) with a 3750 mile OCI on PYB, PP, or PUP, whereas M1, M1 EP, and black and gold bottle Edge provide something more, and differentiate between tiers.
Gold bottle Edge failed miserably up here until the mileage warranty was differentiated from black bottle Edge. M1 EP seemed to do okay, since it made a differentiation from the start. Now, the point isn't whether these warranties are worth squat, but the point is they seemed to work from a marketing perspective. Our Walmarts and Canadian Tires could justify the shelf space for the M1 tiers and the Castrol tiers, but not the top tier Pennzoil product.
I know that PUP is every bit as capable as M1 EP and gold bottle Edge. But, when you look on the back of PP or PUP and see they are both dexos1 and A5/B5 lubricants (in the appropriate grade of course), what differentiation do you see beyond price? What makes PUP worth more money to the average Joe out there?
Given the difficulties we've seen with availability of PUP in various parts of the States and most parts of Canada, I would say that any concern based upon even poorer product differentiation is very well grounded.
Very well said, both Garak and fdcg27, thank you for the logic and clarity.
I was perusing the oil aisle at Canadian Tire yesterday. They had PNYB (new yellow bottle.....) on sale for $17.XX CDN but only in 10W-30. The other grades were the old bottle/label at the usual inflated pricing. The new bottle is easier to handle, and a narrower/taller bottle probably has packaging and shipping efficiencies. The old label is better. It's easier to read with quicker and clearer capturing of information. Why is 10W-30 the only one on sale in a prairie winter? Oh yeah, it's -25°C now.
Originally Posted By: CKN
Does 12,000plus posts all of a sudden make ones crystal ball more credible?
It might not, but the fact that he makes sense is the issue here. My biggest beef with Pennzoil over their product tiers, and I have been posting about it for a long time and even hounding Gena Fishbeck about it, is that the product differentiation is not there. PYB, PP, and PUP in 5w-30 are SN/GF-5. My G37 has a 3750 mile severe service OCI, calling for ordinary SM/GF-4 or newer 5w-30. Pennzoil doesn't offer lengthier OCIs from one tier to the next, so, I'm "stuck" (at least if I didn't know any better) with a 3750 mile OCI on PYB, PP, or PUP, whereas M1, M1 EP, and black and gold bottle Edge provide something more, and differentiate between tiers.
Gold bottle Edge failed miserably up here until the mileage warranty was differentiated from black bottle Edge. M1 EP seemed to do okay, since it made a differentiation from the start. Now, the point isn't whether these warranties are worth squat, but the point is they seemed to work from a marketing perspective. Our Walmarts and Canadian Tires could justify the shelf space for the M1 tiers and the Castrol tiers, but not the top tier Pennzoil product.
I know that PUP is every bit as capable as M1 EP and gold bottle Edge. But, when you look on the back of PP or PUP and see they are both dexos1 and A5/B5 lubricants (in the appropriate grade of course), what differentiation do you see beyond price? What makes PUP worth more money to the average Joe out there?
Given the difficulties we've seen with availability of PUP in various parts of the States and most parts of Canada, I would say that any concern based upon even poorer product differentiation is very well grounded.
Very well said, both Garak and fdcg27, thank you for the logic and clarity.
I was perusing the oil aisle at Canadian Tire yesterday. They had PNYB (new yellow bottle.....) on sale for $17.XX CDN but only in 10W-30. The other grades were the old bottle/label at the usual inflated pricing. The new bottle is easier to handle, and a narrower/taller bottle probably has packaging and shipping efficiencies. The old label is better. It's easier to read with quicker and clearer capturing of information. Why is 10W-30 the only one on sale in a prairie winter? Oh yeah, it's -25°C now.
With out knowing what the profit margin is on different grades we cant really tell if Pennzoil cares what oil you buy. For all we know they make more money on the plain dino.
The oil wall at most big box stores is full of 50 different colors and kinda overwhelming if you dont know what your looking for. Pennzoil might be trying to build a large solid yellow block on the shelves to catch people's attention and make their brand stand out from the rest.
The oil wall at most big box stores is full of 50 different colors and kinda overwhelming if you dont know what your looking for. Pennzoil might be trying to build a large solid yellow block on the shelves to catch people's attention and make their brand stand out from the rest.
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Wow - just left Walmart and most of the PP is in the new bottles. They look like the south end of a mule that's heading north ...
Yeah, they are ugly aren't they
i liked the clear bottles also but there must be a reason why they stopped using them.. Anyone know why that might be ???
No other synthetic will close the sales gap of Mobil 1 so fast.
There is a reason why Mobil 1 is the best seller.
Personally i like the look of the new Pennzoil jugs they improved the caps so they don't leak as much but they still don't use the inner seal like other quality oil companies do..
There is a reason why Mobil 1 is the best seller.
Personally i like the look of the new Pennzoil jugs they improved the caps so they don't leak as much but they still don't use the inner seal like other quality oil companies do..
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