Shopping for Town & Country Minivan`

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Hey folks, our family is in the market for a used minivan. Our mind is set on a late model Chrysler Town & Country, must have the updated interior and 3.6L Pentastar engine. Pretty sure that puts us in a 2011+.

Stopped by the local Chrysler dealership and they had about a dozen certified-used ones on the lot. Turns out they're all ex-rental fleet vehicles. I test drove a 2013 whose life started out as a rental, then had a second owner, price was 14.5K. The vehicle was in good shape, but had its fair share of wear, clearly the second owner had dogs that traveled. Exterior was average for a 3 year old car.

I loved the van(s) inside and out. The powertrain didn't feel much different than my 12 year old Honda Odyssey in terms of power, I think the Honda could beat it in a stoplight to stoplight drag race, however the Pentastar had plenty of zip. The 6-speed felt a little numb and mostly transparent in normal driving, but seemed to have a slow, somewhat abrupt shift when you punched it, or when it was shifting at WOT. The 5 speed in our Honda is smooth as butter in all conditions, feels more direct and quicker to shift. The Pentastar (never drove one before) isn't as smooth as the J35, and was definitely louder. I prefer the subtlety of the J35, and when VTEC kicks in its just as smooth with more growl. The 3.6L pulls much better at 5k+ RPM though. The manual shift mode on the Chrysler 6 speed I consider useless, as the computer overrides your choice anytime you do something half out of the ordinary. Like give it full throttle at 3k, it still downshifts to the lower gear.

Curious to see what you guys think of the Town & Country & Powertrain. Especially durability, as we plan on keeping this ride for 5+ years. I do all my own mechanic work (so long as I have the tools), so ease to work on is a consideration. We need to stay under 20k, and would consider other makes/models. Not a fan of the bubble shaped minivans and strange interiors that seemed to appear in 2010+ minivans from the Japanese makes, but would certainly go test drive them to get a comparison. Trying to avoid a Honda this time around unless we found a killer deal.

Also what do you think of purchasing a previous rental? The 2015-2016's are under 20k and have 30-40k rental use. Very interested in what you think of the price. Sorry for so many questions, but any input would be appreciated. Here's an example of what we're looking at:

http://www.perkinsmotors.com/used-Colora...4RC1BGXFR716241
 
With a budget of $20k shop around for a new one. Lots of Dodge versions were able to be bought for less than that OTD last year. Remember loaded models have more room for haggling.

Don't rule out a new one, and don't be afraid to online shop at dealers states away from you to get the best deal. I know several people who have saved 4-5k buying vehicles 200+ miles away from them. Some dealers will ship to you for not much money at all if you bargain hard.

Find one you like local and then shop online for the exact model. Get an absolute best OTD quote from multiple dealers, and buy from the one with the best price. Good luck!
 
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My grandmother bought a 2014 Grand Caravan SXT earlier this year. 27k miles, certified preowned, immaculate condition. It too had a life as a prior rental vehicle, I crawled all over underneath and outside of the thing and it looked perfect.

2013+ is the best to get because some of the 2011&2012 models had cylinder head issues.
Some 2013s had the heavy duty brakes I believe as the older ones warped the rotors and didn't stop as good.
2014+ all have the HD brakes. My grandmother's stops on a dime, I couldn't believe the brakes on that van.

They have a cheap "American Value" edition for $18k new but we hated that thing. No rear a/c, no power doors, rear windows don't open, no center console, no stow-n-go seats, hub caps, no roof rack, no window tint etc. It was too stripped down. In Phoenix the rear A/C is a must.
 
I'd avoid the T&C unless you want to put up with typical annoying Chrysler problems.

Have you looked at the Sienna?
 
Originally Posted By: mclasser
I'd avoid the T&C unless you want to put up with typical annoying Chrysler problems.

Have you looked at the Sienna?


+1, on avoiding the T&C or anything made by FCA for that matter.

If I needed a van the Odyssey would be my first look. '

Edit: I see you already own an Odyssey, any reason why you wouldn't buy the same again? No doubt Honda is higher quality than FCA. I especially love that the CEO of FCA called the CEO of GM and asked to merge and GM flat out said no.
laugh.gif
 
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My sister has had three of them over the years. they put 175K+ on them and love them. we had one - I loved the powertrain (which is likely very durable), the ride, the ameneties, and the stow and go seating; but I got tired of fixing power door locks, power sliding doors, the power rear hatch, and the A/C every two years. In fact, I have a NIB leftover door lock actuator right here on my desk.....
 
Chrysler minivan owner here -yes you will have significant repair headaches, but they're $10K less so as long as you know what you're signing up for, they are functionally superior considering the acceleration and stow n' go. Mine has 99,500 miles and is currently in the shop for its third power train warranty claim for a small oil leak. And you know, if you get an odyssey, you have to routinely pay to replace the timing belt and adjust the valve gap just as maintenance items.
 
We had an 11 Grand Caravan. Overall it was a good vehicle and remained mostly solid for the couple years we had it. Ours had the "pentastar tick" and required new heads. Dealer had it for two weeks while waiting for parts. Brakes were [censored] and transmission was starting to show signs of impending doom around 60k miles.

We currently have a 16 Odyssey and its great. We were very close to choosing the Sedona instead, but Honda had a better lease deal. I highly recommend looking at the current body style Sedona's. With incentives, a nicely dressed LX model can be had for low 20's and they have a 10/100k warranty.

Good luck!
 
Quote:
Edit: I see you already own an Odyssey, any reason why you wouldn't buy the same again?


We probably bought our 2004 Odyssey too "used" and with too poor a prior owner. It was about 10 years old and had 130k miles, but we didn't want a car payment at the time. I replaced head gaskets within a month of buying it (PO overheated it then traded it in, not known at time of purchase) but after that it's been 35k of running solid. Some small issues like one rear power door not closing via the handle (it functions with the remote though), plastic trim falling off the drivers' seat electric controls, and it burns a fair bit of oil (1 qt / 2k miles) even after the heads were completely redone at a trusted machine shop. Just in the last few days I discovered coolant weeping from the front head gasket. I had to remove everything down to the timing belts & water pump just to find it. This is our primary vehicle and I'm done with working on it. I'll save my energy to repair my get-me-to-work beater and put up with a payment on a nice van that our family can enjoy. I have great things to say about the Honda-- very easy to work on, reliable, except we bought an unknown vehicle that was PO by someone either extremely clueless or cheap. So indeed, we would consider another Honda, however the price vs miles vs age, the math is hard to swallow. Same for Sienna, and truth be told, we don't really like the style of either. The 2011(?)+ Hondas look like large hearses, and the Sienna is too bubbly. The T&C fits the wants & needs just fine at the price we can afford... But we are open to suggestions and will test drive the competitors to see which one we like the best.
 
I haven't heard of many issues with the 2011+ models, they seem to be holding up well.
 
Curious to see what you fellas think about the prior rental car history. The salesman did what he was supposed to do when I questioned it -- "they do service at regular intervals, check the vehicle out after each rental, etc." But I know how I treat rentals (see what they can do, without breaking the law), although I suspect most minivan renters don't push the vans hard.. After a bit of research I'm stuck between a 2014+ Touring-L that has all the bells and whistles: heated seats, blind spot monitoring, etc. but with higher miles (60k+). Or I can purchase a 2016 fleet vehicle with 30-40k for the same price or less. The fleet vehicles are missing the heated seats, fancy rims, 3rd row video monitor, and a few other things I can live with out. The dealer offered to install heated seats for a price, but I think I can get them to throw it in at no cost..

I'll pass at the new 20k minivan with no features. The newer Siennas and Odys are going for $19,000 with almost 100k miles in my area, unless they are true bare-bones models, which are still 15k or so...
 
The 2013 and up have the HD brakes. I have a 2015 GC and I've had no issues. I sold my 98 sienna to get this. Dont think Toyota's or Honda's are far superior in terms or reliability.

Honda has VCM issues. A guy on Sienna chat had a brand new Sienna have the tranny die before he got home (driven less than 100 miles from the dealer).

I paid about $13,000 less than a similarly equipped Sienna. The newer sienna's aren't as nice as the older ones in terms of interior quality.

Look around and I'm sure you'll find a good deal on a Town and Country.
 
I'd go with the T&C just make sure its a 2013 or newer. Honda had their fair share of problems too, and you'll be saving a good bit of money with the T&C. If you know how to check over a vehicle you should be fine, if not take it to a mechanic you trust and have them go over it.
 
Originally Posted By: mclasser
I'd avoid the T&C unless you want to put up with typical annoying Chrysler problems.

Have you looked at the Sienna?


Care to elaborate on "Chrysler problems?"

We did have a freak ignition module go bad, but beyond that our 2012 has been great.
 
Originally Posted By: Throt
Originally Posted By: mclasser
I'd avoid the T&C unless you want to put up with typical annoying Chrysler problems.

Have you looked at the Sienna?


+1, on avoiding the T&C or anything made by FCA for that matter.

If I needed a van the Odyssey would be my first look. '

Edit: I see you already own an Odyssey, any reason why you wouldn't buy the same again? No doubt Honda is higher quality than FCA. I especially love that the CEO of FCA called the CEO of GM and asked to merge and GM flat out said no.
laugh.gif


Another vote here for stay away from Chrysler. I have a 2012 T&C only because my SWMBO likes it. Rattles, squeaks, slider doors intermittent closing, worst transmission shifting and performance ever, the list is long. It spent 2 weeks in the shop for a constant ding and light on the drivers mirror from the proximity system that was traced to a hokey ignition switch. Even with my big brakes, it warps rotors and needs new brakes about every 40k. It's only shining aspect is the Pentastar. Nice power, and reliable. The rest of the vehicle is not up to par.
 
Originally Posted By: beanoil
Originally Posted By: Throt
Originally Posted By: mclasser
I'd avoid the T&C unless you want to put up with typical annoying Chrysler problems.

Have you looked at the Sienna?


+1, on avoiding the T&C or anything made by FCA for that matter.

If I needed a van the Odyssey would be my first look. '

Edit: I see you already own an Odyssey, any reason why you wouldn't buy the same again? No doubt Honda is higher quality than FCA. I especially love that the CEO of FCA called the CEO of GM and asked to merge and GM flat out said no.
laugh.gif


Another vote here for stay away from Chrysler. I have a 2012 T&C only because my SWMBO likes it. Rattles, squeaks, slider doors intermittent closing, worst transmission shifting and performance ever, the list is long. It spent 2 weeks in the shop for a constant ding and light on the drivers mirror from the proximity system that was traced to a hokey ignition switch. Even with my big brakes, it warps rotors and needs new brakes about every 40k. It's only shining aspect is the Pentastar. Nice power, and reliable. The rest of the vehicle is not up to par.


A suggestion on the brakes:

Duralast Max, or whatever they're calling them now, pads and Centric rotors.

I will admit, the OEM pads are junk. This pad/rotor combo solved that problem. I have non-HD brakes and they lasted much much longer.
 
You're keying-in on something that has become a big factor to me lately -- transmission programming and smoothness. Very few transmissions are programmed how I want them to be -- Honda is one of the few that seems to do it the way I like it. Most domestic brands don't, and Chrysler is no exception. Most rave about their 8-speed, but I find it to be programmed far too mushy and biased towards economy. While I haven't driven their FWD 6-speed, I wouldn't be surprised if it drove the same. I like the Pentastar engine -- like you, I find it to be no smoother (and a lot louder) than the J35, but it's a vast improvement over what Chrysler had before -- the pushrod 3.8L and the OHC 4.0L. I do like that it has a top-mounted canister oil filter.

The last Mopar van we had (a 2007 T&C we bought new) wasn't reliable, and the experience turned sour because of how Chrysler treated us. This was 8 years ago, but I'm still gun-shy on the brand. I would recommend, if you do this, that you find a really good dealership who will stand behind you. Ours didn't, and essentially just told us to call Chrysler's 800 number all the time (and they weren't helpful either). I would hope that, after a few corporate mergers and acquisitions now, their customer service program is back on track, and that a "5 star dealership" really means something (if they still use that scale).
 
Originally Posted By: 92saturnsl2
This is our primary vehicle and I'm done with working on it. I'll save my energy to repair my get-me-to-work beater and put up with a payment on a nice van that our family can enjoy.


I'm kinda anti-FCA but in this case it sounds like a wiser move. If you have a beater-backup then you're always covered--just make sure the beater has four doors.

Everyone says rentals are beat on, but WOT isn't abuse, nor is cruising at (oh my gosh!) 100mph. Most abuse issues are going to show up in short order (suspension parts), and as long as there is a warranty I'm not sure I'd worry too much about it. Eventually anything that breaks is going to be hard to tell from abuse, legitimate wear or just random failure--and that would be true across all makes, models and prior owners (if any).

I'd lean towards something with more wear. My family isn't that hard on things, but we don't flip out if juice gets spilled, the dog licks a window or if someone door dings us. Because we know its going to happen. Might as well get something pre-loved, and then when it gets more love, it just blends in. Save the money for the repairs that any vehicle will eventually need.

I'd run a quick cost/mile calculation, and make sure the value is inline. Used foreign is often not saving money over the predicted lifespan by buying used, while domestic depreciation may make it a clear winner on the cost/mile aspect. But I'd run the numbers and verify that is true--a desperate dealer might cut a really good deal on exactly what you want, new.
 
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