Arisaka pics, what type do i have?

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I believe this to be a bring back gun. I do not have the bayonet. One side of the gun is worse than the other, especially the bolt handle. One side is not bad, the other is rusted. It appears to have sat in some salty sand for a bit.

I have never cleaned it. not sure i should do anything to it.

The bore is rifled.

It has an intact mum.

Any ideas on age, value, should i clean it or leave it alone?

Thanks













 
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When the twin cities had a gun buy back I had friends beating bolts back into those rifles. Japs if I remember lost a fair number of riflemen when the bolts went threw there eye socket.
 
You see why i said the the other arisaka thread, that i had no desire to fire it! I would like to have a few authentic rounds for it.
 
I have a very similar specimen which I believe is a Type 99 Arisaka. Made from 1939-1945 it used a 7.7x58 rimless round. The Japanese had every sort of 7.7x58 - rimmed, rimless and semi-rimmed creating lots of supply line fun.

Mine is not safe to fire, and appears to be a 'last ditch' effort. It lacks the adjustable rear sight, it has a fixed peep. It is also has incredibly rough tool marks beneath the stock.
 
Originally Posted By: bioburner
When the twin cities had a gun buy back I had friends beating bolts back into those rifles. Japs if I remember lost a fair number of riflemen when the bolts went threw there eye socket.


Testing after the war (P.O. Ackley) showed that the Arisaka was THE Strongest bolt action rifle of the era. It wasn't the weapon the Garand was, but it wasn't unsafe for the shooter.
 
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Type 99 "Last Ditch" used for homeland defense. Off the top of my head, I do not remember witch arsenal, but you can decode the symbols... I have never heard that they were ever issued to troops.

There is nothing wrong with the metallurgy, heat treating or anything else. They were simply made simpler using less material and quicker assembly procedures. They fire 7.7mm round which is the same bullet as the 303 British (.312 instead of .308 ).

Some bring-back's were reamed out to chamber a 30-06, but since the bullet is loose in the bore, they never worked all that well. Check yours to see if it will chamber a 30-06 by hand w/o bolt pressure ... Prolly not, since it looks all original
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It's a bit beat up and it's not the most desirable of the Type 99's, but with a full Mum, the volley sight, the metal butt plate, it is a nice example. Later ones were even more crude down to rope sling and wooden butt plate, but still shot well. I suspect that if you scrub the bore and lube it up nicely, it'll shoot just fine. The bolt is super easy to disassemble and service. Just take your time and it will all be clear.

Please note, that the rifles were sighted-in at the arsenal and use the typical military sight picture of the time - the "6 O'Clock Hold" - meaning that using the peep, if you put the top point of the front sight on the belt buckle, you'll have a center mass hit.

These rifles with decent bores shoot around 2~3 inch groups at anything beyond 100m. They are nearly as powerful as an 06. They are certainly aimable out to hundreds of meters and lethal out to the limits of the sight, which on yours looks to 1,400m.

Ammo can be had from Mr Nambu or Graf & Son. It's usually about $1.25 a round now days. Brass is re-loadable. Do not shoot WW-II ammo, it's corrosive.

Be very careful of sanding the stock or messing with the metal finish. The Japanese used a lacquer substitute from a local plant that will raise a nasty itch if it gets on your skin. The split stock is not a defect, it's the wood drying out. They are two-piece stocks with a large dove-tail joining the pieces, and now old glue that has given up.

On the ones I have worked over, I tape the stock on both sides of, and flood the crack with CPES until it won't take any more. Then do the other side the next day. It freezes the split and bonds the two w/o altering the look. Once secure, they are shootable.

Here's more info: http://members.shaw.ca/nambuworld/arisakas.htm

Have fun, and if you want to unload it, PM me
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The only thing you should do to the rifle is use some oiled bronze wool (steel wool is too abrasive) and clean up the rust. Keep the metal oiled to prevent future rust.

What you have is a "substitute standard Type 99", commonly referred to as "last ditch" rifles. Many manufacturing shortcuts were taken in desperate times to speed up production of the rifles. You can find late war German K98 rifles that were the same way - simplified and not as refined.

It was made by the Kokura arsenal and is a series 25, which is the last series of T99 rifles that were made there in 1945. Great piece of history that should be preserved. Any 'restoration' involving sand, gluing, or otherwise should not be considered. At this point it should simply be preserved.
 
It is definitely a bring back from battle. The ones turned in at the end of the war all had their Mum's ground away or punched or otherwise defaced. They were considered the property of the Emperor and not that of the soldier or the army, etc. So to prevent disgracing the emperor at the time of surrender, they were all defaced.

Since yours has an intact Mum and a salt corroded bolt handle, it was a defensive battle weapon somewhere on one of the southern islands (probably) and maybe dropped after a bomb blast, naval shelling, or something. Some GI or Marine came along grabbed it so it was never put through the surrender process...

That same GI or Marine brought it home and now you have it. That's as close as you will ever get to battle w/o being there ...
 
Here's another Substitute Standard Type 99 for comparison. This is a Howa 9th series and is just a little bit more simplified than your example. Notice the "last ditch" features: Wood butt plate, welded safety knob, rough machining on barrel and receiver, no provision for a cleaning rod, welded bands, non-adjustable rear sight, and crudely machined bolt handle. Stock is also very crudely shaped and has a shortened upper handguard.







 
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This is making me want to go home and post some pictures of my arisaka. Mine isn't last ditch but it is later production and has a partially ground mum. I've shot mine a few times and it shoots fine.
 
spasm3's rifle is great. It's getting hard to find these untouched, unmolested examples and these are the ones that collectors like myself really want. The late war examples are neat, especially when compared to early production. The same goes for the German K98 rifles. The late war examples are very rough and unrefined. They really tell a story of the desperate times.

The rust looks pretty minor and should clean up fairly well with just some oil and a rag, oil and plastic scouring pad, or oil and bronze wool - that's the order I would try it.
 
The only cleaning I would ever do on a rifle like that would be some aggressive rubbing with a cloth soaked in mineral spirtts for the wood. For the metal soak it in a nice penetrating oil and rub it with a cloth to clean the metal.

Anything more aggressive will hurt the value.

That is indeed a very last ditch rifle. And as mentioned, the Arisaka is a very strong action and will certainly take abuse that will kill many of its contemporaries (enfields, small ring mausers, mosin nagants, etc). It is pretty much as robust as a good Mauser 98.
 
Sometimes (if your lucky!) the screws on these Japanese rifles are staked from the factory, in which case you should not try to disassemble. Just treat the metal you can access and store in a dry (
Just FYI, the original finish on these is called urushi lacquer.
 
Thanks for all the info!

I have not cleaned it, and i am afraid to clean it as i don't want to ruin the value. I don't have any desire to shoot it , mainly out of respect for who carried it and perhaps died with it. If i just oil it, will that be enough to prevent further rust? I don't want to let it degrade any further, but i don't want to clean away what it is, a relic.

I don't want to sell it, but what is the value of a rifle in this poor of a condition with an intact mum?



Thank you BrocLuno, jjjxlr8. , and Robenstein for you time posting info.

I am always amazed at the width of topics that can be posted here and still have such knowledgeable members on almost any topic!!!!
 
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Well, those of us who collect Arisaka's (and who's fathers faced the Japanese in the S Pacific), find them to be more interesting than the run of the mill battle rifle. They have all sorts of wrinkles and twists.

As far as cleaning and storing. We can see salt/sand damage and we know the actual WW-II Japanese ammo was corrosive; AND, Last Ditch rifles were no chrome bore pieces - so I'd clean the exterior gently and I'd oil the exposed metal.

It's very likely that the bottom of the barrel and the receiver will be heavily corroded where they were wet and took a long time to dry out. BUT, it's not trivial to get the front bands off so you can separate the action from the wood, so you have to decide how to proceed ...

Because of the corrosive ammo, I'd scrub that bore clean as I could. Get a good 30 cal cleaning kit and a couple of extra bore brushes. Some good Nitro Solvent and go to it from the breech end.

Arrange the rifle with the muzzle down at a comfortable angle over an old pan and work the brush back and forth. All the way out the end, and back again. It'll take 50~100 strokes to even start to get it clean. But the longer that old powder stays in there, the worse it gets ...

Lots of sellers leave dirty bores to hide unknown conditions during sale. But, you are going to keep it. So do the right thing and service it like any older piece of equipment before putting it away. You wouldn't leave a Garrand or an Enfield laying around rusty and dirty, why do that to an Arisaka ...

I use a piece of green nylon scrub pad in a split dowel in a cordless drill to swab out the chamber. It's pretty benign while getting things cleaned up. Once it's mechanically clean, oil it well with good gun oil and put it away. You can use a sleeve, but no gun case or bag as they will cause it to sweat and rust more ...

It's true you have an actual relic, and one with a story it can tell. But it needs some respect too. Do not let it deteriorate unnecessarily
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I forgot to mention that if you really want to find obscure Arisaka's, look for the British Rifle .256 Pattern 1900 (T-30) or the Pattern 1907 (T-38) which were purchased from the Japanese and issued UK Soldiers ...

Russia also bought a slew of Type 30's in 6.5mm (I think) and Mexico purchased a bunch in 7x57. Those have a Cactus stamped into the receiver
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So besides the variations issued to the Japanese Armed Services and Homeland Defense groups, there were more than a half million circulating in other nations armed forces ...

Once you step into the rabbit hole of Arisaka, you can crawl around to your hearts content and find bits and pieces of this all over
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