2010-2014 AWD Cars

[GMBoy]

Originally Posted By: FutureDoc
OK, with "reliability" are you looking for something that will last you 10-15 years and 200,000 miles with the lest issues or are you looking for something that will get you 50,000 with the fewest services/repairs because you will trade out quickly. The problem is that most "Luxury" brands, especially the Germans have a HUGE 50,000-60,000 mile service need. That is why a lot of folks dump them then. That is also why a lot of Luxury brands will offer the 50,000 mile no cost service. At 80-140K, expect BIG repair bills for wearing parts and general repair needed.

Since you are not talking about the new car, first 50,000 mile mark, I would ditch ALL German options. The Audi might be the best of that group so I included them.

1. Regardless of how you split it would be Lexus. If Reliability is #1, Lexus owns that market. Let Downside is that you will pay the "used Lexus/Toyota" premium and they are a bit ho-hum in the luxury-performance market. I don't recommend the IS. Not a good cruiser. Cramped. The LS is the other option but you will be at the top of your price range for a 10-13 model at the top of your mileage. Expect 40Kish for about 50-70K miles for a LS in this range.

2. Hyundai Genesis Sedan. Whomever said this was a sniper. OK, so because it says Hyundai on the keyfob, these things lose value faster than last weeks Sushi. The upside is that they are a fantastic value and will likely hold up better than their German counterparts. You can get a 2013 Hyundai Genesis for about $20,000... but the 2015 AWD models are around $30-35K with less than 20K miles.

3. Buick ... 4. Cadillac. Buick is better than a lot of other makes and I would strongly look at a Regal AWD loaded up. Heck, you will be able to get a NEW one in your price range. GM is hit or miss but that Regal is the other sleeper in the group and is reliable. Caddy is lurking in the background. Not great reliability but not painful to repair as the Germans. So you have quirky and inconsistant GM with Buick as Dr. Jekyll, to Caddy's Mr Hyde. Heck, at the end of the day, GM still make some of the most comfortable Highway cruisers. Period. I would rather be in an Impala than a 5 series, A6 or C class.

5. Audi is doing better for reliability in the low miles... those higher mile Audis are still problematic for repair and service.

6: Acura is still piddling around like a lost puppy, but Honda since 2009-today has fallen off their mark on reliability. If the SUV /the MDX was on the table, is "ok-ish" but anything Honda with a V6 and an Automatic should be treated as suspect. Otherwise they are going to be "better" than a lot of options but just don't expect the old 80-00s Honda reliability. The new DW fluids help, but still... I would find an loaded Accord and pocket the brand-markup cost.



I gotta hand it to you - that was a class A write up and you hit the nail on the head.

 

[4WD]

Ditto - I sometimes hire cars & drivers in Korea - they have those, BMW's, and Chrysler 300's - they were not up to par with BMW and not really any nicer than the top of the line 300.

 

[FutureDoc]

Originally Posted By: Pop_Rivit
She really wants a car-she's driven SUVs for years and wants something more like our STS. Although once she test drives a few, she may change her mind.

We plan to go looking and test driving over the next couple of weeks. Right now I'm leaning toward the CTS or BMW, but we'll find out what she really prefers.


Go drive the Buick Regal Turbo AWD. Just add it to the list. Consider it the "new car" to the use ones you are comparing it to as the Buick will be in your price range, come with a new car warranty,

I bet that the Regal will be more akin to the old STS than the current CTS. Cadillac is running away from its prior "feel". Completely different animal. The one difference is that while the Regal is a "mid-sized" sedan, I think the back seats were a bit small. Not sure if that matters, but the CTS might be just a hair larger.

You say reliability is #1 and then the top 2 choices are probably the lesser "reliable" choices available. Not the worst, but with reliability heavily weighted. CTS is a known problem child for some years... not that they can't glue a few together properly, but rather that the reliability is all over the place depending on the year. Reliability is just below average. Since the redesign was in '14, those early model cars are the worst for GM. The BMW is "ok", not "Fiat/Dodge" bad but not Lexus-level good. Among the German choices, they are in the middle, not the best nor the worse (Audi is better, Merc is lagging but getting a lot better). I will remind you that they are not cheap to keep running. So there is a high cost just to keep then at an average to slightly above average reliable status. If buying used, you are going to be absorbing those costs. So don't expect the 50,000-100,000 mile interval to be free from the BMW service department. They will have you in their clutches, where nickels and dimes have Grant and Franklin on them.

I don't see German cars brought up in your previous car history. It sounds like it is a mix of American/Subaru (don't know which SUVs you owned outside the outback and Durango) You might get that "German Service Interval" shock. Not a deal breaker,but some folks think "reliable" is never taking it in to the shop for anything... including preventive maintenance. If reliable is "not stranding you", but frequent PMs at a dealer/specialist is ok, no worries about BMW. You might not be happy when you have to take the Bimmer in to have it "programed" aka registered to accept a new battery. That "experience" would be my one worry. Some folks are fine with that. Others like my wife will enter the zombie-survival bunker if the tire-pressure monitoring light comes on... and if there is a really issue, they expect the dealer to be able to change out a transmission and re-wire a car for $50 (INCLUDING TAX!). Her requirements are #1 visibility, #2 reliability,and #3 inexpensive (#4 AWD). Thus: Outback

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: FutureDoc
The one difference is that while the Regal is a "mid-sized" sedan, I think the back seats were a bit small. Not sure if that matters, but the CTS might be just a hair larger.

On paper, Regal has 1" more of rear legroom. Front legroom and headroom is about the same. But overall passenger volume is about 1 cu ft smaller, compared to a 2013 CTS.

The CTS does have a longer wheelbase though, so I'd expect it to be a better hwy cruiser, but suspension tuning also plays into this, of course.

 

[Al]

The vehicles you named fall short in reliability, AWD capability , are more expensive, and will probably cost more than the Subaru OB. The OB in the last 3 years has an amazing ride. It passes the small overlap test where the ones above probably do not.
But its not your cup of tea so be it. If my wife were in the identical market she would defer to my judgment as long as the seats were comfortable. She gets the last word in that area.

 

[SEMI_287]

Don't forget the Chrysler 300 and Dodge Charger AWD models. The 300 is very well equipped and comfortable. The Charger being more sporty. The Pentastar V6 is an awesome little motor if the hemi isn't something you want.

 

[daves87rs]

Originally Posted By: SEMI_287
Don't forget the Chrysler 300 and Dodge Charger AWD models. The 300 is very well equipped and comfortable. The Charger being more sporty. The Pentastar V6 is an awesome little motor if the hemi isn't something you want.



Someone beat me to it....was thinking along the same lines too. And pretty sure the AWD runs through a few of the trim lines, so you do not have to end up with giant spoiler or 20 inch rims either! My neighbor has a 2013 Charger AWD, and she loves it. She simply likes how it handles and she can enjoy long trips in it...


Otherwise my vote would be for a CTS....those years tend to be pretty solid, and they handle quite well.

 

[dishdude]

Did anyone mention LaCrosse or XTS? Beautiful and great driving cars - both are available with AWD.

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: SatinSilver
Easy choice, 2013 BMW 3 series X drive. Here's ONE with low miles, AWD for $24k at Carmax. They seem to go for around the same price certified at the BMW dealer.

If that's not big enough then the 5 series comes into play. Here's a 2013 528 X drive with 42k miles for $27k. I'd guess one with 20k miles would be low to mid 30's.

The only issues I know of are some of the larger wheels on the performance models can sometimes crack by hitting large potholes/bumps and BMW offers a special insurance on them. The company treats it's employees very well including their retirees. Even dealership employees receive special perks when buying of one of their cars after they've been there a year. Most of the cars in BMW Financial parking lot are 3 series. Any non-BMW in the employee parking lot will receive regular flyers on the windshield encouraging them buy/lease a new BMW. All the cars in their lineup have perfect 50/50 weight distribution. I would think these would be the most reliable of the options mentioned.

Also plenty of positive discussion on the BMWs on here and the Accord forum. A fair amount of negative comments on the Accord forum about the other options esp with the Audi from some of the techs that works on them.



3 series AWD was my second thought, after an E-class diesel with 4matic.

The 3 series is ubiquitous, comfortable, a lot larger than it used to be, and if outfit with a lower-performance suspension and wheel/tire combo, will be a nice driver without the downsides of ultra-low profile tires.

That said, for the plains of Iowa, Im sort of at a loss for why AWD would be all that necessary, and coupled with the fact that AWD is great until a sedan, with intrinsically low ground clearance, just can't make it through the deep snow... Because otherwise, and if a "look at my status" car was unnecessary, Id say that a toyota avalon would be an ideal couch on wheels, and fit with snow tires, would do quite excellent.

But if we were going into the realm of higher stance vehicles (still worth a look regardless of initial inclination), Id have to say that MPGs aside, I was pretty impressed by the BMW x1 loaner I had a few months back. Not the most cargo space. Not a Durango in terms of room, for sure... But a higher stance, ability to perhaps take a bit more truck-like tire, and still have an "athletic" ride. Since she doesn't seem to want an SUV, this may be a good compromise, since while Im sure its status is formally "SUV", its a bit of a different animal.

The other one Id have to throw in the ring, though expensive, are the Denali versions of crew cab and Yukon trucks. Yes, I get it that she doesn't want another SUV. But they are NOT a durango... These should be every bit as posh as a Euro AWD vehicle, have a lot more local dealer support in the heartland, and also be a bit more utilitarian for other stuff that the Durango could do. Ditto for the cadillac version.

Assuming down my personal thought path that a Domestic truck is not really on the list, then Id say, how about the X5 and ML diesel SUVs? These give a bit higher MPG than the gasser versions, a lot more torque, and a good deal of space for people and cargo. They ARE more like the durango, so I get it that she may be opposed at first, but they are somewhat car-like, and may be decent options if she wants something Euro with a lot of extra space and comfort.

Regardless of choice, and certainly the same if going Euro car, the thing with the Euro vehicles especially, is that they are highly "coding" dependent. Even things like batteries are coded in when replaced. I get it that pops is smart with computers and software, and likes to DIY, but there needs to be an understanding of the necessities of the computer and coding capabilities for some things, and especially if one is to use the real OE software, it takes a good amount of time to learn its operation. Id suspect that in Iowa, a tech II is much more available...

 

[pandus13]

Pop_rivit/OP,
couple questions:
-what is your local dealer/independent shops presence for those brands in the area? can you talk to them a bit (since any inventory may have passed trough their shop/hands at some point....)
-you lived at your present place for at least a decade: what is the max snow you saw over the years? (on the un-plowed path)

 

[Andrew1972]

I peeked at consumer reports used vehicles to avoid. Various BMW and MB and Cadillac but it's specific to year and model(s).


One vehicle that was absolutely amazing IMHO was MB e class with Awd and not a used car to avoid. I know a few happy owners and this car offered great ownership and comfort for myself riding about.

The C class and BMW 3 series are nice but not true luxury cars. I think that class is affordable flash for lease.
Rl

 

[JTK]

Originally Posted By: Nick1994
At a reliability standpoint, I'd rather have a BMW over an Audi or Mercedes.


Could be.

At the end of the day, they're all the same class of vehicle that contain rare and expensive parts that likely require dealer only service. Try to find some AWD or adjustable suspension parts for a 10yr/old version of one of these vehicles. Same with the electronics.

Pretty much the reason 9/10 "buyers" of these vehicles lease and return them for another.

 

[JHZR2]

So what's the list looking like after some test driving????

 

[Wolf359]

Originally Posted By: madRiver
One vehicle that was absolutely amazing IMHO was MB e class with Awd and not a used car to avoid. I know a few happy owners and this car offered great ownership and comfort for myself riding about.

The C class and BMW 3 series are nice but not true luxury cars. I think that class is affordable flash for lease.
Rl


Yeah, the E class had more options than the C and cost just a little bit more. They also tend to be a bit more reliable. I got mine used 2 years ago and have spent about 1k so far in maintenance and repairs. If it weren't for the motor mounts going, probably would have been more like $500. Only reason I went with gasoline was because they didn't sell a lot of diesels and it has a few weird engine problems that no one but an MB mechanic will be able to figure out. The gasser is pretty straight forward.

I never really considered the Japanese brands because they don't normally have headlamp washers. It's not a real luxury car if it doesn't have headlamp washers.... At least until they went to LED's.