OK to use an SL oil ?

[iExcel]

I was cleaning the garage and found 3 gallons of Valvolone 10W30 SL rated oil.

I can't recall when they were acquired but the time stamp on the bottom says "NK 04 317 11:22". So I guess they were manufactured on the 317th day of 2004 at 11:22.

I'm thinking of using the oil in my 2010 Chevy (blended with SM/SN in my stash)but not sure if it's safe to do so. Any comments?

 

[JR]

use it with confindence. I am thirty and have oil in stash that old or older. and yes I use that oil.


-hawkeye

 

[BrocLuno]

As long as they did not freeze in between the time you bought them and now, no worries. Good enough for a 2010 GM engine I'm sure

To keep the add paks about the same, I'd use a Valvoline product as the add/blend. Napa has oil on sale (Napa Brand) and it's made by Valvoline (Ashland), so prolly a good fit and cheap enough...

You did not say what your stash oil is? Could be whole different chemistry ... So let's sort that out a bit more before going whole hog on this ...

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
As long as they did not freeze in between the time you bought them and now, no worries.


So what's the freezing point of a hydrocarbon mixture like motor oil?

 

[dave123]

Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
As long as they did not freeze in between the time you bought them and now, no worries. Good enough for a 2010 GM engine I'm sure

To keep the add paks about the same, I'd use a Valvoline product as the add/blend. Napa has oil on sale (Napa Brand) and it's made by Valvoline (Ashland), so prolly a good fit and cheap enough...

You did not say what your stash oil is? Could be whole different chemistry ... So let's sort that out a bit more before going whole hog on this ...
Please elaborate on what effects of below 32f would have on motor oil I really want to learn about this.

 

[BrocLuno]

Depends on the oil. Straight mineral base oils start to develop wax crystal formation and separation at around 10*F. Anything below 0*F in storage is a big cause for concern.

This is an older oil, so we just need to know if it got that cold? If it did not, there won't be any separation and so no need to re-heat before use. If there was, you'll need to bring it up to 150*F and stir to make sure any wax formations dissolve and return to the oil matrix.

The refiners all warn against freezing when storing oils. As long as they don't, they are good in the bottle/can for a long time. The time varies by who you talk to. 5 years, 10 years, some say indefinite ...

The other no-no is storage in direct sunlight. I don't quite get this one unless it's in a clear bottle ... In a can or a drum, it should not make any difference. But I guess all the plastic bottle are partially UV transparent ...

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
The refiners all warn against freezing when storing oils. As long as they don't, they are good in the bottle/can for a long time. The time varies by who you talk to. 5 years, 10 years, some say indefinite ...


Still what do you mean by freezing? You mean storing the oil anywhere (including presumably in the engine) where the temperature drops below freezing? So all the oil stored in my garage is in danger here in Wisconsin where the temperature can drop to -25 Fahrenheit?

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
Depends on the oil. Straight mineral base oils start to develop wax crystal formation and separation at around 10*F. Anything below 0*F in storage is a big cause for concern.


Ok, but zero is different than freezing. And who would be trying to pour straight weight oil into their engine at zero?

 

[BrocLuno]

It's not pour point. Where did that come from? It's separation in storage. Once it's happened, you won't know until after you start pouring even in summer temps. And at summer temps, you may not be aware of the separation unless watching closely ...

A waxy crystal emulsion may look like oil, but it will not perform nearly as well, especially on cold start after the change. So just checking to make sure this older oil has not frozen in the odd 12 years it's been on the shelf.

By it's nature it is not a 0W synthetic, so we have to assume it has some mineral base oils ... Maybe 50% (guess). So it could have had a reaction ... But if no 10*F in the garage where it was stored, good to go

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
It's not pour point. Where did that come from? It's separation in storage. Once it's happened, you won't know until after you start pouring even in summer temps. And at summer temps, you may not be aware of the separation unless watching closely ...

A waxy crystal emulsion may look like oil, but it will not perform nearly as well, especially on cold start after the change. So just checking to make sure this older oil has not frozen in the odd 12 years it's been on the shelf.

By it's nature it is not a 0W synthetic, so we have to assume it has some mineral base oils ... Maybe 50% (guess). So it could have had a reaction ... But if no 10*F in the garage where it was stored, good to go

I didn't mean pour point, I meant who would be trying to use straight weight oil at that temperature.

I'm just trying to get back to your original statement that it would be ok unless it froze. Since oil doesn't ever really freeze, I assumed that statement to mean that it got below the freezing point of water. The thing is that describes nearly all the motor oil in the upper 2/3 of the United States and all of Canada, and if that oil is now unusable that's quite a statement. That's all.

 

[dave123]

Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
It's not pour point. Where did that come from? It's separation in storage. Once it's happened, you won't know until after you start pouring even in summer temps. And at summer temps, you may not be aware of the separation unless watching closely ...

A waxy crystal emulsion may look like oil, but it will not perform nearly as well, especially on cold start after the change. So just checking to make sure this older oil has not frozen in the odd 12 years it's been on the shelf.

By it's nature it is not a 0W synthetic, so we have to assume it has some mineral base oils ... Maybe 50% (guess). So it could have had a reaction ... But if no 10*F in the garage where it was stored, good to go

Are you saying storage in the sump outside in temperatures of -10f siting a week and you'll have problems were talking this particular oil.

 

[Jetronic]

Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
Depends on the oil. Straight mineral base oils start to develop wax crystal formation and separation at around 10*F. Anything below 0*F in storage is a big cause for concern.

This is an older oil, so we just need to know if it got that cold? If it did not, there won't be any separation and so no need to re-heat before use. If there was, you'll need to bring it up to 150*F and stir to make sure any wax formations dissolve and return to the oil matrix.

The refiners all warn against freezing when storing oils. As long as they don't, they are good in the bottle/can for a long time. The time varies by who you talk to. 5 years, 10 years, some say indefinite ...

The other no-no is storage in direct sunlight. I don't quite get this one unless it's in a clear bottle ... In a can or a drum, it should not make any difference. But I guess all the plastic bottle are partially UV transparent ...


The oil will get to 150°F and mix the first time you drive the carafter pouring it in. I can't see it being an issue unless you do a change in the midst of a canadian winter, and then don't drive.

But it is ofcourse good practice to store products properly. I use my basements, which has the most stable temperatures of the whole house (around 55-60°F) and no sunlight whatsoever.

I once poured some clear polyolester in a used water bottle, and even while sitting in the house that oil turned yellow very quickly, like a vegetable oil.

 

[BrocLuno]

Maybe, as I said, it's oil dependent (formula). How much mineral oil is in this SL formula?

If you can find the PDS for that oil by SKU or something it will tell you the range it's good for.

Baring the PDS data, if you are going to have -10*F nights during this OCI, I would wait until the spring change to run it. But that's just me ... Not that I would not use it. We have HDEO in drums that is older and we use it in some tractors. But I would want to know the operating range before pouring it for a Canadian winter

 

[Jetronic]

Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
The refiners all warn against freezing when storing oils. As long as they don't, they are good in the bottle/can for a long time. The time varies by who you talk to. 5 years, 10 years, some say indefinite ...


Still what do you mean by freezing? You mean storing the oil anywhere (including presumably in the engine) where the temperature drops below freezing? So all the oil stored in my garage is in danger here in Wisconsin where the temperature can drop to -25 Fahrenheit?


he's talking about gelation, where an oil is cooled very slowly and starts to "freeze over" at much higher temperatures than the regular pour point suggests. once heated, the oil becomes liquid again, but isn't it's old self yet.

Used oil can get this behaviour above 32°F, I've seen 60°F mentioned in severe cases. Engines have died over this before the mechanism was understood.

 

[gallydif]

The current H1HM on shelves is SL. Use with confidence.

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: Jetronic
Used oil can get this behaviour above 32°F, I've seen 60°F mentioned in severe cases. Engines have died over this before the mechanism was understood.


Wow, now I have to worry about the oil on a cool summer evening.

 

[Jetronic]

I think the issue has been mitigated since 1983....

 

[iExcel]

In my stash, I have a variety of BITOG oils here and there.

PYB, QSGB, FS, VWB, GTX, QSUD + Castrol Edge

All oils are 5W30 (SM/SN) as both my vehicles call for that.



The old oil was stored in the garage where during winter time it is usually between -10C to 1C. Not that cold, so I guess it should be fine?

Also, I will plan on using the old oil next year during the summer time (Apr - Oct) when the temperature here is anywhere around 20-35C. This past summer was hot and it had been 35-40C for a couple weeks! But better hot than cold!!

For the winter, I'll continue to use my SM/SN 5W30 with a little bit syn in it.

Since the Chevy's sump takes 5.5 qts, I'm thinking of dumping 1 gallon of this old oil and add 1.5 qts of FS as they happen to be in quarts. Maybe I can put 4 qts of SL oil and 1.5 qts of SN oil to make it more or less an SM'ish oil?

 

[Mr Nice]

I still have some SL rated Mobil 1.

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: Jetronic
he's talking about gelation, where an oil is cooled very slowly and starts to "freeze over" at much higher temperatures than the regular pour point suggests. once heated, the oil becomes liquid again, but isn't it's old self yet.

Used oil can get this behaviour above 32°F, I've seen 60°F mentioned in severe cases. Engines have died over this before the mechanism was understood.


Is that the same as the cloud point? That was the test we ran in college, it may be the same.

But it's not a problem today correct? So all the warnings in this thread are no longer applicable? I can still start my old BMW at -25 F with the usual Castrol 0W-40 and not worry?