Michelin Pilot Sport AS3+ or Continental DWS06 ?

[NissanMaxima]

Hi all:

I need some new tires for my 2015 Corolla S+ before winter hits in Colorado. Owner's manual specifies 215 45 R17 87W. I was surprised by the W requirement on a Corolla and called Toyota who said I should stick with that speed rating. I've narrowed down the choice to the above mentioned tires. Both get good reviews on TireRack but the Continental tires seem to have the slight edge in terms of snow and ice performance which is important to me for winter driving. I'm not as concerned about other performance handling specs - I just want a quality all season W rated tire (per OEM specs) that will perform well in winter driving. My first inclination was to go with Michelin since I have been happy with them in the past and they are a huge company. I've never owned Continental tires before but am intrigued by the DWS (dry,wet,snow) design, the alignment wear indicators, and of course the edge TireRack gives them in terms of winter performance.

Thanks

 

[Quattro Pete]

Both of these are UHP all-season tires, which means their winter performance is marginal at best.

If I were you, I'd be looking at a less performance oriented tire category.... maybe grand touring.

 

[NissanMaxima]

Thanks: TireRack gave them both pretty high scores for snow and ice categories and at least as high scores in these categories as lower speed rated tires. I was under the impression their 0-10 scoring system was consistent regardless of speed rating category in order to make direct comparisons across different speed categories but perhaps I'm wrong.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Unfortunately, you cannot compare TR rankings across different performance categories.

Does your corolla really mandate a W speed rating?

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Both of these are UHP all-season tires, which means their winter performance is marginal at best.

If I were you, I'd be looking at a less performance oriented tire category.... maybe grand touring.

Agreed.

OP, what you really should do is keep a separate set of cheapo rims with legit winter tires for the winter months, and run one of the tires you mentioned for the other three seasons. In that scenario, the Michelin Pilot Sport AS3+ would be a slam-dunk as your three-season tire.

Barring that, though... if snow traction is a priority, then as QP said, you'd probably be best served by a less performance-oriented tire category.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Unfortunately, you cannot compare TR rankings across different performance categories.

^ This.

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Does your corolla really mandate a W speed rating?

I'd go for the highest available speed rating, regardless. Better construction.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
I'd go for the highest available speed rating, regardless. Better construction.

Yeah, but in his case, that "W" probably pushes him into the UHP category, so we're back to square one.

I very much agree with this advice you've given though:
Quote:
OP, what you really should do is keep a separate set of cheapo rims with legit winter tires for the winter months, and run one of the tires you mentioned for the other three seasons. In that scenario, the Michelin Pilot Sport AS3+ would be a slam-dunk as your three-season tire.

That is exactly what I do on my 530i and on the Q5.

 

[NissanMaxima]

Thanks Quattro Pete: I just called TireRack and they confirm that you cannot compare the scores across different performance categories. Thanks for the education.

My owner's manual indicates there were three tire/wheel options apparently available on the 2015 Corolla:
195/65R15/91S
205/55R16/89H
215/45R17/87W

I have the third option which I now realize is probably because I opted for S+ with alloy wheels. I love alloy wheels primarily because I got tired of replacing hubcaps over the years!

I think the Continental is probably my best bet. I watched several youtube videos and they are pretty impressive.

 

[RooflessVW]

DWS all day, no question.

 

[Astro14]

I've gone through a set of Continental DWS on a Volvo and the Michelin AS3 are on my Mercedes.

They're NOT winter tires. They're decent performance tires why don't completely suck in the snow. Of the two, the Continentals will be better in snow. The AS3 will have better ultimate dry grip and wet grip and a more sporting feel.

But in Colorado, I strongly encourage real winter tires, or all seasons balanced more on the snow side of the equation. These are performance tires and they are better in snow than pure summer tires...but that's like saying your leather soled loafers are better in snow than your Teva sandals...it ain't sayin' much...

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
I'd go for the highest available speed rating, regardless. Better construction.

Yeah, but in his case, that "W" probably pushes him into the UHP category, so we're back to square one.

Ah, good point. Totally agree that type is more important than speed rating.

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
I very much agree with this advice you've given though:
Quote:
OP, what you really should do is keep a separate set of cheapo rims with legit winter tires for the winter months, and run one of the tires you mentioned for the other three seasons. In that scenario, the Michelin Pilot Sport AS3+ would be a slam-dunk as your three-season tire.

That is exactly what I do on my 530i and on the Q5.

I'm sorely tempted to switch to the AS3+ myself.

 

[Wolf359]

I also have the A/S 3 on my Mercedes, it has a higher load rating than the Continentials. I think the DWS are new, the older ones used to be weaker and pop tires all the time.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
I'm sorely tempted to switch to the AS3+ myself.

I did want to try the AS3+ myself, but I was in need of tires STAT, and couldn't wait for them to hit the market, so I ended up with Bridgestone RE970 instead. No complaints with the B'stones either - plenty of performance for my needs, but I do hear the AS3+ is the cat's meow when it comes to UHP tires.

I did have the DWS on another car and was not impressed - mushy sidewalls and very mediocre winter capabilities. But from what I've heard, the DWS06 is much improved.

 

[Andrew1972]

I'd peek at an h rated tire.

The top speed of your corolla is a miserly 114mph and h rated is 130 mph.

The w rated tired have abysmal winter traction so at best conti tires are best of crop compared to peers however below average. I had conti DWS and best thing and winter traction was mediocre in same size on our 2005 legacy turbo wagon.

I'd suggest pirelli P7 centar.

 

[slacktide_bitog]

My first suggestion would be the Dunlop Signature HP.

Performance can only be compared against the same performance category.

Note that performance category (UHP, grand touring, etc) is not the same thing as speed rating (H, V, W, etc).

Grand touring tires will almost definitely be better in winter than UHP tires. many of these are in fact available with a W speed rating. The Sumitomo HTR Enhance LX is available in your size and W-rated.

If price is a concern, and you still want a performance tire, consider the General G-Max and Falken Ziex ZE950 (or Sumitomo HTR AS P02). General is made/owned by Conti, and it is a lower price, plus there's a $70 rebate going on right now, making the G-Max a very good deal.

One more thing to note: if winter performance is a priority, consider a second set of winter tires. But should that not be feasible for some reason, check out the "all weather tires" which are all-season tires that are rated for winter traction with the amountain-and-snowflake symbol (they can also be described as winter tires that are usable year-round). Examples include the Nokian WRG3, Toyo Celsius, and Vredestein Quatrac 5.

And with winter tires, or anything with the mountain/snowflake symbol, it is OK to use a lower speed rating because they're legally considered winter tires. Shops are more willing to install lower speed ratings on winter tires because it is understood that speeds are lower in the snow and cold, and tires just don't get as hot when it's cold outside. Therefore, if you use the all-weather tires I described earlier, you don't need the W-rating.

But my top recommendations for you are the Nokian WRG3 and Dunlop Signature HP, with the G-Max being a close third if price is a factor.

 

[antonmnster]

My as/3s are nearing the end of their one year life on my 335i at 40,000 miles. Actually mounted a set of used rears today as I run a staggered setup and can't rotate.

They are pretty good. They are def not pilot super sports, but they also last quite a while longer. They're a bit louder.

Had DWSs on an Audi and found them to be softer and quieter, with a lot more flex leading to very squishy handling.

The as/3 is also NOT a snow tire. I have dedicated snows, but when the snow fell last fall I left the as/3s on just to see how it would go. Let's just say not well, and I renewed my Blizzaks. (Which of course never really got used properly thanks to a snowless winter/El Nino.)

Because steel wheels are so easy to come by on a Corolla, I'd also vouch for a dedicated set of snows. MN and CO winters are different, but I'd be queasy relying on all seasons.

 

[raytseng]

If as you say you are not concerned about other performance characteristics, then the DWS is your choice between the two as shown by the TR test.
Yea it won't be as good as the worst winter tire; but it's the best of the turds; and won't turn hard as a rock in cold weather.

If it makes you feel better watch a few youtube videos searching on "winter Dws" and people will show you that you can confidentally handle light snow and ice.

Another solution is if you are worried is to just buy a set of chains. If it gets that bad maybe you don't want to go out anyway...

 

[TinyVoices]

Definitely General RT43. We live in Denver and have these on my GF's Matrix. Aside from being a very good all round tire, they lead their class by a mile in snow performance. No brainer.

 

[NissanMaxima]

Hi all:

My apologies for reviving this thread after a few months. I've been dealing with some other pressing issues that life can throw at us.

So we had our first winter storm here in Colorado so I need to do something about tires. Although I don't want to incur the expense, I am considering a second set of real snow tires and steel rims. Soooo... more questions....

1. If I decide based on budget reasons to just stick with the best all season or all weather (snowflake) tire, what is my very best choice if I really want to stick with the W rated tire based on what Toyota told me? Are the DWS06 still a decent (albeit not as good as 3 season plus snow tire option) choice?
2. I read on Tire Rack about using a smaller wheel diameter for snow tire use. Their explanation about why to do this didn't make much sense to me. My stock OEM alloy rims are 17". Should I stick with another set of 17" rims or step down a size?
3. What does the board think about studded snow tires? I read an article on TireRack and they say studded tires really don't offer much of an advantage over non-studded tires but I can't help but thinking the studs would be really good for icy roads - we get a mix of snow and icy roads here for sure. I also wonder if studded tires might actually last longer as you have the studs in contact with the road vs. all rubber.
4. Does the board have a consensus on a three season tire for me if I go this route? Should I stick with the W rated Cont. DWS? I do need to be sure whatever 3 season tire I have will at least suffice in case I put the snow tires on late, or take them off early and there is a storm.
5. How many miles do snow tires or studded snow tires usually last? I figure we will put about 4k miles per winter season. Can I expect at least 12k miles out of good snow tires or studded snow tires which would be three season? I understand once the first few 32nds of tread are removed from a snow tire, the traction drops dramatically.
6. Good to excellent snow or studded snow tire for me? Do I need to look for W rated again?

 

[edyvw]

OK, where in CO are you? That is the most important question before we can chip in seriously. CO is very tricky, and this winter is very mild with real lack of snow!
Also, are you skiing? How often are you going to mountains?
One thing is: forget A/S tires here. They will do, you will think: oh what a great choice I made, saved money. You wil go to work at 60 degrees, and while at work foot of snow will fall, and temperature will go down to 0.