Watkins glen Indy Car

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Just a few thoughts I had after watching the race.
1. It was more enjoyable than the F1 race I watched in the morning. Even with the economy run at the end at least there was some racing
going on.
2. It seemed like it took forever for the Safety personnel to arrive after a incident.
3. Why do they have the Mario driving the 2 seater Indy car? It is going so obvious slow the track workers Dodge pickup trucks were blowing
by like Mario was standing still. It is just an embarrassment to have it out there.
 
I would rather see a different format. Kit car racing does not allow teams to innovate. Some of the races are reduced to least mistakes and luck.

I'd like to see cars of different potentials going at it. I'd like to see a series where they give the teams a restricter plate calibrated for say 600hp, any engine, a minimum weight of 2K pounds and let them have at it. "Run what your brung".
 
It seems all racing in this country, (both NASCAR and Indy Car), is dying a slow death on the vine. The stands are all but empty for most of these races. They used to be filled to capacity, and turned away fans at the gate. No longer. Too much rules and nonsense, not enough action. Going back to the 70's and 80's it was the sport to be around. Action everywhere. Now it's something to flip channels to during commercials, to get a quick catch up. Sad indeed.
 
1. The economy runs are inexcusable. After a great race, the final segment of the 100th Indy 500 was a disgrace with a "danika" winner. Texas shows what a great series it can be.

2. Road course vs oval. Indy car is the only series whose medical personnel follow from race to race and they're the best in the business.

3. Haha, really? Mario is being told how fast he can go. An accident with a civilian would be a liability and PR nightmare. Besides, the contest winners WANT Mario.
 
Originally Posted By: Indydriver
The economy runs are inexcusable.


This I could not agree more with. Trying to save fuel with a race car is idiotic. Give them all they want. If I want to witness economy, I'll watch a Prius drive through my neighborhood.
 
Originally Posted By: billt460
Originally Posted By: Indydriver
The economy runs are inexcusable.


This I could not agree more with. Trying to save fuel with a race car is idiotic. Give them all they want. If I want to witness economy, I'll watch a Prius drive through my neighborhood.

I think the commentators for Indy need to explain and keep up with various strategies the teams are using. In F1 they do a good job and I can keep track of who's doing what, but in Indycar I don't often know what's going on and who I should be watching for.
I do like the spec racing though, everyone has a chance and its a better show of driver skills. I suppose you could make indycar like a professional Formula SAE series and somehow really equalize the amount of resources they can use, but the established teams with lots of money won't be interested.
 
The Honda 2 set deal is a contest. They have other drivers besides Mario. I have seen Arie Luyendyk and Little Al drive it before.

The Holmatro safety Team is the best out there. I have seen them get to crashed cars before they stop moving. James Hinchcliffe and Mikhail Aleshin wouldn't be alive if it weren't for them.

The fuel economy run at the end stemmed from the timing of the last caution.
 
Did anyone watch this race? I not talking about the Indy 500. I'm just saying that this race was
more enjoyable to watch than the Italian GP I watched in the morning.

1. If you win a race by using intelligent fuel strategy you are winning like a girl I guess that is what the "danika' win means.
I always thought it better to slow down and win than run out of fuel by driving like a real "man".

2. The Holmatro safety team may be the best in the business but on Sunday it took them over 2 1/2 minutes to reach to reach Aleshin after his crash. The accident site is less 1/2 mile from the pit area. There is no way it should have taken them that long to get there.
Maybe they have been super fast at other races but on Sunday they were slow. Past performance aside they were slow on Sunday.

3. Yes I know that there are other drivers for the Honda powered 2 seated Indy car. And I know that Mario or the other drivers can't really go fast for many reasons. But if you are going to have a pretend race car at least pretend to go fast.
 
Originally Posted By: Reggaemon
If you win a race by using intelligent fuel strategy you are winning like a girl I guess that is what the "danika' win means.


It refers to Danica Patrick's only win in her career. She beat Hélio Castroneves in Japan, in an Indy Car race when Castroneves ran out of fuel. She never would have caught him otherwise. It had absolutely nothing to do with better "fuel strategy".
 
Originally Posted By: billt460
Originally Posted By: Reggaemon
If you win a race by using intelligent fuel strategy you are winning like a girl I guess that is what the "danika' win means.


It refers to Danica Patrick's only win in her career. She beat Hélio Castroneves in Japan, in an Indy Car race when Castroneves ran out of fuel. She never would have caught him otherwise. It had absolutely nothing to do with better "fuel strategy".


I'm not a Danica fan but she pitted on the same lap as Castroneves and made her fuel last longer. The objective of racing is to reach a certain distance as fast as possible. In Japan, Danica was able to utilize her limited resources to beat Helio. In Indy, Rossi was able to put on an amazing drive to produce a high average speed without wasting fuel. Racer did a great article on just how amazing this was.

The only way to end economy runs would be to throw a caution at a set point and force everyone to pit for fuel.... no thanks.
 
Originally Posted By: 09_GXP
I'm not a Danica fan but she pitted on the same lap as Castroneves and made her fuel last longer. The objective of racing is to reach a certain distance as fast as possible. In Japan, Danica was able to utilize her limited resources to beat Helio. In Indy, Rossi was able to put on an amazing drive to produce a high average speed without wasting fuel.


The object of ANY race is the best driver with the best car wins. That didn't happen with either Rossi or Patrick. "Fuel strategy" 90% of the time amounts to pure luck, nothing more. No one knows when a yellow is going to come out. Or if a tank is filled to maximum capacity during a pit stop lasting but a few seconds. It's one of the reasons F-1 has done away with refueling, along with safety. Patrick and Rossi both got lucky, period. Proof of that is Danica hasn't won a race since, and most likely never will. Her skill level isn't there. Neither is Rossi's. He'll NEVER be an Indy Car champion.... Ever.

And Danica, unlike many of her female predecessors, has always had good equipment provided by the best teams in the sport. She hasn't done a thing with any of it. Rossi was a Formula 1 washout. He got lucky at Indy. Everything went his way. I'm not saying either of them didn't "deserve" to win. But as Clint Eastwood so eloquently said in "Unforgiven", "Deserve has nothing to do with it". A drivers skill is measured by his talent to be able to drive as fast as possible in every conceivable weather and track condition. And WIN as a result. All of this screwing around with fuel does is deprive that talent from showing. A bit like giving a lesser swimmer fins to compete against Michael Phelps.
 
Originally Posted By: billt460

The object of ANY race is the best driver with the best car wins.

A drivers skill is measured by his talent to be able to drive as fast as possible in every conceivable weather and track condition. And WIN as a result. All of this screwing around with fuel does is deprive that talent from showing.


We just have different ways of defining best. There is a lot more to being a driver than turning faster laps than everyone else. Even in Sprint races you have to ensure that the equipment lasts the race. To me having to drive intelligently to keep brake pads from overheating in a sprint race is the same as saving fuel to reach the finish from the last pit stop. Yes I could go 110% every lap but then my brakes (fuel) would fade (run out) and my total time would be slower and I would lose. However, by driving 90% my brakes (fuel) will last and I'll beat the drivers that ran too hard.

You do not earn a win by being the best driver with the best car. You earn the checkered flag by getting there quicker than everyone else, however that may be. Rossi and Danica each took a strategy that almost everyone else had the opportunity to take but did not. They (the entire team) figured out a way to finish the way faster than everyone else.
 
Originally Posted By: 09_GXP
We just have different ways of defining best. There is a lot more to being a driver than turning faster laps than everyone else. Even in Sprint races you have to ensure that the equipment lasts the race. To me having to drive intelligently to keep brake pads from overheating in a sprint race is the same as saving fuel to reach the finish from the last pit stop. Yes I could go 110% every lap but then my brakes (fuel) would fade (run out) and my total time would be slower and I would lose. However, by driving 90% my brakes (fuel) will last and I'll beat the drivers that ran too hard.

You do not earn a win by being the best driver with the best car. You earn the checkered flag by getting there quicker than everyone else, however that may be. Rossi and Danica each took a strategy that almost everyone else had the opportunity to take but did not. They (the entire team) figured out a way to finish the way faster than everyone else.


If it played as big a part as you claim, why aren't either of them winning more races? Danica has been around forever. She has won once in her career. She most likely will never win again. And it isn't going to matter with Rossi. He'll never win another Indy Car race. Neither of them have the skill. With Rossi I'll give him somewhat of a break with his ride. It's nowhere the quality that the Penske drivers enjoy. But even that doesn't matter, because if he switched cars with Castroneves, he would still beat him. But Danica has no excuse. She has always had, and still has, some of the best equipment obtainable. And it isn't going to matter how she uses it, because she doesn't possess the skill to use it effectively. The bottom line is the top drivers and teams are as good or better at fuel and brake "management" as these lower rated drivers are. It all comes down to luck for a lesser skilled driver to win. And skill will always account for more, because luck always runs out.
 
To be clear, I'm not calling them great drivers, better than everyone else, etc... They each were able to find a way to win with the given circumstances. The same circumstances that everyone else had. Some drivers are a more complete package and can win with some speed bumps others need a more perfect set of circumstances.

You prefer to see a driver win and pure speed and that is fine. I enjoy following the minutiae and seeing how underdogs are able to win and then hopefully apply the lessons to my own racing.
 
Originally Posted By: 09_GXP
The only way to end economy runs would be to throw a caution at a set point and force everyone to pit for fuel.... no thanks.


I remember when ChampCar tried that. They have required "pit windows" that pretty much negated fuel conservation runs. Ended up screwing Michael Andretti out of a win in Surfers Paradise. There was a FCY for massive rain and they kept the cars parading around past the required pit window.

FWIW I literally worshiped the land that ChampCar walked on. They could do no wrong in my eyes and I still firmly believe that Paul Tracy won the 2002 Indy 500.
 
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