I am experimenting making an oil undercoating using a combination of 100% petroleum toilet bowl wax and bar and chain oil mixed together. I was reading about texaco rust proof compound L and some people mentioned it contained 1-3% stearic acid. I can buy stearic acid on Ebay so I though about adding some to my homemade mix. My question is is the 1-3% stearic acid measured by weight or volume? Also is there something else or something better then stearic acid I can add to my mix to help neutralize the rusty frame and body I will be spraying over without the acid corroding the metal? Thanks
Making my own oil undercoating question
- Thread starter joegreen
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Why not just buy a rust proofing oil from a company that knows what they are doing.
Would you buy cheap motor oil and then add aditives to it hoping to make an oil as good as Pennzoil Plantium or Mobil 1?
Would you buy cheap motor oil and then add aditives to it hoping to make an oil as good as Pennzoil Plantium or Mobil 1?
Hmmmmmm.
Fluid Film, or the Amsoil stuff if you want something thicker.
Fluid Film, or the Amsoil stuff if you want something thicker.
Stearic acid derived from fats.You could probably get similar effect by adding some tallow to your recipe.
Its also an ingredient in candle-making so its possible there's already some in your toilet wax stuff.
Although its technically an acid I doubt it'll lower pH enough to be a source of corrosion, since its very weak and has very low solubility in water.
Its also an ingredient in candle-making so its possible there's already some in your toilet wax stuff.
Although its technically an acid I doubt it'll lower pH enough to be a source of corrosion, since its very weak and has very low solubility in water.
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JHZR2
Staff member
My concern, especially if you're using it on your w123, is the ability to soften the rubber undercoating that came from the factory.
As a polar molecule, it should aid in bonding highly hydrophobic, long waxy molecules to a metal surface. Makes sense to me I guess.
I applaud you on making your own mix. I think I'd go for more oil and lanolin, less toilet bowl wax, personally. IMO the wax can trap moisture underneath.
As a polar molecule, it should aid in bonding highly hydrophobic, long waxy molecules to a metal surface. Makes sense to me I guess.
I applaud you on making your own mix. I think I'd go for more oil and lanolin, less toilet bowl wax, personally. IMO the wax can trap moisture underneath.
Originally Posted By: JHZR2
My concern, especially if you're using it on your w123, is the ability to soften the rubber undercoating that came from the factory.
As a polar molecule, it should aid in bonding highly hydrophobic, long waxy molecules to a metal surface. Makes sense to me I guess.
I applaud you on making your own mix. I think I'd go for more oil and lanolin, less toilet bowl wax, personally. IMO the wax can trap moisture underneath.
I am not using it on my w123. It will be used on my Chevy and a ford ranger. My mix of wax and oil is gel like and is able to be sprayed via undercoating gun. I stuck my mix into the freezer and it didn't harden to a solid wax so I don't think it will trap any moisture. It's basically the consistency of grease. What about the stearic acid is that measured by volume or weight? Do you think it's a good idea to use or use something else?
My concern, especially if you're using it on your w123, is the ability to soften the rubber undercoating that came from the factory.
As a polar molecule, it should aid in bonding highly hydrophobic, long waxy molecules to a metal surface. Makes sense to me I guess.
I applaud you on making your own mix. I think I'd go for more oil and lanolin, less toilet bowl wax, personally. IMO the wax can trap moisture underneath.
I am not using it on my w123. It will be used on my Chevy and a ford ranger. My mix of wax and oil is gel like and is able to be sprayed via undercoating gun. I stuck my mix into the freezer and it didn't harden to a solid wax so I don't think it will trap any moisture. It's basically the consistency of grease. What about the stearic acid is that measured by volume or weight? Do you think it's a good idea to use or use something else?
Originally Posted By: joegreen
What about the stearic acid is that measured by volume or weight? Do you think it's a good idea to use or use something else?
You can obviously measure it by either volume or weight. If you want to follow your source ref, do whatever they did, but your other ingredients probably aren't the same so it probably doesn't matter much. 1-3% is a fair range, so it probably doesn't matter much to them either. Perhaps they are using a crude source which varies in its stearic acid content.
I'd do it by volume because its easier.
As to whether its a good idea, it makes sense, but so would lots of other polar organics. As I said, I'd use something cruder like tallow or crude lanolin (if you can get it). I doubt there's much advantage in using pure stearic acid in this application and I'd guess it'd add cost.
I use a mix of diesel fuel, hydraulic or motor oil and vegetable oil, roughly 1:1:2 by volume last time. Seems to work, but your stuff sounds like it might be better.
What about the stearic acid is that measured by volume or weight? Do you think it's a good idea to use or use something else?
You can obviously measure it by either volume or weight. If you want to follow your source ref, do whatever they did, but your other ingredients probably aren't the same so it probably doesn't matter much. 1-3% is a fair range, so it probably doesn't matter much to them either. Perhaps they are using a crude source which varies in its stearic acid content.
I'd do it by volume because its easier.
As to whether its a good idea, it makes sense, but so would lots of other polar organics. As I said, I'd use something cruder like tallow or crude lanolin (if you can get it). I doubt there's much advantage in using pure stearic acid in this application and I'd guess it'd add cost.
I use a mix of diesel fuel, hydraulic or motor oil and vegetable oil, roughly 1:1:2 by volume last time. Seems to work, but your stuff sounds like it might be better.
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Originally Posted By: Ducked
Originally Posted By: joegreen
What about the stearic acid is that measured by volume or weight? Do you think it's a good idea to use or use something else?
You can obviously measure it by either volume or weight. If you want to follow your source ref, do whatever they did, but your other ingredients probably aren't the same so it probably doesn't matter much. 1-3% is a fair range, so it probably doesn't matter much to them either. Perhaps they are using a crude source which varies in its stearic acid content.
I'd do it by volume because its easier.
As to whether its a good idea, it makes sense, but so would lots of other polar organics. As I said, I'd use something cruder like tallow or crude lanolin (if you can get it). I doubt there's much advantage in using pure stearic acid in this application and I'd guess it'd add cost.
I use a mix of diesel fuel, hydraulic or motor oil and vegetable oil, roughly 1:1:2 by volume last time. Seems to work, but your stuff sounds like it might be better.
I tried mixing diesel with it last time but I found the formula to be thicker and longer lasting without the diesel. After the diesel evaporated there was not much waxy oil left behind. I used the diesel mix last time because my old oil undercoating gun had a really small pickup tube so it couldn't pick up to thick of a formula. My new undercoating gun has a 5/16 pickup tube that allows me to pick up an almost grease like formula which I prefer.
Originally Posted By: joegreen
What about the stearic acid is that measured by volume or weight? Do you think it's a good idea to use or use something else?
You can obviously measure it by either volume or weight. If you want to follow your source ref, do whatever they did, but your other ingredients probably aren't the same so it probably doesn't matter much. 1-3% is a fair range, so it probably doesn't matter much to them either. Perhaps they are using a crude source which varies in its stearic acid content.
I'd do it by volume because its easier.
As to whether its a good idea, it makes sense, but so would lots of other polar organics. As I said, I'd use something cruder like tallow or crude lanolin (if you can get it). I doubt there's much advantage in using pure stearic acid in this application and I'd guess it'd add cost.
I use a mix of diesel fuel, hydraulic or motor oil and vegetable oil, roughly 1:1:2 by volume last time. Seems to work, but your stuff sounds like it might be better.
I tried mixing diesel with it last time but I found the formula to be thicker and longer lasting without the diesel. After the diesel evaporated there was not much waxy oil left behind. I used the diesel mix last time because my old oil undercoating gun had a really small pickup tube so it couldn't pick up to thick of a formula. My new undercoating gun has a 5/16 pickup tube that allows me to pick up an almost grease like formula which I prefer.
Originally Posted By: joegreen
Originally Posted By: Ducked
Originally Posted By: joegreen
What about the stearic acid is that measured by volume or weight? Do you think it's a good idea to use or use something else?
You can obviously measure it by either volume or weight. If you want to follow your source ref, do whatever they did, but your other ingredients probably aren't the same so it probably doesn't matter much. 1-3% is a fair range, so it probably doesn't matter much to them either. Perhaps they are using a crude source which varies in its stearic acid content.
I'd do it by volume because its easier.
As to whether its a good idea, it makes sense, but so would lots of other polar organics. As I said, I'd use something cruder like tallow or crude lanolin (if you can get it). I doubt there's much advantage in using pure stearic acid in this application and I'd guess it'd add cost.
I use a mix of diesel fuel, hydraulic or motor oil and vegetable oil, roughly 1:1:2 by volume last time. Seems to work, but your stuff sounds like it might be better.
I tried mixing diesel with it last time but I found the formula to be thicker and longer lasting without the diesel. After the diesel evaporated there was not much waxy oil left behind. I used the diesel mix last time because my old oil undercoating gun had a really small pickup tube so it couldn't pick up to thick of a formula. My new undercoating gun has a 5/16 pickup tube that allows me to pick up an almost grease like formula which I prefer.
I don't have any spray equipment, so I use a plant sprayer. This means I have to use a thin mix, which probably leaves less long-term residue. OTOH it may be more penetrative, which may be more important. It does seem to creep along seams quite well.
Originally Posted By: Ducked
Originally Posted By: joegreen
What about the stearic acid is that measured by volume or weight? Do you think it's a good idea to use or use something else?
You can obviously measure it by either volume or weight. If you want to follow your source ref, do whatever they did, but your other ingredients probably aren't the same so it probably doesn't matter much. 1-3% is a fair range, so it probably doesn't matter much to them either. Perhaps they are using a crude source which varies in its stearic acid content.
I'd do it by volume because its easier.
As to whether its a good idea, it makes sense, but so would lots of other polar organics. As I said, I'd use something cruder like tallow or crude lanolin (if you can get it). I doubt there's much advantage in using pure stearic acid in this application and I'd guess it'd add cost.
I use a mix of diesel fuel, hydraulic or motor oil and vegetable oil, roughly 1:1:2 by volume last time. Seems to work, but your stuff sounds like it might be better.
I tried mixing diesel with it last time but I found the formula to be thicker and longer lasting without the diesel. After the diesel evaporated there was not much waxy oil left behind. I used the diesel mix last time because my old oil undercoating gun had a really small pickup tube so it couldn't pick up to thick of a formula. My new undercoating gun has a 5/16 pickup tube that allows me to pick up an almost grease like formula which I prefer.
I don't have any spray equipment, so I use a plant sprayer. This means I have to use a thin mix, which probably leaves less long-term residue. OTOH it may be more penetrative, which may be more important. It does seem to creep along seams quite well.
Originally Posted By: Ducked
I don't have any spray equipment, so I use a plant sprayer. This means I have to use a thin mix, which probably leaves less long-term residue. OTOH it may be more penetrative, which may be more important. It does seem to creep along seams quite well.
How is that working out for you? I'm in the same boat as you and I've thought about using a cheap plant sprayer but without the proper spray equipment it's hard to spray inside frames/body panels. It's only good as a basic surface spray. To really get inside the frame/panels nicely you need a high pressure sprayer with an atomizing nozzle sized for the viscosity of the fluid you intend on pumping.
I've also heard of people using boiled linseed oil which you can get from the hardware store.
I don't have any spray equipment, so I use a plant sprayer. This means I have to use a thin mix, which probably leaves less long-term residue. OTOH it may be more penetrative, which may be more important. It does seem to creep along seams quite well.
How is that working out for you? I'm in the same boat as you and I've thought about using a cheap plant sprayer but without the proper spray equipment it's hard to spray inside frames/body panels. It's only good as a basic surface spray. To really get inside the frame/panels nicely you need a high pressure sprayer with an atomizing nozzle sized for the viscosity of the fluid you intend on pumping.
I've also heard of people using boiled linseed oil which you can get from the hardware store.
Originally Posted By: nobb
Originally Posted By: Ducked
I don't have any spray equipment, so I use a plant sprayer. This means I have to use a thin mix, which probably leaves less long-term residue. OTOH it may be more penetrative, which may be more important. It does seem to creep along seams quite well.
How is that working out for you? I'm in the same boat as you and I've thought about using a cheap plant sprayer but without the proper spray equipment it's hard to spray inside frames/body panels. It's only good as a basic surface spray. To really get inside the frame/panels nicely you need a high pressure sprayer with an atomizing nozzle sized for the viscosity of the fluid you intend on pumping.
It'd no doubt be better with a high pressure sprayer, but I don't think the plant sprayer is quite as bad as you state above. For inside box sections I set it to squirt as a single jet rather than as a mist, and point it at the top of the section. It splashes/sprays on impact, drains down, and then creeps, so I think the coverage is probably fairly good, though without an endoscope its impossible to be sure.
For door panels etc I've just taken the door card off.
I bought some linseed oil in Australia (can't get it here AFAIK) but have only used it on topsides rust so far.
I have an idea for spraying thicker stuff but havn't tried it yet.
Originally Posted By: Ducked
I don't have any spray equipment, so I use a plant sprayer. This means I have to use a thin mix, which probably leaves less long-term residue. OTOH it may be more penetrative, which may be more important. It does seem to creep along seams quite well.
How is that working out for you? I'm in the same boat as you and I've thought about using a cheap plant sprayer but without the proper spray equipment it's hard to spray inside frames/body panels. It's only good as a basic surface spray. To really get inside the frame/panels nicely you need a high pressure sprayer with an atomizing nozzle sized for the viscosity of the fluid you intend on pumping.
It'd no doubt be better with a high pressure sprayer, but I don't think the plant sprayer is quite as bad as you state above. For inside box sections I set it to squirt as a single jet rather than as a mist, and point it at the top of the section. It splashes/sprays on impact, drains down, and then creeps, so I think the coverage is probably fairly good, though without an endoscope its impossible to be sure.
For door panels etc I've just taken the door card off.
I bought some linseed oil in Australia (can't get it here AFAIK) but have only used it on topsides rust so far.
I have an idea for spraying thicker stuff but havn't tried it yet.
The idea with the linseed oil (and the sunflower oil that I use) is that it sets, forming a varnish-like coating. I suspect the motor oil in the mix slows, and perhaps limits this. I used to think a hard coating was probably a bad thing, but now I'm not so sure. I might try leaving the motor oil out next time around.
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