2 stroke oil in diesel

[dirtydannyd]

I read on another forum (pradopoint specifically for the 3.0 1kdftv d4d engine) that people put a little but of mineral 2 stroke oil into the diesel to prolong engine life.

Something to do with low sulphur fuels?

Thought that if there was any merit to it, this would be the place to discuss it.

 

[rideahorse]

The diesel pickup guys have been running 1 oz to 10 gal for years to help with the low sulfur diesel to help with the lubrication. On a 6.0 ford you can't believe how much it quiets down the injectors.

 

[dirtydannyd]

Interesting. So benefits are increased lubrication.
Are there any risks in doing so with a common rail direct injection turbo diesel?

 

[demarpaint]

Here's a recent thread that was interesting.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/4131833/Searchpage/1/Main/255012/Words/tcw3/Search/true/Re:_Diesel_/_TCW3:_Anyone_else#Post4131833

 

[Chris142]

I run about 1oz of 2 stroke oil per gallon of fuel

 

[bullwinkle]

It's good for diesels that use rotary injection pumps to improve lubricity, the jury is out on CR diesels that were designed with ULSD in mind. Can't believe it would hurt, though.

 

[roadrunner1]

With a modern diesel with the full compliment of emission equipment adding anything but a high quality diesel fuel additive would scare the heck out of me.

Remember the old tv commercial, you can pay me now or pay me later???

I have an '89 Ford IDI (7.3) that has had nothing but Deere diesel fuel additive added since new, still original pump/injectors.

 

[dirtydannyd]

Originally Posted By: roadrunner1
With a modern diesel with the full compliment of emission equipment adding anything but a high quality diesel fuel additive would scare the heck out of me.

Remember the old tv commercial, you can pay me now or pay me later???

I have an '89 Ford IDI (7.3) that has had nothing but Deere diesel fuel additive added since new, still original pump/injectors.


Yeah. Fair enough.

Personally, my car does not have a DFP and it has had the EGR removed/blocked off.

We are known here in Australia to have pretty low quality fuel so I might give it a shot. From the link that demarpaint posted, looks like 200:1 is an acceptable ratio with someone else using 400:1.

It will be a while before I can post my observations as the Prado takes 180 litres and isn't ysed every day.

 

[clinebarger]

Everyone in the diesel community freaked out when LSD Fuel came out & again when ULSD Fuel came out......It was & still is blown way out of proportion. From what I've seen Pumps & Injectors didn't fail in any greater quantity than before.

Think of all the Fleet trucks out there that NEVER get any additives added to the Fuel Tank?? ULSD came out a few months after I bought my '06 Duramax, I have never ran an additive......350,000 miles later & still have all original Injectors & Pump.
Clean, Water Free Fuel is all most Diesel Injection systems need, Not going too argue HEUI Injectors needing additive on the Fuel side, Because additive sure helps them on the Oil side.

 

[Donald]

If you have an older diesel engine with a mechanical injector pump (Bosch VP44) then 1 oz/gallon will make sure there is enough lubrication in the fuel in case someone along the way did not blend the diesel fuel properly with enough lubricant to make up for the sulfur that has been removed.

 

[dirtydannyd]

Had a bit more of a look on the internet and there seem to be varying opinions about this.

I did come across this which refers to the Toyota D4D engines http://www.baileysdiesel.com/on-highway/...n-rail-engines/

I also wanted to ask about any special 'specs' to look for or steer clear of? This article says 'mineral' but doing a quick search for mineral 2 stroke, there seem to be a lot of specs. I did post on the other thread asking what TCW3 was.

 

[Shannow]

TCW3 is outboard two stroke and "ashless", so it doesn't generate metallic ash deposits during combustion. typical air cooled "racing" two strokes, while sounding flash, have the possibility of causing these deposits.

I wait until the Valvoline semi synthetic is on special at supercheap, and buy a big bottle at a time.

The link that you just posted makes sense.

I've read papers that indicate that friction modifiers in fuel make it to the region of the oil film around the top ring also, so may genuinely provide Upper Cylinder Lubrication.

Got a Navara with the ZD30, and have used a couple hundred ml religiously every tank full since new.

 

[Silk]

Originally Posted By: clinebarger
Everyone in the diesel community freaked out when LSD Fuel came out & again when ULSD Fuel came out......It was & still is blown way out of proportion. From what I've seen Pumps & Injectors didn't fail in any greater quantity than before.


When we went low sulphur injector pump seals started leaking, and in my shop we were doing 3 or 4 a week...once we had 3 in one day. I used to buy top cover gaskets for Kiki rotary pumps in packets of 10. This went on for several weeks...and then stopped completely.

 

[bullwinkle]

Originally Posted By: clinebarger
Everyone in the diesel community freaked out when LSD Fuel came out & again when ULSD Fuel came out......It was & still is blown way out of proportion. From what I've seen Pumps & Injectors didn't fail in any greater quantity than before.

Think of all the Fleet trucks out there that NEVER get any additives added to the Fuel Tank?? ULSD came out a few months after I bought my '06 Duramax, I have never ran an additive......350,000 miles later & still have all original Injectors & Pump.
Clean, Water Free Fuel is all most Diesel Injection systems need, Not going too argue HEUI Injectors needing additive on the Fuel side, Because additive sure helps them on the Oil side.
ULSD definitely caused fuel leaks-old non Viton fuel lines & seals would start seeping & leaking, I had several spring a leak on my old '82 300D that I had to replace. Stanadyne has recommended their additives for the IDI rotary IPs since ULSD was released-& TCW-3 2-stroke oil is a MUCH CHEAPER way to get similar HFRR results.

 

[clinebarger]

Originally Posted By: bullwinkle

ULSD definitely caused fuel leaks-old non Viton fuel lines & seals would start seeping & leaking, I had several spring a leak on my old '82 300D that I had to replace. Stanadyne has recommended their additives for the IDI rotary IPs since ULSD was released-& TCW-3 2-stroke oil is a MUCH CHEAPER way to get similar HFRR results.


Fair enough! I never really worked on car diesels just the diesels in 3/4 & 1 ton domestic trucks, Did they add something to ULSD that made seals fail, I have a hard time believing just the reduced sulfur content had that effect?

 

[BrocLuno]

Originally Posted By: clinebarger
Everyone in the diesel community freaked out when LSD Fuel came out & again when ULSD Fuel came out......It was & still is blown way out of proportion. From what I've seen Pumps & Injectors didn't fail in any greater quantity than before.

Think of all the Fleet trucks out there that NEVER get any additives added to the Fuel Tank?? ULSD came out a few months after I bought my '06 Duramax, I have never ran an additive......350,000 miles later & still have all original Injectors & Pump.
Clean, Water Free Fuel is all most Diesel Injection systems need, Not going too argue HEUI Injectors needing additive on the Fuel side, Because additive sure helps them on the Oil side.


You did not have a stock of pre-1989 diesel equipment... LSD tore through diesel pumps and systems across the board. Stationary engines, trucks, tractors - you name it. All had to be retrofitted as soon as they started running badly. And for some, that was like a week after the first delivery

 

[TiredTrucker]

I go thru over 20,000 gallons of diesel a year, minimum. I have watched all this fuss over LSD and ULSD since it came on. Some folks really have severely swollen paranoia glands. And the number of cocktail ideas that folks come up with to solve a problem than hasn't seemed to really materialize. Much of the diesel today is spiked with 2-5% biodiesel. It does not require labeling at the pump unless it is 5% or more. A simple 2% biodiesel blend will provide more actual lubricity than anything off the shelf. And it is included right at the pump at no extra charge.

Fleets, even with older equipment, have not experienced any more engine downtime than normal because of the LSD/ULSD game. Only equipment that the fuel systems and such were not properly maintained to begin with ever seemed to have any real trouble.

 

[Al]

Originally Posted By: Chris142
I run about 1oz of 2 stroke oil per gallon of fuel

That sounds about right. I run about that amount in my 4 cycle small engines.

 

[BrocLuno]

Well, within the first year of ULSD, we had gone through the pumps on all the White tractors, all the small cam Cummins, a couple of 3208's and one Case...

Neighbor is still doing pump replacements as he inherited his uncle's vineyard and all his old tractors. The uncle just bought another tractor when one quit. Now he has like 10 Hesston's (Fiat) that are slowly being brought back to life.

The Cat's on both ranches all lived through this mess. It's the others that had issues...

It was really dependent on the motor/pump design ...

 

[Jetronic]

Originally Posted By: TiredTrucker
I go thru over 20,000 gallons of diesel a year, minimum. I have watched all this fuss over LSD and ULSD since it came on. Some folks really have severely swollen paranoia glands. And the number of cocktail ideas that folks come up with to solve a problem than hasn't seemed to really materialize. Much of the diesel today is spiked with 2-5% biodiesel. It does not require labeling at the pump unless it is 5% or more. A simple 2% biodiesel blend will provide more actual lubricity than anything off the shelf. And it is included right at the pump at no extra charge.

Fleets, even with older equipment, have not experienced any more engine downtime than normal because of the LSD/ULSD game. Only equipment that the fuel systems and such were not properly maintained to begin with ever seemed to have any real trouble.


HD diesels aren't built to the same standards as passenger car diesels though. A common rail passenger car diesel operating on 520 µm wsd fuel is only rated for 120,000 miles, and at 460µm for 200,000 miles. Go down to 300µm and the injection equipment has near endless life (700,000 miles IIRC).