Gun Lube Oil Tests

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Originally Posted By: stchman

What mixes with water is the detergent in oil. Gear lubes, ATF, and engine oil all have detergents. It takes a lot of agitation to get the oil to mix in, but that is not really a concern.

Take engine oil ..mix with water and shake. It turns milky and stays milky. Do the same with atf and/or gear lube. It separates from the water and each turns clear.
 
Mil-Spec in my experience (in the military) is that it means nothing. Mil-Spec is generally simply what some bean-counter nerd sitting in a cubicle at HQ's ivory tower decided would be the "standard" for a particular product. It means it has to meet certain specifications, just like ISO, SAE, API, etc etc. Just because an oil is "SAE Spec" doesn't mean it's very good oil at all. What those "Mil" specifications are, I believe, are often misunderstood with what people believe to be very military attributes. Mil-Spec must mean it's tough, doesn't quit, works in adverse conditions, is long lasting, well engineered, works in combat blah blah blah.

In my experience, it's a specification made to meet political, policy and budget objectives. It does not mean it's the best product. It probably means it's cheap, standardized to work mediocre on many different things, is manufactured in the right part of the country to provide the right people jobs so the right politician is re-elected. Often, especially in aviation, Mil-Spec is far below the standard required for certification by the FAA, for example.

I will backup my observations with the fact that Special ops guys often do not use the normal issue, "Mil-Spec" stuff given to the troops. It's not good enough. They often buy exactly what they want, and it's not the mass-produced, Mil-Spec [censored].

Military history is chocked full of examples of junk equipment getting people killed and losing battles. All of it was "Mil-Spec" at some point.
 
Originally Posted By: Gannet167
Mil-Spec in my experience (in the military) is that it means nothing. Mil-Spec is generally simply what some bean-counter nerd sitting in a cubicle at HQ's ivory tower decided would be the "standard" for a particular product. It means it has to meet certain specifications, just like ISO, SAE, API, etc etc. Just because an oil is "SAE Spec" doesn't mean it's very good oil at all. What those "Mil" specifications are, I believe, are often misunderstood with what people believe to be very military attributes. Mil-Spec must mean it's tough, doesn't quit, works in adverse conditions, is long lasting, well engineered, works in combat blah blah blah.

In my experience, it's a specification made to meet political, policy and budget objectives. It does not mean it's the best product. It probably means it's cheap, standardized to work mediocre on many different things, is manufactured in the right part of the country to provide the right people jobs so the right politician is re-elected. Often, especially in aviation, Mil-Spec is far below the standard required for certification by the FAA, for example.

I will backup my observations with the fact that Special ops guys often do not use the normal issue, "Mil-Spec" stuff given to the troops. It's not good enough. They often buy exactly what they want, and it's not the mass-produced, Mil-Spec [censored].

Military history is chocked full of examples of junk equipment getting people killed and losing battles. All of it was "Mil-Spec" at some point.


I agree 100%. Very well said.
 
I have found that just wiping your guns down with a lite coat of the oil of your choice every 6 months keeps rust at bay and it only takes seconds. I use "CLP Collector" oil it is supposed to be excellent for long term storage. As far as operation I just use a little Rem oil and if I were shooting say an AR for many rounds and the gun was getting hot I would use a thicker oil. Years ago an Army buddy who saw lots of action said he used a mixture of motor oil and ATF as a lube and ATF and kerosene as a cleaner although I never asked him what the ratio was in either case??
 
Originally Posted By: Al
stchman said:
I have mentioned this before and got flack for it. But Engine oil mixes with water (absorbs). Neither ATF or Mobil 1 Gear Lube absorb water. I won't argue the point.
cheers3.gif



If you are SOOOO concerned about that moister in engine oil......then buy air compressor oil....

And IF you are one of those americans that want to go "thin" than try any air tool oil...

Cheaper than any "unicorn **** oil" for guns
wink.gif
 
Originally Posted By: Kamele0N


If you are SOOOO concerned about that moister in engine oil......then buy air compressor oil....

I don't use engine oil , I'm not worried
 
I'm just not buying into all of this moisture absorption by motor oil. How many engines have the blocks rusted on the inside because of moisture contained in the oil? I'm not saying it doesn't happen. It's just not anything to worry about. Unless of course you like to needlessly worry.
 
The best IMHO is Fluid Film....I use it on all my guns in fact it is the only treatment I use. Also use it on my hands so you know it will not hurt that pre-64 Winchester.I dumped a 12" AL boat and my M-19 went in the drink for 48 hours. When I finally did get it (8'of water) it was still perfect. Don't worry I did disassemble and gave it a cleaning.
 
Interesting that you mentioned G96... somewhere along the line, I'd guess 35 or 40 years ago I began using "G96 Triple Action Gun Treatment" with my firearms for light cleanup (bore, actions - including gas rings/tube in shotguns, etc., and particularly when a really nasty-to-use bore solvent like "Shooters Choice" wasn't warranted for bore), as well as exterior wipedown before placing back in cabinet or closet, etc. Rarely or never had any surface corrosion due to handling or otherwise. Still use it to this day for light cleanups/touchups of handguns and longarms, though I will use more thixotropic, heavier final lubes for rails, etc., as G96 is very low viscosity product, of course, due to its "triple-action" properties. Another interesting product I continue to use for firearms when I do need a more thixotropic, clingy property (though not heavy like the typical greases), is "Fluid Film" ("FF"). I'll clean up the weapon w/G96, removing excess, and finish with Fluid Film on exterior metals, polymers and wood (great for wood stocks, and doesn't degrade finishes... you can even use it on leather, unlike most petroleum based products... FF is not petroleum based, but derived from - believe it or not - sheep's wool), and then run a barely FF-dampened patch through the bore, plus the tiniest little amounts on rails, slides, connectors, etc., on (for instance) my Glocks. These two products, alone, can just about do everything in gun cleanup/pre-storage, except for perhaps removing heavy copper or lead fouling in a bore, which usually requires more caustic chemicals. (I do not believe in doing frequent heavy, caustic solvent bore cleaning when not needed.) If you let the G96 soak the bore for a while before brushing/patching, you'll remove most powder residue and even some of the copper fouling. I've used these procedures routinely "with nary a problem" for many a year, now. Thanks...
 
Originally Posted By: josie_wales
The best IMHO is Fluid Film....I use it on all my guns in fact it is the only treatment I use. Also use it on my hands so you know it will not hurt that pre-64 Winchester.I dumped a 12" AL boat and my M-19 went in the drink for 48 hours. When I finally did get it (8'of water) it was still perfect. Don't worry I did disassemble and gave it a cleaning.



See my post somewhere along here, too... I'd just mentioned Fluid Film, along with G96, and hadn't seen your post prior. Yes, I've used Fluid Film since earliest 1980's, to good effect. Great low-toxicity multi-use product. I don't even mind the peculiar odor.
 
Originally Posted By: OldNorthState
Interesting that you mentioned G96... somewhere along the line, I'd guess 35 or 40 years ago I began using "G96 Triple Action Gun Treatment" with my firearms for light cleanup (bore, actions - including gas rings/tube in shotguns, etc., and particularly when a really nasty-to-use bore solvent like "Shooters Choice" wasn't warranted for bore), as well as exterior wipedown before placing back in cabinet or closet, etc. Rarely or never had any surface corrosion due to handling or otherwise. Still use it to this day for light cleanups/touchups of handguns and longarms, though I will use more thixotropic, heavier final lubes for rails, etc., as G96 is very low viscosity product, of course, due to its "triple-action" properties. Another interesting product I continue to use for firearms when I do need a more thixotropic, clingy property (though not heavy like the typical greases), is "Fluid Film" ("FF"). I'll clean up the weapon w/G96, removing excess, and finish with Fluid Film on exterior metals, polymers and wood (great for wood stocks, and doesn't degrade finishes... you can even use it on leather, unlike most petroleum based products... FF is not petroleum based, but derived from - believe it or not - sheep's wool), and then run a barely FF-dampened patch through the bore, plus the tiniest little amounts on rails, slides, connectors, etc., on (for instance) my Glocks. These two products, alone, can just about do everything in gun cleanup/pre-storage, except for perhaps removing heavy copper or lead fouling in a bore, which usually requires more caustic chemicals. (I do not believe in doing frequent heavy, caustic solvent bore cleaning when not needed.) If you let the G96 soak the bore for a while before brushing/patching, you'll remove most powder residue and even some of the copper fouling. I've used these procedures routinely "with nary a problem" for many a year, now. Thanks...


FF is petroleum oil:
http://www.fluid-film.com/downloads/SDS_NAS.pdf
 
Originally Posted By: OldNorthState
These two products, alone, can just about do everything in gun cleanup/pre-storage, except for perhaps removing heavy copper or lead fouling in a bore, which usually requires more caustic chemicals. (I do not believe in doing frequent heavy, caustic solvent bore cleaning when not needed.)


You don't have to use "caustic chemicals" to remove copper fouling from a barrel. This products works far better, and will not harm a barrel, regardless of how long you leave it in. It actually has rust inhibitors in it.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/2093155799/bore-tech-eliminator-bore-cleaning-solvent-liquid
 
Originally Posted By: billt460
Originally Posted By: OldNorthState
These two products, alone, can just about do everything in gun cleanup/pre-storage, except for perhaps removing heavy copper or lead fouling in a bore, which usually requires more caustic chemicals. (I do not believe in doing frequent heavy, caustic solvent bore cleaning when not needed.)


You don't have to use "caustic chemicals" to remove copper fouling from a barrel. This products works far better, and will not harm a barrel, regardless of how long you leave it in. It actually has rust inhibitors in it.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/2093155799/bore-tech-eliminator-bore-cleaning-solvent-liquid



I've never had or felt a need to "de-copper" a bore. However, I'm happy with @ 1 MOA 10-shot groups, and use hammer forged barrels.
 
Originally Posted By: Ws6
I've never had or felt a need to "de-copper" a bore. However, I'm happy with @ 1 MOA 10-shot groups, and use hammer forged barrels.


That's immaterial. I'm merely stating you don't have to use Ammonia, or other caustic based solvents in order to do so. There are far better products out there for that task. Bore Tech Eliminator is one of them.
 
Good post Bill

Now try to convince millions that Hoppes #9 is so outdated these days. That's another product that's so yesteryear, caustic, toxic and lethal to breathe.

Gun oils are a different story. Seems most-all work fine and don't smell-up the house. I have a neighbor that-for the past 30 years, has used Marvel Mystery Oil on his weapons.

I cannot convince him to quit, for his guns look and operate like brand new. I use the best name-brand oils out there (currently Slip 2000EWL) and really not sure it's necessary.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: billt460
Originally Posted By: Ws6
I've never had or felt a need to "de-copper" a bore. However, I'm happy with @ 1 MOA 10-shot groups, and use hammer forged barrels.


That's immaterial. I'm merely stating you don't have to use Ammonia, or other caustic based solvents in order to do so. There are far better products out there for that task. Bore Tech Eliminator is one of them.


I've had good luck with the Foaming Bore Cleaners by whoever from Wal-Mart, back before I learned that de-coppering the bore of my M4 type rifle was pointless. I'd also caution against caustic stuff. Avoid it as much as you can.
 
Originally Posted By: Triple_Se7en
Good post Bill

Now try to convince millions that Hoppes #9 is so outdated these days. That's another product that's so yesteryear, caustic, toxic and lethal to breathe.

Gun oils are a different story. Seems most-all work fine and don't smell-up the house. I have a neighbor that-for the past 30 years, has used Marvel Mystery Oil on his weapons.

I cannot convince him to quit, for his guns look and operate like brand new. I use the best name-brand oils out there (currently Slip 2000EWL) and really not sure it's necessary.


I love SLIP 2000 EWL so far. The only product I have used that came close to making my suppressed weapons as fast and easy to clean was FIREClean, which performed VERY similarly, but over time would gum weapons up. This was unacceptable to me, and further, went against what Ed Sugg had told me when I discussed this with him. Those were two strikes against the product, and I dumped it for SLIP, after trying Lucas Extreme, WeaponShield, MPRO7 LPX, and others.
 
Originally Posted By: Triple_Se7en
Ws6

G96 Synthetic Oil is what I'll likely try next. The brand boasts of buildup retention and really slippery.

I tried it and found nothing special about it. SLIP 2000 EWL, and Fireclean are the only two products I have tried that I could say "Yeah...this is different" about.
 
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